I read on this site and another that when being a part of something like this for so long and then deciding to leave can be traumatic. I have good days and bad days. One of the main things that was described is a feeling of embarassment for allowing oneself to be deceived. Another that stood out was greiving for time that was lost; devoting so much of your life to something and then finally realizing that it was a lie.

These are just two of the things I am dealing with right now to varying degrees. Its very painful and lonely. When your only friends are in the church and you decide to leave you realize how isolated you've become. Its a wake up call. Reading and posting on this site and reading others has helped me so much. We are not alone. Its unfortunate that our experiences are what they are but by posting hopefully we can help someone else. Pay it forward.

Another website that has helped alot is [voiceofwarning.net]. I've seen some crazy things @ praise chaplel - and I would think to myself "is this really happening?"
its just too crazy. Well when I read this website there were so many simalarities between PC and CFM/PH it made me realize "yep - this is really happening."

Like I said "We can't make this stuff up."

Thanks for sharing your feelings silentnomore. That is exactly how I feel. I wasted so much of my life at praise chapel I got out at my mid 20's but I felt so old and alone. And then I would go through the thoughts that I was out of the will of God because I left and God could not use me. After I found this thread website I realized how wrong I was and that I was not alone. I have good days and bad days. I have days when I think about my old pastors and how much I love and miss them but how they want nothing to do with me because I am no longer part of the church. They acted like they were my parents and I think thats where I made my first mistake. I really did not have a good home environment my dad died and my mom really did not want anything to do with me. So to here them say they were there for me and act like they really cared it was nice to feel loved and welcomed. but like another poster posted earlier they play on your past experiences. I find myself reasoning in my head that they cant be that bad because they are reaching out to the community and helping the poor. But then the other half of me is torn because I think about how others will be treated if they get sick or dont go to church whenever the church is open and get in trouble. i REMEMBER i WAS ALWAYS GETTING IN TROUBLE. When I started using face book all of a sudden people from Praise Chapel wanted to be my friend, so I befriended them but then I felt myself beginning to get depressed more and more and missing them so I had to defriend them. I realized in order to move on I have to let go of them and the past. because if not I would just be stuck in the past wishing for a life that was full of abuse and lies. there are so many stories I can tell about the junk I have seen, I agree with the point about if you are not related to a person in leadership you are not important in the fellowship. I have seen so many people name drop to show that they are more important than regular people. Like oh yeah I am pastors so and so's daughter or whatever and all of a sudden those people are viewed as super important and anointed. I have to go thank you for helping in this healing process.

I'm glad you found this helpful. Its good you were able to get out in your 20's. I'm in my 40's and still working on forgiving myself for staying so long.

As time goes by the veil is continuing to be removed from my eyes. It can be staggering when you truly see what you were living and believing. These fellowships are counterfeits to the Gospel. They in no way represent the Mercy, Compassion, Forgiveness and Love that the Lord has for us.

"The world shall know you are my disciples by your love for one another."

We did not live this scripture in PC; people are not kind to one another very often. Its very competitive. I was guilty of this too. The conviction would come and I knew it wasn't right but you say to yourself "its just the way it is." No, its not. When we behave this way the Word is not in us.

Thank God for his mercy.

i found this thread on another website regarding potters house and praise - it illustrates what we're talking about perfectly:

[groups.yahoo.com]

its from 2008 but if you continue to follow the thread click next message at the bottom -the exact same "spin zone" is still alive and well today.

The more I think about my experience in PC and read extensively about CFM/PH and Foursquare; the more I am convinced that PC is a carbon copy of CFM/PH. And Foursquare (who spawned CFM/PH) have turned a blind eye to both from the beginning.

If you read the history of Foursquare (how it originated); what happened between them and Wayman Mitchell - its easy to see how all of this has evolved over the decades. Bottom line, its a huge multi-million dollar business; in that the few at the top of the pyramid live off the labor and financial support of the tiny multitudes in the name of the Gospel.

Shortly before Dr John Holland died he preached at PC Huntington Park. Who is Dr John Holland? He was the 3rd president of Foursquare after the founder and her son. Oh and the 3rd person who made the most impact on Larry Neville's life. Oh and the person who had was sent to confront Wayman Mitchell back in the day regarding the split from Foursquare. When he came to the church we were not told who he was in regards to Foursquare (wonder why?).

It has been documented that PC split from CFM/PH but I can say with certainty that our doctrine, services, outreach, ministry, and mentallity are one in the same; with exception of PC is not as strict about television watching and they are much more subtle in the rejection of people who do not follow the program. Other than these two things its the same.

Unfortunately, there are so many new people they don't have any idea of what I am talking about. The church history I grew up with has conveniently disappeared. The behaviour is still there but I will say they have just honed their skills of deception better.

I have read that CFM/PH has still used the Foursquare moniker for some of their churches and that people have complained to them regarding CFM/PH but to no avail. PC says we were not a part of CFM/PH but everything we do is the basically the same

I contend that Foursquare/CFM/PH/PC only split in name only - it was a business decision. It only makes them bigger. Its all propaganda.

silentnomore

great piece of history, and not all of it has disappeared we are still here telling the truth, they have to kill at least us, and I know there are so many more who are afraid to speak up. They have to kill all of us, to get rid of their bad history, but, we wont let them, we will tell the next generation about them right.

jeff

The last couple of days have been rough. I keep looking back and more things keep coming to me - one can't help but feel like a fool. There is the "Big Fellowship Picture" and the "Little Person Picture" mine of course is the little person. I have had alot of introspection lately - I guess I am getting to that point in my healing where I am able to see how I allowed this to become my life without getting too sick to my stomach. Still only able to handle small doses of it at a time.

I have been reading Escape from the Fellowship: Potters House and the simalarities to praise chapel are astounding. Especially regarding giving. It is the exact same doctrine to this day with the exact same outcome. The leaders at the top of the pyramid live a very cushy lifestyle while the people in the congregation aren't. If the right amount of money doesn't come in then a litany of sermonic rants are ushered forth telling them that they are robbing God or being disobedient. How they are allowing the current economic downturn to cloud their minds with fear and are told "this is now our famine." Its just unbelievable.

Its the exact same with ministry. You must give up everything and be faithful to your ministry or you are out of the will of God. So not only are you giving all of your time to the church for free you are also paying to be there and the second you can't do either one - trust me you will hear about it. The re-programming will begin again to reactivate the obedience factor. If that doesn't work then you become invisible but only after your name has been raked through the mud.

I spoke to someone still going and they asked me "aren't you afraid that they will say you left because of sin?" I would be more suprised if they didn't. I was reading about coercive persuasion on this website and also the about the mentality behind cult leaders and cults in general - they are all the same just different window dressing. There is a reason why the majority of the congregations in CFM/PH and PC always have and had such a large amount of young people. Without life experience they are just more gullible. As they grow and get older the programming starts to break down. The only ones that stay are the ones that have chosen it as a means of support and have become quite successful at it.

Several couples pastor because they could not get a job any other way or they have children from a previous marriage/relationship and do not want to pay child support. Some have not acknowledged these children at all. I'm not saying all just some. They know who they are.

I was reading on Slam the Door that if you are really good tither you can pretty much lead a double life that is pretty obvious to others and its just not an issue. Its exactly the same thing at praise chapel. There is an astounding rate of out of wedlock teen pregnancies in headship. But somehow that's ok; the amount of baby showers is amazing and often one baby can receive enough gifts to clothe an daycare.

I say to all the new people young and old take a look around you - all of this is just common sense. When you are giving your hard earned money but are still wondering how you are going to pay your bills but feel led to give to these people and churches anyway - know that the Lord would never want you to give and then have less than nothing yourself. Its not biblical.

i would like to clarify i meant there is an astounding rate of out of wedlock teen pregnancy amongst the offspring of headship at praise chapel and that it seems that its ok with much support given; however if its a teen mother who is not related to headship or one of the main families in the church the same response is not given

There are so many directions I could go for this post. But the one that presses me the most is: Please think about what you are doing before you give this so-called church your money to "win the lost." We were taught to tithe off of our gross and income tax money - well any money we may have received. Think about it, if you have a couple hundred people give or take and all the other churches doing that plus you are still supposed to give an additional offering plus give to missions/global harvest plus whatever new needs they announce - that's and incredible amount of money coming in and then with their tax exempt status - WHAT A RACKET.

A missionary was launched out of the HP congregation to Ethiopia and they announced they needed around $50,000 for an off-road vehicle so the missionary could get to isolated villages. They took 3 separate offerings just in that congregation. They also had a video they played across the fellowship before their offerings. Think about it, never once in the 3 offerings did they say how much they had already collected; just kept asking for more. Never announced that they had enough to purchase said vehicle. Wake up people.

Know that when they have a community outreach and take donations that the people in charge of it take the cream of the crop of what comes in before it is distributed. There is a church in East L.A. that is affiliated with praise chapel. The ex-pastors wife runs it and she runs it because her husband had a long time affair with the church secretary and had to step down. She is the queen of donations - she has made it a business - she knows all the ends and outs of acquiring donations from businesses, Habitat for Humanity and grants for low income people who qualify for housing. She helps her congregants apply for the loans and buy a house then uses her connections to receive donations of builing materials, lighting, and any thing else that they can use to improve the properties.

She has received professional grade appliances, high-end furniture and employs people from her church to run the food bank she set up. They eat gourmet lunches on their lunch breaks using the donated food received. pastor neville redecorated the churh offices at huntington park and used donations from this lady to furnish the offices. All the while preaching that the HP congregation is not giving enough.

If all of this doesn't sound like a huge conflict of interest I don't know what does.

Know that the pastors at the top do not have to work a secular job; travel at will, have the luxury of taking naps during the day and going to power lunches with other leaders. Maybe some of you should find out where they live and what their homes look like. And then compare that to your own circumstances. The money you are giving could be used to better your own life and your childrens. Look at the cars they are driving and the new motorcycles in the parking lot. Talk to them - some of their kids go to private schools.

I had a conversation with a pastor's wife @ a fellowship not long ago and she was lamenting how their house isn't big enough. She said they had given a contractor a 5figure some of money to add on the the home but alas the contractor disappeared with the entire amount of money. This pastor is the son of one of the founding members of the fellowship and it has been rumored that he would take money directly out of the offering baskets while it was being counted. Now how many of us are naive enough to believe that anyone would give a contractor the entire sum of money for a job before it was completed? Wake up people.

They preach that if you do not give you are robbing God and/or lacking faith and/or will be cursed and/or not receive blessings. Well what about them? Where's their faith when the offerings aren't up to par? If they were truly giving the way they ask the congregations to give why aren't they blessed instead of having to brow beat everyone when they feel enough money isn't coming.

Not long ago pastor neville took an offering for a baby church that was several months behind in their rent and made an appeal for the HP congregation to bail them out - we are always told that we support the baby churches - well if we already were why were they behind in their rent? Why would leadership let it get to several months behind? Wake up people.

To the congregations - take care of your families, invest in your childrens' future, save your money, find legitimate ways to help those in need. Serve God because you love him not out of fear of being cursed. Read your Bibles and know what the Word says for yourselves. Do not give these people free reign to invade your lives/minds and make their life's goals and visions yours; establish your own. We fall prey to these groups, churches, and cults because we are vulnerable and they can smell it from a mile away.

When you don't know what to do with your life and do not guard your heart and mind know that there are people standing by waiting to fill your void for their own gain/agenda. When you don't know what to do about anything - STOP, take a deep breath and think it through before you find yourself in a situation that can take over your life and identity.

I remember reading on several sights that when you decide to leave the fellowship be prepared to lose all your friends. Well, its true. But were they ever really your friends in the first place if your relationship was solely based on where you attend church? Its funny, if you didn't attend as much as they thought you should or be in ministry you were not considered faithful. When you did show up they would ignore you or you would hear about how they felt you weren't faithul, loyal or committed enough.

So if you really think about it - you really didn't have any friends to begin with. If a relationship is solely based on what you can give or provide to a person, group or cause; is that friendship or a business transaction?

Now in the beginning - you are getting reciprocation - "love bombing" - alot of attention and invitations. Its all very gratifying. If you were lonely to begin with and you "get saved" and all sudden someone looks interested in you and tells you they love you - its pretty hard to resist. Especially if you are young and naive or have had a traumatic life and are looking for a place to belong. It all seems so wonderful and innocent; but what I want to convey is that this is not normal.

If you are spilling your guts and giving people the details of your life within a few minutes of meeting someone because of responding to an altar call that is suffused with mind altering music where you end up on your hands and knees in front of a church of people that you don't know - I would say that you are pretty vulnerable and highly suggestible to begin with. I know this is hard to hear because for alot of christians this is how we got saved but is getting saved like this really the way it should be?

This is the blueprint of initiation in praise chapel, cfm/ph and many other churches and it lays the ground work for the rest of your experience in these fellowships. Think about it, from the very beginning you are placed in a place of summission to something you know absolutely about because they use the Bible to lower your defenses and you are probably not in such a great place to begin with. Is this Salvation through Christ or initiation to the fellowship?

This is just something to consider. I have been reading posts from years past and maybe at the time the posters thought no one was paying attention at the time. Maybe they weren't but I can tell you they have helped me tremendously. They were waiting to be found when I was ready to see them. If this website and others like it can keep vulnerable people from being taken advantage of then our unfortunate experiences are not in vain.