To exposed:

What's the matter? You can't intelligently respond to my last post? So you run around just trying to find something dirty on me? LOL
Truthtesty's last post

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"To Hitler:

A Mint Julep is made with Bourbon whiskey so it doesn't take much to get drunk. And obviously the comparison was made to show the hypocrisy of allowing alcohol into heaven but not the blood of Jesus.

exposed quote Quote:
Moreover, your diaper is full, and you make yourself odious.


This is a childish remark. And, No, that would be your errored document. Your no one to be calling anyone a slanderer, with your false errored document. You say your document is more comprehensive than Dr. Wall's? LOL I found an error in your document within 5 minutes. 1st the author of a document needs to be able to comprehend and that would not be you. Obviously, you did not even carefully read Chafer's Systematic Theology. Just saying you "own" Chafer's 8 volumes, doesn't mean anything if you didn't actually read them carefully. You have no detailed study on the doctrine of the blood. You have no concept of the vast distinctions between Thieme and Chafer, let alone other "Thieme and other Protestants". Your errored document is only 39 pages while Dr. Wall's dissertation is over 185 pages. You say Dr. Wall cannot be objective because of his close associations with Thieme? Dr. Wall at least knew the difference between Thieme and Chafer, and you have already shown an error.

Don't you have a Ayran Neo-nazi sado-masochistic session to attend? This cult forum website is for those recovering from Thieme's cult, not for those who agree with Thieme's perversions and want to add thier own perverted Aryan twisted ideology to Thieme's perversion. It's probable that your name will be up here on Rick Ross very soon.

77251 is Thieme's zip code - same as your puke site.



Truthtesty

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This character has no business -- other than the working of evil -- in any forum or other activity of Christians.

That is your unqualified opinion. This character? - hah - like your any judge of character. Evil? Why don't you tell us about the EVIL of your Neo-Nazi Aryan S&M parties? In any forum? This is a cult forum - [b:c0fa2dffd6]everyone[/b:c0fa2dffd6] who has been abused by Thieme is welcomed and allowed to speak here. If you don't like it because you agree with some of Thieme's heresies, and you don't like Thieme's and your heresy being exposed to the Truth, then too bad.

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I suspect he/she is a Christ-hating unregenerate Jew.

aaaaaaaaaahh! oh my gosh run for your lives!!!!!!!!

You suspect? No one cares and no one asked you. It is you who is pretentious about who you are and what you motives are. Your trying to viper off confused Thiemites from Thieme's cult into your own perverted Thiemite/Ayran cult. You agree with Thieme's deviation from Chafer's teaching on the "Blood of Christ", which as I already said Chafer WOULD CONSIDER THIEME'S TEACHING AND YOUR VIPERING OFF OF THIEME'S TEACHINGS, SATANIC. "

[b:c0fa2dffd6]DTS doctrinal statement ART III[/b:c0fa2dffd6]

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We believe that Satan is the originator of sin, and that, under the permission of God, he, through subtlety, led our first parents into transgression, thereby accomplishing their moral fall and subjecting them and their posterity to his own power; that he is the enemy of God and the people of God, opposing and exalting himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped; and that he who in the beginning said, “I will be like the most High,” in his warfare appears as an angel of light, even counterfeiting the works of God by fostering religious movements and [u:c0fa2dffd6][i:c0fa2dffd6][b:c0fa2dffd6]systems of doctrine, which systems in every case are characterized by a denial of the efficacy of the blood of Christ [/b:c0fa2dffd6][/i:c0fa2dffd6][/u:c0fa2dffd6]and of salvation by grace alone (Gen. 3:1–19; Rom. 5:12–14; 2 Cor. 4:3–4; 11:13–15; Eph. 6:10–12; 2 Thess. 2:4; 1 Tim. 4:1–3).

[www.dts.edu]

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Further discourse with this despicable creature should be avioided.

Those whip marks on you are despicable. Where is the big title page to your Ayran website? You know the one that says "WELCOME TO AYRAN NAZI CHRISTIANITY - BRINGS YOUR WHIPS AND WE WILL ALL HAVE FUN!" You go around pointing the finger at everyone else, but it is [u:c0fa2dffd6][b:c0fa2dffd6]YOU WHO IS A FALSE TEACHER[/b:c0fa2dffd6][/u:c0fa2dffd6]. With all your finger pointing, you hope no one could see through YOU and Thieme's false teaching on the blood. YOU FINGERPOINT AT OTHERS, WITHOUT A MENTION OF HOW CHAFER TAUGHT THAT THE LITERAL BLOOD OF CHRIST WAS EFFICACIOUS. You didn't mention that point at all. With the few minor pitiful distinctions you did make between Chafer and Thieme, you past right over Chafer and Thieme's [b:c0fa2dffd6]MAJOR [/b:c0fa2dffd6]disagreement on the Blood.


Do you really think Jesus is afraid of me? Do you really think Jesus is going to let down his sheep, because of what I believe? EVEN IF I WERE SATAN HIMSELF DO YOU THINK JESUS WOULD LET DOWN HIS SHEEP?

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Only a fool plays around with a viper.

If this is what you really believe(hypocrite), then why do you keep playing the fool?



To the Forum (minus exposed):

Maybe I am just a normal human being looking for what the real truth is in the bible. After Thieme's psycotic "menticide" warfare, I think I deserve the right to judge what christianity is, before making a committment. (And knock off a few false teachers along the way)




Truthtesty

Zams--

Thieme's mother probably did receive some inheritance upon her father's death in 1928. In 1929, Thieme's grandfather Frederick was reported to have left Indiana to join his son RBT Sr. in Beverly Hills. However, any inheritance would have to have been shared by Thieme's mother, a brother by a 2nd wife, and his 3rd wife and 2 young children.

Thieme's grandfather (superintendent of the Wayne Knitting Mills) wrote in his will that he had given his son Robert Sr. and daughter Martha financial support in the purchasing or furnishing of their homes. When he died in 1937 he left his entire estate of $60,000 to his wife. Bob Thieme was a freshman at the University of Arizona at the time. His family had already left their rental home in Beverly Hills before this time and were living in a triplex in Beverly Hills. When Thieme's father filed for divorce from his mother 2 years later he listed their community property as consisting of "automobiles, furniture and fixtures, linens, rugs and silverware, and no other property." His father married again 6 months after his divorce was final and moved to a large apartment building in L.A. I'm sure his father probably made a decent living as a water purifier salesman, but there could be no mistaking the fact that he was not wealthy. When Thieme said that his father disinherited him when he decided to become a pastor he led people to believe he gave up a large sum of money to serve God. After all, he repeatedly told stories of a priviledged life in Beverly Hills. This is the impression all those in his ministry I have spoken to have. He was lying about that because his father really didn't have much to leave him and he knew that.

You mention that C.G. Hunt's book is an unauthorized biography. A true biography is neither pro nor con the subject. It should not need the authorization or approval of anyone, because it should be as accurate and unbiased a rendering of the facts as possible. It should present all the facts-- those that are complimentary toward the subject and those that are not. After all, the Bible presents the whole story of men such as David, who had great virtues and great flaws. Hunt says in his Introduction, "Extreme care has been taken with this biography to record an accurate rendering of past events. That is why no interviews were conducted to gain factual information concerning Bob Thieme, and all information was taken from documents that are a matter of public record."

Personal interviews would only lead to misinformation in my point of view. You could interview a long time "taper" and his account would elevate Thieme to the position of the 2nd Apostle Paul. Or you could interview someone who left his ministry who would consider him to be the antichrist. I think Hunt tried to be as objective as possible. What he uncovered just happened to contradict over and over again what Thieme had told his supporters.

I did not notice any assumptions in the book, and all speculations are clearly stated as such. The reader is simply presented with likely possibilities. They are never stated as fact.

Expositor, your still here? You do realize that Rick Ross is a JEW right? Maybe you need to go clean your fingers our something, posting on a board owned by a JEW? Do your friends know?


You are a fool.

And yes, Jesus will deal with me, I'm looking forward to it.

Dang Testy, didn't know you were a Jew, can I be one too?

Dear Brothers and Sisters:

I realize that I am new to this forum, having found it less than a week ago. I am growing increasingly alarmed that others who come here in search of healing after being under the mental and spiritual bootheel of Thieme will instead see this forum as a place for hatred and namecalling among those who post. So I beseech you, don't give them the impression that this is what ex-Berachans become.

It is easy to see that there are issues that are important to some. The answer to these arguments is simple: Clear your mind of whatever men have said or written or taught, go to God's Word, and ask the Holy Spirit to enlighten you.

I find few things more fulfilling than Paul's exhortation to 'redeem the time' - to realize that He is coming for us, and that we must be ready at any time; to believe that through death or Rapture, this could well be our last day on earth, and we have precious little time to do His bidding; to seize each day with joy and gladness, starting each morning determined to serve the Lord.

I have come to see that during my time at Berachah, there was no real difference between me and those who were not saved. Like so many other Thiemeites, I was more focused on my heavenly plantation than I was in doing what Christ commanded me to do here on earth. I could not have cared less about loving my fellow man or seeking to serve the Lord.

As believers, as new men and women washed in the Blood of the Lamb, others should detect an immediate difference in us, even if they're just standing in line behind us at the store. There should be such peace and comfort within us that they are struck with the notion "WHATEVER THAT IS, I WANT IT" - a light shining before all men, the joyful certainty that He is with us always, that we should not fear what man can do to us, and that we have an eternal home awaiting us. In other words, they shouldn't be surprised when we say, "I'm a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ."

[b:c98cf9ab5e]"Jesus said unto him, 'Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." [/color:c98cf9ab5e][/b:c98cf9ab5e](Matthew 22:37-39)

[b:c98cf9ab5e]"Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do; and the God of peace shall be with you." [/b:c98cf9ab5e] (Paul's letter to the Philippians, 4:8-9)

mile2,

The one thing to remember is the effect the Great Depression had not only on the Thieme family, but the entire country, and this is the piece of the puzzle you keep leaving out. Regardless of where their money initially came from, it is very clear the Thieme family was extremely wealthy when RBT Jr. was a young boy and pre-teen. This was a very nice home on Rodeo in Beverly Hills in the years just following the crash. You could simply not afford this kind of house and lifestyle during this time period without being wealthy or having access to wealth. There is no reason at all to believe Thieme was lying about his upbringing. It's obvious things changed as the depression wore on over the next 10 years. We also don't know how much money Thieme's father had waiting as an inheritance. This money could have been passed on to his daughter or something of that manner during his final days, and by the time he passed there was nothing really there to go through probate. Also, having a modest house is no indication of what you might have in savings. At this point aren't we kind of speculating and "gossiping" about things we really have no idea about? Calling people liars without knowing the full story? This kind of thing is extremely dangerous.

Hunt's book does a great job of compiling available public records, and that's it. It's a great work of compilation and public records research. I'm not inferring that he should have interviewed "tapers", simply that when you have evidence from public records, interviews are extremely helpful as either corroboration or explaining why something isn't accurate. You have to piece together everything, like a detective, to get a complete picture. Dectective don't just compile public information, they interview witnesses, as many as they can. They compare stories, they weed out what might be true and what might be false. They spend a lot of time thinking things through and trying to get to the real truth. There is so much information that is lacking and innacurrate in public records and, especially, newspaper articles (don't we all know that's the truth) that you really need to dig deeper for clarification. Hun't books is interesting and fills in a lot of gaps, but as a biography, it's a poor piece of work.

To KcJones:

I am a Truthseeker.

Summarizing, what I know of being Jewish, is that they do not believe in heaven or hell. They just believe when people die, people are either closer or further from God. People do not have to be Jewish, to be closer or further from God when they die, they can be of any faith. The Jewish system is based on people's behaviour.


Truthtesty

mile2 quote

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Personal interviews would only lead to misinformation in my point of view. You could interview a long time "taper" and his account would elevate Thieme to the position of the 2nd Apostle Paul. Or you could interview someone who left his ministry who would consider him to be the antichrist. I think Hunt tried to be as objective as possible. What he uncovered just happened to contradict over and over again what Thieme had told his supporters.

mile2, I agree. The various prejudiced opinions that an interviewer would be as wide and varied as the colors of rainbow. With Thieme keeping a vice grip control over his personal information, an objective investigator like Hunt is left in reality with no other option than public records(of all sorts). If I am not mistaken, in one instance he did interview a theological staff member at Dallas Theological Seminary.


zams, are you really trying to keep an open mind? Or are you just "overseeding with doubt"? It seems that for the part, public records are accurate. I mean this is the USA, not some poor 4th world nation, that inscribes historical events on cave walls.


Truthtesty

Truthtesty,

I [i:77111e9b20]always[/i:77111e9b20] try to keep an open mind. This is because information gets slanted based on one's agenda. especially in political and religious circles. Just listen to conservative talk radio as an example of this. I'm not implying that the records in Hunt's book are innaccurate; they are probably mostly accurate. But where a discrepency arises between a public record or a newspaper article, and what someone says, the only way to get clarity is with further research. Again, this is just good detective work.

In Christ,
Zams

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Posted: 09-09-2007 07:09 AM Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Brothers and Sisters:

I realize that I am new to this forum, having found it less than a week ago. I am growing increasingly alarmed that others who come here in search of healing after being under the mental and spiritual bootheel of Thieme will instead see this forum as a place for hatred and namecalling among those who post. So I beseech you, don't give them the impression that this is what ex-Berachans become.

It is easy to see that there are issues that are important to some. The answer to these arguments is simple: Clear your mind of whatever men have said or written or taught, go to God's Word, and ask the Holy Spirit to enlighten you.

I find few things more fulfilling than Paul's exhortation to 'redeem the time' - to realize that He is coming for us, and that we must be ready at any time; to believe that through death or Rapture, this could well be our last day on earth, and we have precious little time to do His bidding; to seize each day with joy and gladness, starting each morning determined to serve the Lord.

I have come to see that during my time at Berachah, there was no real difference between me and those who were not saved. Like so many other Thiemeites, I was more focused on my heavenly plantation than I was in doing what Christ commanded me to do here on earth. I could not have cared less about loving my fellow man or seeking to serve the Lord.

As believers, as new men and women washed in the Blood of the Lamb, others should detect an immediate difference in us, even if they're just standing in line behind us at the store. There should be such peace and comfort within us that they are struck with the notion "WHATEVER THAT IS, I WANT IT" - a light shining before all men, the joyful certainty that He is with us always, that we should not fear what man can do to us, and that we have an eternal home awaiting us. In other words, they shouldn't be surprised when we say, "I'm a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ."

"Jesus said unto him, 'Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." (Matthew 22:37-39)

"Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do; and the God of peace shall be with you." (Paul's letter to the Philippians, 4:8-9)

Thank you, Juker
And a big AMEN to everything you said!!![/size:3990886218]

truthlover

Hello everyone. I'm a 19 year old female and I just joined after reading some of these discussions. (Brace yourselves because this post has nothing of substance other than to describe my recent questioning of these principles.)

I have been raised on what I've come to refer to as "Bible Doctrine," under Colonel Thieme, and that's all I've ever known. It hasn't been until recently, in the past year really, that I've stepped back and realized that I associate my salvation with doing everything the Colonel says, not even the Bible, but the Colonel. I haven't come to question my faith, I am a Christian and I believe in God, Christ's death, and salvation through Christ with all that I am. But recently it's as though a window has opened in my mind and I've realized I can't back up anything I believe in, even to myself, other than it's what I learned from the Colonel. I think he is a good man and has many many great principles, but surely only what he says is okay is not what I should base my entire faith upon. And like many of you have said, when questioned about the fact that I am in a cult-like organization, I usually find myself thinking "well, person, surely you must not truly understand the Bible. Poor soul."
I even find myself feeling guilty by coming to this site and making this post. Not guilt as if I might be blaspheming or sinning, but guilt because I have always been taught not to question what Col Thieme says. I'm a naturally analytical and curious person, and not one to typically accept something "just because it's so." So I believe that in the back of my mind this questioning of his authority has been building up, yet supressed because of the emphasis of his word being final in my upbringing. I'm not from Texas, but visited the church several times with my parents over the years. Occasionally I'd find myself surprised by something he said or some rule he has that seemed off-the-wall, and once I even made a half-joking comment to my mother about I hope I wouldn't be excommunicated from the church because heaven forbid I broke one of their rules... It was as though I had questioned the existence of God himself. She didn't take it well.
Needless to say, I've decided my parents aren't the most unbiased people to discuss my sudden crisis with. But like I said, I'm very new to open my eyes to the fact that this just maybe isn't the absolute set-in-stone truth. I'm still figuring it out, and trying to decide where to go from here.

I suppose to sum up what I've been trying to say... This is all I know. If and when any of you first began to question some of his teachings after learning only that your entire life, where did you go? Where did you start, how did you come to a place that you felt good about, and did you have to learn to separate a few of the Colonel's oddities from God's word?