What is the deal with Vineyard Churches? There seems to have been a lot of the same concerns with their practices and doctrine that have been voiced about Maranatha. I know that the cult leader of the Maranatha Inc I was involved with was a Vineyard "pastor". That was until the majrity of his congregation left... They also put a lot of emphasis on the music which within the context of everything else sounds like they would use it to set the mood for indoctrination.

Are you talking about a specific Vineyard church?

I recommend not lump-summing all Vineyard churches into your concerns. If the same principle were applied, we could then qualify every denomination as problematic based on one questionable church within it.

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claypot
Are you talking about a specific Vineyard church?

I recommend not lump-summing all Vineyard churches into your concerns. If the same principle were applied, we could then qualify every denomination as problematic based on one questionable church within it.

I heartily agree with Claypot. I have been a attendee of Vineyard Christian Fellowships for over 20 years. There are many of us who constantly examine what we are being taught and ask lots of questions (which we were taught by Vineyard pastors to do)...hence my subscibing to this website. We worry about heresy as much as the next person. But one of the things I have learned in this label is like the term "Bipolar", it has become a diagnosis too easy for some to give.

The Vineyard's repetative mistake is it's openness to God doing something different, then making people just sit in church each Sunday. One only need look at the things Jesus did to see God has a reputation for doing things we think is somehow different, yet in keeping with His nature, to understand how people could think this.

Sometimes this has been disasterous to their reputation. But they are more concerned for missing out on something God may be doing then whether other churches, like Calvary Chapel, approve of them.

Now look at Calvary Chapel. Even in their quest to be considered orthodoxically pure, they are being equated with "cults". The Bible tells us that division of "The Body" is a tool of the Devil just as false teaching is.

Walking the line of truth is not as simple as some would make it out to be. Even claiming to only believe in an error free Bible is no guarantee...which translation?

As for the music? Well that's kinda' what happens when you form a church with a large percentage of musicians in it.

i know vineyard leaders and pastors and i still have my doubts about the organization. part of their problem is that they are not very well grounded and a lot of their views are reactionary against the practices of the mainstream evangelical churches of old. i know of other independent charsmatic churches who didn't like the methods employed and went to the other side of the spectrum which was not good as they were too loose in their worship and practice and allowed a lot of sin to develope in their ranks.

I was a Vineyard worship pastor for many years. I found the Vineyard to be a well-balanced Pentecostal denomination. Many of the statements here on this forum are not based in fact but conjecture from someone’s viewpoint. I have been in Baptist churches that had "Problems" I know of Presbyterian churches that have problems. As long as man is a part of the church, there will be problems. Most of the problems stated in this post are not about the group as a whole. The Vineyard did have some problems in the late 80's and early 90's. John Wimber the (main leader of the Vineyard) himself disciplined the churches that were exhibiting strange behavior and sub sequentially dismissed from the association of Vineyard Churches.
Since the election of Rev. Bert Waggoner as the leader of the association of vineyard churches, there has been a substantial move to evangelical biblical orthodoxy. The churches that were a part of the extreme "outpouring" movement have joined other groups and the Vineyard continues to find their place in the body of Christ.


Dr. Mike Zulinke, PhD.
Ft. Lauderdale, FL

DrMikeZ:

As you point out John Wimber and the Vineyard have a troubled history of controvesy.

See [www.culteducation.com]

Wimber is mentioned in this article.

Wimber's "signs and wonders philosophy" was not considered "well-balanced" and was controversial. Wimber was himself a controversial figure.

Many offshoots of Wimber's Vineyard are likewise not mainstream and have been controversial.

See these "warning signs" [www.culteducation.com]

Jesus once said that you will know a tree by its fruit.

Two objective things to look for to avoid a potentially unsafe group would be meaningful accountablity and financial transparency.

Is the the pastor accountable to democratically elected church government?

Can he be fired by the board?

Is there a constitution and church bylaws that provide specifically for the regular election of church board members to fixed terms?

Are these mandated regualar elections by secret ballot cast by the general church membership?

How is the church financially transparent?

Is there an annually published budget distributed to all contributors, which reveals in deatail all salaries, compensation and expenses paid out from church funds?

Is that budget independently audited by a reputable outside accounting firm?

Does the church board vote upon and directly approve expenditures and manage the budget?

Without these safeguards the church may essentially be a dictatorship run by a pastor or a select group without meaningful accountabilty and transparency?

Rick A. Ross
The Cult Education Institute
www.culteducation.com
rickross@culteducation.com