I can't say for sure if VO qualifies as a cult. I see nothing wrong with considering the testimonies of ex-members on this site, but they may also have to be taken with a grain of salt, in some instances. It's always hard to calculate and prove the veracity of their claimed experiences, without good proof.

For myself, I was involved with VO for about a year or so, and didn't have any bad experiences with them. But then again, I was just a member of the church and was never a recovering addict who stayed in the homes. I don't know anything about Sonny or the higher ups, but I don't recall him being praised more than Jesus; though they did put a lot of emphasis on discipleship. For example, if a local Pastor John was the disciple of a Pastor Jim in San Jose, who was the disciple of a Pastor Alex in Los Angeles, who was the direct disciple of Pastor Sonny Arguinzoni, then they would make a reference to it quite a bit. It wasn't uncommon for someone in leadership to branch out into a new city, after they've been discipled by the pastor who originally took them in from the streets. And so that person would always have an affection for their original pastor, even though they've branched out.

I would have to agree with other people here that some VO's appear to have done good things. The main one here in Dallas appeared to be under good leadership by the Sr. pastor, who is a very good man. But I did hear other stories about smaller VO's in the DFW area that didn't fare too well and were under questionable leadership. This was the word within the VO congregation itself; so they didn't appear to try and cover it up or anything.

It was my observation that the turnover rate for the recovery homes were pretty high, even among the home directors. I would see one home director stay for about a year or so, before being replaced by another for a short time, and so on. It appeared that life in the home was not easy, mainly because so much was given up, even by the leaders. They didn't exactly live in a life of luxury, and it's not easy coexisting with other people, many of who are recovering addicts. The only fundraiser I witnessed here in Dallas, to support the home, were the car washes. But everyone did keep busy from dusk until dawn, in order to get them adjusted back into routine. Sort of like a spiritual boot camp. It wasn't uncommon for them to take turns cooking for the other members of the home, in order to humble themselves and serve each other. It must be kept in mind that many of these addicts are from the street and are accustomed to living however they please, with no rules, responsibilities, or regulations. They come in wanting things on their terms, which is why so many of them leave, once they realize the work involved, especially when they start craving drugs. So keeping them occupied had its benefits, for those who stuck it out. I did witness quite a few people turn their lives around and become productive citizens once they left the home and stayed with the church. And I have to admit that they church members are closely knit in fellowship.

My only complaint is that the services were very long, sometimes too long. Many of the leadership are from the streets and are not formally educated, nor are they formally schooled in seminary. So this can cause problems in terms of doctrinal issues and biblical interpretation. And like most charismatic non-denominational type churches, there is a lot of emotion and shouting in their services. And my biggest complaint was that they would sometimes get on a kick where the services would come down too hard on people, in an indirect way. For example, if there was lots of infighting, bickering, or gossiping, the pastor would rebuke it in his sermons, sometimes in a harsh way. Those who got offended simple left.

But I didn't see any claims by the church that they were the only true church, like the Mormons or Jehovah Witnesses claim. Nor did they try to alienate members from their families. In that sense, I can't say they resembled a cult. But given the former background of some of the leaders and their lack of seminary training, it doesn't surprise me that some VO's would have serious problems in other locations around the country.

I have a friend who calls VO his home church. He lives in one of the men's houses. He is told who he can associate with. He is told who can call or visit with him. He said he was told he had to give up his cell phone. I don't know his Pastor, or the house leader, of the home he lives in. I do have concerns, as my friend, while he is 35 years in age, is only about 15 years old, mentally and emotionally. My friend has been sexually abused. I believe that he is vulnerable. He is constantly asking permission, and needs constant assurance that people like him. What I have heard about VO, has not been favorable. I am writing only my limited understanding.

I know it is. I have been a member of vo for over three years and my friends all tell me that what they are doing to me is "Cult" like behavior. At frist I didnt believe it but once I started to make a few changes in my walk with them I noticed the "Cult" style response. I started dating someone in the church but didn't ask permission to date them and I was nearly kicked out of the city. Even the person that I was dating was pushed out too. they took it harder than me because they have been with the church for more years than me. He was over used for his skills and talents as a labor of construction. working for free for many years. never being paid for his hard labor, and even thought they had pushed us out it didnt stop them from asking more of him and his talents. so like a sucker he helped them out for free for more than two weeks, builing the Pastor another room on his house, just to be kicked to the curb when he was done. He even paid out his pocket some of the cost for the new room.

I have had pastors wifes dog me as i walked into the church and not greet me. their responses when i asked them whats going on and why am i being treated that way was because "I was disobedient" not following the rules of the bible. I dont know where or what bible says we can not date, how do you know someone by watching them?

That was one of the things that happen...

When I first got to the church everyone loved me? or was it the money that I was making? once I lost my job I was not paying into the church much anymore and they stopped calling me to help with stuff even once I was going to do something as a fill in for another lady that just couldn't make it and she was told they didnt want me, even thou I am more skilled to do the job that she was going to do, they didn't need my help.

I had a lady call me after I left the church for six or seven months ask if I could bring something for an event that they were having. I started laughing and told her do you know that I have not attended vo for over six months, did you ever call me and ask how was i or where was i? now you are calling me to bring something to your event? I knew this lady and she knows me, its not like she was someone new to the church or should i say "Cult".

Months before that I was told that I couldn't have friends from the world in my life because they are of the world and would drag me down. I don't have those kind of worldly friends all my worldly friends are very successful people in life and just because they don't go to church dont mean they dont believe in God. Not one of my friends ever tried to influence me, they knew what I was doing and why I was doing it.

Always have to ask permission to do things with other people from the church.

Mens home director is JOKE. He is the biggest thief I have ever seen. I seen many things and know of many things he has done. even reported them but the only thing that was said is that God knows and will handle him. Ya but what about all the people he is ripping off. How about the men that are learning these ways from him? Are the men in a better place just because its a "Christian" home?

If you don't follow the rules you get weeded out. They will treat you like you are nothing until you leave, and then say you left because you were not in touch with God.

I hear that they just had an event that racked in something like $6000. and everything was donated to them to make that money and at the event they served carrots and celery sticks with some red drink to the guest, while the pastors were in the back eating BBQ ribs with all the fixings.

Is it true that your mortgage should be put aside? Your Mortgage didn't save you? God saved you. Yes God did save me, but he also whats me and my family to have a place to live just like the pastor has a place to live. I was pointed out by a friend that somewhere in the bible says, "a pastor is to be paid for his works but should own no property" I could of read it wrong. All the pastors own more than one home and are always asking for help to pay for stuff in the church.

Lots of people who are going to vo are poor, but give a lot. I really feel bad for those that are struggling with drug abuse issues and this is their only way out of that, I truly want to be part of church that is really out for GOD and not out for their pockets to get bigger. I want to serve people so bad that feel the pain in my teeth every time I see people in the need.

HI MY NAME IS DONNA QUINN AND I AM 25 YEARS OLD. I USED TO GO TO THE OUT CRY IN THE BARRIO OFF OF BUENA VISTA STREET IN SAN ANTONIO TX. HOW I FOUND OUT ABOUT THIS PLACE WAS THREW A FRIEND I USED TO WORK WITH SHE WAS A HOUSE MOM AT A DANCE CLUB I WORKED AT CALL THE PALACE MEN'S CLUB. I WAS A STRIPPER FOR 6 YEARS AND A MY HOLE LIFE I WAS ALWAYS SEARCHING FOR SOMETHING, I WAS A VERY BROKEN PERSON INSIDE TOO. WELL ONE I WENT TO THIS CHURCH BECUSE MY MARRIAGE WAS FALLING APART AND I WAS DONE WITH MY LIFE TRYING TO PLEASE EVERYONE BUT MYSELF. ANY WAYS THIS FRIEND OF MINE WOULD GO TO THIS CHURCH AND SHE WOULD TELL ME COME TO MY CHURCH ONE DAY AND I SAID YA YA ONE DAY! WELL THAT ONE DAY CAME. SO I WENT THERE ON A SUNDAY MORNING AND I GAVE MY LIFE TO THE LORD. I LIKED THE CHURCH SO I STARTTED GOING MORE AND MORE. I USED TO ASK THE LORD TO SAVE MY MARRIAGE, BUT I STARTED SEEING SOMEONE THERE AT THE CHURCH. I STARTTED SEEING THE PASTOR THERE HIS NAME IS JUBAL GARCIA, FEDDIE GARCIA IS SON. I WAS SEEING HIM FOR 3 MONTHS WHILE I WAS SEPERATED FROM MY HUSBAND. JUBAL NEW THE MY MARRIAGE WAS FALLING APART AND THAT I WAS A NEW BELIEVER. BUT GOD SPOKE TO ME AND TOLD ME TO GO BACK TO MY HUSBAND AND SO I DID. BUT I DIDNT WANT TOO, I WAS GOING TO DIVORCE MY HUSBAND AND MOVE ON WITH THIS GUY THAT WAS A PASTOR AND KNOWS THE WORD OF GOD. YES WE WHERE BOTH WRONG, BUT IF YOU KNOW THE WORD OF GOD AND KNOW THAT SOMEONE IS A NEW BELIEVER AND IS STILL MARRIED TO HER HUSBAND. WOULDNT YOU FEAR GOD AND KEEP GOD'S COMMANDMENTS? WELL WHEN I LEFT THIS PLACE IT WAS HARD FOR 2 MONTHS BECUSE I FELT LIKE IT WAS THE ONLY PLACE I CAN BE TO HAVE A RELASHIONSHIP WITH GOD, LIKE I FELT LIKE I WAS COMING OFF A DRUG AND NEED TO GO BACK TO THAT PLACE AND THAT, THAT'S WHERE I NEED TO BE AND NO WHERE ELSA. BUT THAT IS WHAT A CULT DOSE TO YOU. BRAINWASHES YOU! THAT CHURCH DOSE NOT HAVE THE WORD OF GOD IN THERE. YOU ARE NOT SERVING GOD THERE YOUR SERVING THEM. THE OUTCRY, THEY TAKE BROKEN PEOPLE IN AND USE THEM. YOU BECOME A SLAVE TO THEM. THAT IS NOT OF GOD! SO PEOPLE WAKE UP AND GET OUT OF THERE WHILE YOU STILL CAN. REMOVE YOUR SELF FROM THERE. GOD HAS BLESSED ME WHEN HE TOLD ME TO GO BACK TO MY HUSBAND AND I OBAYED HIM EVEN THOW I ARGUE WITH GOD, BUT GOD ALWAYS WINS. GOD TOUCHED ME IN MY OWN LIVING ROOM AND FILLED ME WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT ON JAN. 2011 ON A TUSEDAY NIGHT AT 9:30PM SO PLEASE FINE A GOOD CHURCH THAT YOUR SPIRIT CAN GROW IN, NOT BE USED AND ABUSED!

Donna Quinn

Donnasa9:

Please don't type in all caps.

I can absolutely relate to all of you. In my case God’s grace was upon me when I entered the ministry of Victory Outreach. The Holy Spirit directed me through the gift of discernment. I was able to see right through the pastor and leaders in that ministry. I experienced the same situations and actions of the leadership as many of you did. I was in that ministry for two years and for two years God was revealing to me their heart and false doctrine that was being taught. I am now in a good Bible teaching ministry that’s reaching the world for Jesus. I would not recommend Victory Outreach to anyone. My prayer is that those that are in the rehabilitation homes would seek other options like “u-turn for Christ.” Where they give you the love of Jesus. That those in bondage to Victory Outreach would find another ministry that will give you Jesus. With that being said, here’s why Victory Outreach is a cult.

1. The group is focused on a living leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment.

This is obviously Sonny Arguinzoni, he and his vision is the focus of this ministry. I remember the pastor in the Victory Outreach I attended would express his unquestioned obedience to Sonny Arguinzoni. This was a tactic used to get everyone in the church to express the same unquestioned obedience to him. It was constantly preached you need to have your pastor’s heart. So, in order to win the respect of the pastor, people had to show their unquestioned obedience. Have any of you ever questioned Sonny’s vision? He says the promise scripture is Isaiah 45:2-3, “treasures out of darkness.” I remember taking a V.E.T.I. class on history and vision. For extra credit we had to memorize Isaiah 45:2-3. I read it over and over “treasures out of darkness.” Well, I ended up getting extra credit for that scripture. However, it now that I’m out of there, I’ve come to notice that it doesn’t say “treasures out of darkness” but “treasures of darkness.” The Lord opened my eyes to where I was blinded by their manipulation. Sonny added to God’s word. You are not to take away or add to scripture. However, cults have a tendency of doing so. ”And the LORD said to me, “The prophets prophesy lies in My name. I have not sent them, commanded them, nor spoken to them; they prophesy to you a false vision, divination, a worthless thing, and the deceit of their heart.”-Jeremiah 14:14

2. The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members.

I can’t speak for other Victory Outreach’s. However, this was a big issue in the Victory Outreach I attended. They were always focusing on how they could get more people in the church. Even to the extent of having a church growth class. They finally got a pledge going for a new church. They felt that if they had a bigger church, more people would come. It was interesting, because the little church they did have wasn’t being filled every Sunday. Victory Outreach seems to ignore the obvious in Acts 2:47. It’s God who adds to the church! Their lack of biblical knowledge is evident.

3. The group is preoccupied with making money.

Money in Victory Outreach is a major issue. In the Victory Outreach I attended, they a would dedicate a whole month every year on tithing. I agree that tithing is something every believer should do as an act of obedience and worship to the Lord. However, in Victory Outreach they would literally try to guilt you into giving “above and beyond.” The pastor would parade the highest giver in the church every month, to throw it in the faces of those who didn’t give as much. It would later spark up a “giving” competition with those trying to “win their pastor’s heart.” I remember one time Ed Morales came to the church and fed the congregation this story of how people in his church were giving “above and beyond” to further the “vision.” Even to the extent that they were selling their homes and cars etc. I knew exactly what he was doing, trying to manipulate our church to do the same. Again, it worked. Later, our pastor would feed the church this story on how he and other pastors in Victory Outreach had gathered together and bought Sonny Arguinzoni a Mercedes. This was another attempt to get the church to do the same, it worked! They bought him a Cadillac. The pastor of this Victory Outreach owns numerous houses that the church is paying for, he also gets an additional separate check. His wife gets paid by the church and also his daughter. I like the way the NLT says it, “In their greed they will make up clever lies to get hold of your money.”-2 Peter 2:3a

4. Mind-numbing techniques (such as meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, denunciation sessions, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group and its leader(s).

Now I believe in the gifts of the Spirit. However, tongues in Victory Outreach is used and abused very often. They don’t practice tongues within the guidelines of scripture (1 Corinthians 14:6-19). Paul, makes it clear that not all will speak with tongues (1 Corinthians 12:30), I find it interesting that the whole church claims to have this gift. If so, where’s the rest of the body? 1 Corinthians 12:17. The atmosphere definitely reminds you of a cult. “Therefore if the whole church comes together in one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those who are uninformed or unbelievers, will they not say that you are out of your mind?”-1 Corinthians 14:23

5. The leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel (for example: members must get permission from leaders to date, change jobs, get married; leaders may prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, how to discipline children, and so forth).

[/i]Victory Outreach practices what is called the “Shepherding Movement.” One article describes it like this. “The Shepherding Movement arose in the early 1970s in an attempt to solve shortcomings in the modern church. Many newly converted Christians were not properly "discipled," or taught how to grow in the faith. They were largely on their own to study the Bible, learn how to pray, and to learn how to live a lifestyle that is pleasing to the Lord. Shepherding was an attempt to correct the situation by saying that each Christian should have a shepherd for everyday guidance. This shepherd became the person's spiritual leader, counseling him and even making decisions for him. It was taught that the shepherd was "God's delegated authority" and therefore his advice was always to be followed. The shepherd was like "God's ambassador" who communicated God's messages to the disciple. To disobey God's messenger would be to disobey God, and therefore a person was to trust in the shepherd's judgment rather than his own.”- [www.cephasministry.com]

In the Bible the “Shepherding Movement” is referred to as “the deeds or doctrine of the Nicolaitans.” What does Jesus have to say about this practice? “Thus you also have those who hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.” Revelation 2. This doctrine holds people in bondage. It is true that you cannot date unless you have permission. Woman are looked down upon if they wear jeans. They are required to wear skirts. “Care for the flock that God has entrusted to you. Watch over it willingly, not grudgingly—not for what you will get out of it, but because you are eager to serve God. 3 Don’t lord it over the people assigned to your care, but lead them by your own good example.”-1 Peter 5:2-3

There are so many more signs as to why Victory Outreach is a cult. Hopefully I could share more as well as my experience in Victory Outreach. My hope is that if you know someone in this ministry, that you would direct them to this website. So they could see the testimonies of so many people who have been misled in Victory Outreach.

Cult resource: [www.prem-rawattalk.org]

In His name,

I can attest to that. Having been with the church, and in the leadership a while now, I can see things a lot clearer than I did while just coming to services. Everything functions in a disorderly fashion. Pastor Sonny is revered to the point of God-fear. The latest conference had him finishing with "We need to go back to the basics! We need to hit the streets. We need to speak in tongues." What he's basically saying is we need more money, we need more workers, we need to impress people more. More on tongues later.

There's already people in the church that are back-sliding, but instead of bringing them back to the men's or women's homes, they ignore them in lieu of bringing in new people to fill the homes. New people, new tithers. Believe me, I've seen people come to church high or hung over. They do use techniques that break you. They teach people in the homes that there isn't a church out there that would accept you. They preach low self opinion. They control ex-addicts because their minds are not as strong as it should be because of alcohol, drug abuse, or sexual abuse, or all of the above. Every week I hear how unaccepted we'd be elsewhere.

As for the chanting, and speaking in tongues, and pray-walking, it can be disturbing. How can I pray silently as I was taught when I was young when the atmosphere is a cacophony of different tongues, loud outcrying, and people loudly pray-crying on the microphone? It is very distracting. And where is the interpretation? Tongues without interpretation edifies the self, not the church. I believe in tongues, but not in this manner. When I read Acts 2:7-12, I see a different use for tongues. I see glorifying God to foreigners using their own language.

Their favorite Scripture is Malachi 3. They LOVE to tell us how we are cursed for stealing from God. They use other Scriptures for tithing, but this they use sometimes 2 or 3 times a week. They forget that we are under a "new covenant'. The old is obsolete. Anyone who tries to keep the Laws is cursed, and whoever breaks one law is guilty of breaking them all. They pick and choose what suits their wants.

I've been to many a church, but none has made me feel this way. I myself am not an ex-addict or gang member. I was able to take a step back and see things clearly. I was grateful they helped someone I love, but I could not in good conscience continue to go there or allow my loved one to be controlled by them. That is how cults operate. They manipulate people and use fear to control the weak minded. They take away a bad addiction, but replace it with complete dependence on them, and low self. opinion. Beware!

I forgot to add that they are against homosexuality. I know all churches are pretty much against it, but Christians using words like faggot or homos, with the same mouth that praises God, is not very Christian indeed.

They use weird terms like treasures, twilights, and broken very loosely.

Yes they are a cult, they fall right in with the same doctrines as Praise Chapel, Potters House, Victory Chapels, La Puerta, New Harvest, The Door, The Arizona Fellowship, We all ran together for years, I can tell you they are carbon copies of the above listed fellowships.

I pastored for years, right beside this fellowship, we all ran together, spoke the same language and had the same views and doctrines. Yes they are a cult.


Jeff Watkins
Kingman Kowboy

I was part of Victory Outreach for over 15 years with my mom and 3 sisters. For a very lomg time I did not see anything wrong with the church. But slowly I began to realize who they were and what they stand for. Overall, they are a church who are money hungry. I know this because I was very close to the inner circle and also knew not only Sonny Arguinzoni Sr., but also knew rhe rest of his family and was best friends with his grand daughter. This church is more than jist money hungry, but they abuse the spiritual word to brain wash their followers to do what they want. At this point now, Victory Outreach is able to rent out the entire Los Angeles Convention Center (one of the largest convention centers in the United States) for an entire week once a year which cost about over 2.5 million dollars. Moreover, they continue to open new chur h and purchase more buildings like the ones on North Hollywood and in Montebello California and house new pastors in fully paid homes to relocate them.
Like i said before I had been part of this church for over 15 years, and tell me why not once have I seen these churches give to charity or to the homeless or the city? I know all the ins and outs of this church, even how they quickly after offering time during services they take the money upstairs to be counted, and it takes them hours to count the money most times. The is spread out to all the leaders and Pastors of this international church and to fill their pocketbooks and satisfy their needs. I knew Sonny very well because I was best friends with his grand daughter, I got to see that he owns a 3 story home in West Covina California, as well as a 2 story beach house in New Port beach, and other properties around the US. Furthermore, he owns a private plane aloong with a large assortment of vehicles. Next door to his home in West Covina is the pastor of my old church of Uptown Whittier where he is married to the daughter of Sonny. This "church" is nothing but greedy money hungry people who suck the money out of its own congregation to gain millions. I say this because I have seen it before my own eye of how they tell people if they dont pay their offering then they are "robbing" God of what is his. They speak of how "God will pay you 100% in full" if they give their money. Sometimes they even encourage their followers to not pay their bills because "God will take care of it". Its amazing the things I have seen and heard from this church.
In my own experience; i was not always into church, more like forced to go by my mother. But just 2 years ago, our family was having a crisis where my mother kicked me out for being gay, and my mom started up again a few months later doing drugs. When I asked for the churches help when kicked out, i was turned away and asked to quit school and work to go to a mens home. When we asked for the church to help my mother they did nothing. How messed up is it for people to have committed 15 years of their lives to what we thought was a church that would treat us like family, to turn their back. For a church to talk so highly about how family is important, and for them to shun me and my family away and for what and why?
After many years I had finally left and after really thinking very hard about everything I had seen and experienced with this church I can conclude now at this church is nothing but a money hungry cult.