belongs2Him,

They don't break it down because during the first couple of years people started asking questions. Later down the road they would announce if anyone wanted the break down to see the staff. However, when anyone asked, they would make you feel guilty or you would be rebuked. I learned that first hand!

Miki,

Wow. That's not the first time I heard about people being rebuked for asking questions, but I have to admit it still shocks me. I mean Jesus would have sat down and turned out His pockets if people asked Him about money! He wouldn't have rebuked them! I'm sorry you went through that. How demeaning.

After reading belongs2Him's post I did some research using the words "Church Audit Procedures" on Google. What I found in every article or website was the phrase "checks and balances." Which goes back to what we have all said -- accountability and transparency. I know the woman who does the bookkeeping for TPC and she is not the problem. She is an awesome woman of God. The problem is the budget and how the monetary assets of TPC are allocated to cover salaries and operating expences as well as the Stewardship Campaign money for the acquisition of real property. I really don't think an audit would find any problem in the bookkeeping end of TPC. I think if you brought in an independent budget analyst who is well versed in sound Church budgeting, they would probably say "are you kidding me!" So I think what everyone on the forum thinks is needed is an independent analysis of the budget and a reallocation of funds to correctly fund all ministries at appropriate levels and if that means cutting the top heavy salary column down to a level that is commensurate with area norms and raising salaries on the low side to living wages, well that would only be the right thing to do. The other problem is who has the power to reallocate funds after a budget has been presented and approved. The way it has been done is unacceptable. Two or three people who have accounting and budget experience need to be placed on a committee to oversee the budget and its funding levels. In my opinion that means no one who is currently an elder or deacon.

I would suggest starting with this article: [www.christianitytoday.com]

At the bottom there is a list of reading material on the subject of Church budgets and finance.

Daughter of Dorcas



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/05/2009 12:09PM by Daughter of Dorcas.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/05/2009 12:50PM by Northwest.

Can wait to hear your story Learning Point.

Hi Learningpoint,

I think M&M meant to say "can't" not can. LOL! Obviously, the time that you left TP was a traumatic time for you. It was a terrible time for my family and me, also. It has been over 2 years now that we have left and I can say that we have not fully recovered from the deception and loss of relationships that were once deemed vital to our life here in Marysville. I felt deceived by the very ones that I had trusted to be my pastors: Mike and Cyndi. If they had presented to us that TP was a "Word of Faith" church or one that taught the "Prosperity Gospel", we would have stayed away. But, TP was not that kind of church in the beginning. It became that way behind the closed doors of Mike and Cyndi's offices. The process was slow, then came SOMA--the breeding ground to indoctrinate the young, and naive and biblically illiterate. Then at the 10th anniversay celebration I was saddened as Mike and Cyndi were praised and hoisted up as demigods. I later learned that in the prosperity teaching there is the teaching that we can all be little gods or Jesuses. That is why Cyndi will never speak to her faults because in her eyes she has none and that goes for her husband as well. I weep deep inside whenever I hear that one more dear believer and his/her family have decided to finally leave TP because I know of the deep hurt that they carry with them.

LP Thank you for installment #1 I too have had those moments. My leaving was little like an Eaglet getting shoved out of the nest. When I was making my own plans to leave I was approached a couple of times from two (trusted) friends, one of them had been my friend for over 13 years. That person, my family and I invited to attend TP back in 2000. These two people turned on me and rebuked me when I would point to the scriptures when I didn't agree with what they were saying. Both are SOMA grads, I felt at the time they assumed they knew more than me. Their time at SOMA made them wiser then someone who has had a relationship with the Lord for over 20 years. I was brought to the point I doubted my knowledge of the Lord as I knew him. That is when I started to speak up about what the bible said vs. what they were saying. It took several months after the day I was told to LEAVE, to realize how much God's hand was involved in the whole situation. It has been over 2 years and just now I am connecting with this forum, which I sat back and read since Nov. Your hurt as well with those now leaving is understood, as we all continue to pray.

I leave you all with this today, I'm finding that scripture is helping me keep things in perspective and calm. Hope it does you!

Be still, and know that I am God; I will be exalted among the nations, I will be exalted in the earth! Psalm 46:10

Devotions: Keep listening fo the "still small voice" If you are weary on life's road; the Lord will make your heart rejoice If you will let Him take your load. - Hess TO TUNE IN TO GOD'S VOICE, WE MUST TUNE OUT THIS WORLD'S NOISE!!!

Quote
Miki
I leave you all with this today, I'm finding that scripture is helping me keep things in perspective and calm. Hope it does you!

Be still, and know that I am God; I will be exalted among the nations, I will be exalted in the earth! Psalm 46:10

Devotions: Keep listening fo the "still small voice" If you are weary on life's road; the Lord will make your heart rejoice If you will let Him take your load. - Hess TO TUNE IN TO GOD'S VOICE, WE MUST TUNE OUT THIS WORLD'S NOISE!!!

Miki,

Looks like we were reading the same devotion this morning.

Outreach

Can a church be sued for Spiritual Abuse?