That's better wordeded, Rensil. :)
I was trying to say something akin...re JJ.
As a kid, she came across all right and I never heard any negative comments about her. (Well you don't hear these things from within anyway..)
People like dr or gg, young as I may have been, I was definitely warned that they were OTT and not to listen too much. I was certainly never wary of JJ.
But back then, there wasn't this forum (or Latigo) so it's not surprising there were no loud complaints. Compliance was the game. And evidently still is..
As you say though, they eat from the same trough so how different can any of them digest what they are fed? Therefore, complicit.
Worse in fact...duplicit because they can treat badly people who have fallen out of favour (with no need to explain themselves!) while simultaneously maintaining their impeccable image for the benefit of those who don't need to know. Impeccable may be a bit strong...
Anyway, Rensil, I see your answer as complete, whereas I have to extrapolate based on youthful memories so my answers are less weighty.
Like I said though, it hurts to hear, that are other sides to her. That's how clean-cut she is to some.
Though it is not just the young who are duped, evidently.
All for now, regards always to all. Ifellaway

Page 100!! Less talk: more action for me...methinks. I.

Hello,
JJ was not a Head Teacher .Was a Depute. And she ignored me completely several years AFTER my husband and I left Struthers. I attended a funeral . She was there too. She ignored me. I wont ever forget that. It was the first time I had seen her since leaving. It was a Church Of Scotland funeral.
Nor , will I forget that when we left STRUTHERS ... the first and only contact we had was to sign off a covenant form that my husband had paid into for years. Didn`t much understand that one. Still under the shackles we signed the form. Naïve or what?
I may come across as cynical. I will never understand nor accept any of our Struthers experience.(see previous posts).
However, why are people putting up with it all? Are they still too scared or embroiled or under the influence to speak up? I do hope people from OSCR read this forum . The truth will triumph in the end. Why are all you Struthers people too scared to stand up for yourselves ? If You were fulfilled and happy there surely you would want to speak up for the Lord? why the silence? Does anyone recall the camp with Rosemary? Wesley Gault`s sister. (are Grace and Wesley still married) or Johnny Hamilton.... married to ZITA... ?

lintar123, I don't think you come across as cynical. And wouldn't blame you anyway, given your experience.
I was convinced she was The Headteacher, (not deputy) and was never corrected). Call it quibbling but....there IS a difference. I wouldn't let people think I was the boss, if I was only 2nd i/c. Just another myth dispelled, thanks lintar123.
Although I have very different memories of JJ, I absolutely do not doubt your version of of smc treatment. I am sure there are many more in your position than mine, (in fact, we know it, reading these 100 pages..).
And it's not naive that you were. The "compliance factor" is what keeps smc standing. All it shows is that you were both good members (until you left, then you fell away etc) but still any decent minister (or even decent human..) would have treated you with respect.
Like you say: the truth is coming out, even now. And yes, can say this forum is being read by more and more every day. Can't emphasize this enough. And we are credible...and unanswered....uncontested by those who we name. It smacks of fear, guilt and loathing by smc leadership. Really they should be here, (in person!) trying to help people damaged by bad experiences of smc. That's what Christians do... That's what good, honest people do...
Why are people putting up with it all? Scared, embroiled, under the influence, fear of failing smc standards, fear of demons.
As I have said, I was a lot younger and was blissfully ignorant of anybody being mistreated. It is stories like yours that woke me up. And stories like yours that will cause others to share, and let readers get a fairer image of the damage done to people by smc.
Don't recall Rosemary or Johnny, Zita etc. Still, I would very much appreciate hearing and if you print what you recall in this forum, more see.
I am so sorry for you lintar123, but you are free now. To an extent... Horrible experiences can be used constructively to raise awareness, as you have here, and hopefully prevent more from sucked in so fully.
Your posts will give others some comfort. I wish you could get comfort from others' posts. You are part of this raising awareness machine. You will inspire others to re-examine their position. Your experiences count as valid examples of bad treatment.
Best wishes, Ifellaway

Quote
lintar123
I may come across as cynical. I will never understand nor accept any of our Struthers experience.(see previous posts).
However, why are people putting up with it all? Are they still too scared or embroiled or under the influence to speak up? I do hope people from OSCR read this forum . The truth will triumph in the end. Why are all you Struthers people too scared to stand up for yourselves ? If You were fulfilled and happy there surely you would want to speak up for the Lord? why the silence? Does anyone recall the camp with Rosemary? Wesley Gault`s sister. (are Grace and Wesley still married) or Johnny Hamilton.... married to ZITA... ?

Hi again Lyntar

As Ifellaway has said (in their usual encouraging pastoral way) you are not coming across as cynical. We are all supposed to be truthful and if the Struthers leadership hurt you claiming God wanted them to you have a 100% right to ask them to explain how that works. And if they can't you are quite right to suggest it is time they stopped doing this to others.


Some other points on what you have said:

Your story about the funeral rings very true. Many of the Struthers church leaders behave appallingly towards those who have left and actually regard speaking to them as somehow descending (in their view) from their own exalted spiritual heights to an undesirable level. Many of us have had the same treatment. It is nothing to do with Christian conduct - it is exclusivity and snobbery - both banned behaviors for all Christians. It is ironic yet abundantly clear for all to see that someone who calls themselves "Ifellaway" still behaves towards you in a more pastoral manner than Jennifer Jack ever did.


It is mysterious that the ever fewer remaining Struthers people don't stand up for themselves and ask questions and leave but there may be reasons. Remember that the actual population is about 250 people across all the churches.

Over 40 of these are employees (though who is paid isn't clear)
Possibly as many as another 20 or so are church leaders or deputy leaders
Perhaps another 40 or 50 are family directly related to one of the leaders
Others may not like what is happening but have their kids in the school so don't want to leave just yet.
An alarmingly high number, maybe 60 or 70, have been there for over 40 years or longer and don't have a life outside Struthers and all their their friends are there. So no matter how bad it gets they are quite likely to stay.
Maybe 30 or 40 are the mindlessly loyal. A leader could hit them and they would go away and feel guilty that they made them do it.
An increasing number are very old - in their 80s or older and may not even be aware of the websites.

So it may be a very small number of the small number remaining are really free to weigh up the real issues and decide to stay or leave. Yet I agree with you - of that number it appears not one is able to come onto this forum and defend the church and its unbiblical practices in any way. So there are still people there but not anyone who is likely to set the world on fire for God, or even for Struthers.

As you point out the truth will triumph in the end and the end may now not be far away as OSCR ask the 6 Struthers company directors the same questions we have been asking. Public answer time for Struthers is now probably only a few days away. But we should not be too impatient. The longer the dialogue between the 6 directors and OSCR goes on the more illuminating the final answers will be.

Johnny Hamilton died a few years ago. His wife was called Zilla. He was never part of Struthers and as a result was a very interesting and capable Godly man. For some reason known only to Hugh Black he was one of the only people who was an "outside" speaker we were ever allowed to hear speak in Struthers meetings during the 1980s. He was badly let down by Struthers and ceased contact when they published his life story and testimony in one of their books without asking his permission. In the circumstances it is a disgrace that this book is still on sale in the 2 Struthers bookshops. Although fortunately, and perhaps because of things like that, sales of New Dawn books have never been strong. I think about 10% of all the New Dawn books ever printed at great expense to the church have ever been sold. Johnny advised many people to leave Struthers and many did in the process moving on to new and powerful Christian service once they had left behind the false and destructive beliefs.

Grace and Wesley are still married.

Hi Everyone, I haven't posted for a while but have been reading all the recent activity with great interest. I am moved to say that the regular contributors to this forum are a smart, witty, patient and kind group of people, despite how they have been treated by SMC they are never vindictive or nasty and it is SMC loss that they did not recognize and. nurture the good christian folk that they had in their midst. Frankly it is a privilege to' know' you all. It is true that pastoral care of each other on this forum is excellent and a great source of comfort. Hopefully OSCR will hold the struthers directors to account for their use or misuse of funds to promote quite frankly un christian behaviour. Their behaviour is vindictive, nasty, devisive, judgemental and selfish and to say God told them to behave that way is to my mind blasphemous, are they not taking the Lords name in vain to promote their own and their families self interest at the expense of other members.


Onward Christian soldiers... keep up the good fight and good will prevail xx

A few comments re a couple of previous posts that were put on here a week or two ago:

Firstly, to The Petitor, I just really loved your "Complaints Procedure - draft for discussion". See page 98 of the Forum. You've summed it up so well and hit the nail on the head. That's just how it is!
Secondly, to Cbarb, I love your list of rules for the rule-book. See page 97 of Forum.

I have another rule, or rules, to add to your collection, i.e.
Thou must not miss a meeting, neither a Sunday (morning and evening), nor a Saturday night, nor a midweek Bible Study nor a Prayer meeting if there is one. Missing meetings in order to attend family events, or to socialise with friends, or engage in sports, is not permitted.
Thou must not miss a Summer Camp without good reason. Thou must ideally go to both Camps but if that isn't possible then thou must attend one. If you really can't or don't want to go to Camps, keep that a secret. And if thou art a young person, thou must attend the Friday night Youth meeting as well as all the other meetings outlined above. And thou must go to the annual Youth Camp. If not, your parents will be spoken to, to find out why.
The use of "Thou" and "thee" shows that we are far holier than other Christians.

Another point. Lintar123 mentioned Rosemary Macauley, Wesley's sister, who used to come over to SMC to preach and minister in the 1980s and early 90s (I think). She was a welcome visitor whose preaching was full of vitality, hope and encouragement, and she knew the Bible and used it. Many folk got a lot of help from her personally. Then all of a sudden she stopped coming. Nothing was said by the leaders. I asked a few times what had happened to her and why she had stopped coming to take meetings, but I was never told anything. I could tell from the leaders' reaction that they didn't want to tell me the reasons. We were told often by the leaders that we should be able to pick up how they felt about someone or something by their reaction and not their words. So this certainly applied in this instance. The usual - if they don't want to answer, they just stay silent. Perhaps someone here knows a bit more about what happened, but my guess is that she spoke up on her own views and stood up to the leadership. And that just wouldn't do!

I remember Johnny Hamilton as well, another welcome visiting-preacher. Perhaps SMC leaders should read again the account of his vision regarding Christian believers, where he said there would be a great shaking and Christians who were in leadership positions and shouldnt be would come out of them, whilst those who weren't in leadership and should be, would move into their right positions.

Has anyone else noticed, as you read through this thread (and others here on Rick Ross's forum); it's like a "DIY manual" of how to create fear and control? Reverse extrapolate (intrapolate?? can't find a dictionary...) peoples' accounts shared here and how they portray this org's leadership and structure. What is clear is that leadership confabs must consist of strategy-making for tighter control, how to keep up appearances...oh, and how to personally benefit from exploiting further the good souls eager to please God (by pleasing smc leaders..).
It's even more clear when you see that through the years, visiting preachers have been welcomed, until they have veered from the smc script, that is.
Inconsistent support or shunning of other ideas or organizations. These guys have long been on tight rope. They must be skilled indeed by now. But those of us who can also do high-wire stunts know that the rope has stay so very rigid. With the amount of time and effort that must be going into survival...well there probably is no actual spiritual development, no fresh leadership...just a kind of stagnant harping on about the same old (less and less realistic) stuff. Members of the congregations must be starving for more positive nourishment. The satisfaction amonst leaders can't possibly translate into anything meaningful or useful for their flocks.
I would want more from a church...maybe I'm just greedy and self-centred. Well, I know I am, but it remains reasonable to expect a certain quid pro quo. If you put in time, money, effort and show incredible loyalty and devotion in the face of mounting criticism, you should be getting, at the very least, good guidance. All y'all smc are getting religiously ripped off, you must know this though. It's a shame, you could have done more to steer the ship. It's not rocket science, just simple numbers. Given all that has gone on, I personally would ask myself, "Am I human, or am I Struthers?"
Just saying...

Has anyone here had any contact with former welcomed guest speakers? Are any of you here? Your input may be valuable to many here.

Ifellaway

Ifellaway, sadly most of the welcomed guest speakers who visited SMC have now passed away. Another super one whom we had was Drew Greenwood (now deceased) who was friendly with Hugh Black, as Drew was with many other church leaders. We also had Jean Darnall and Jackie Pullinger way back in the 1980s. Jackie is still alive: she does missionary work with addicts and the homeless in the Far East. Also Nita Edwards, another Far East missionary based in the USA, came to talk about her miraculous healing. Strangely enough, or not, after Hugh Black died, there were hardly any visiting guest speakers at SMC. Part of Miss Taylor's original vision, which she had at the founding of SMC, was that the church would not depend on visiting speakers but that the preachers/ministers would all come from within SMC. So that's probably the reason why they didn't invite any after that.

One who continued to come on a regular basis until her passing, was American prophet/evangelist Elizabeth Austin. She was held in high esteem by the leaders as someone who was always accurate in her prophetic words to folk, until on a couple of occasions, she gave some encouraging and wonderful prophetic words of knowledge to some folk in SMC whom the leaders didn't like and had turned against. Then all of a sudden, the talk went round that Elizabeth had got it wrong in these cases and people were told to be wary of what she said after that! Quick change of opinion, yet again! But I think Elizabeth had got it right. She used to say, whilst preaching, that we all looked so scared and rigid. I do wonder what she really thought about SMC.
(My point here btw, is not to argue about what prophetic words are or aren't or whether they should be spoken. It is the reactions of the leaders and their attitudes to visiting speakers, that I am highlighting).

From what I've heard about Rosemary Macauley, she has grave concerns about what has gone on and is still going in within SMC. Maybe someone else here can tell us more.

Hi folks

Great to see some 'old faces' back in town! Hi guys :-)

Yes, Rensil I remember quite a few of the visiting speakers you mentioned and how vastly different they were from the then-leaders of SMC. Particularly Jackie Pullinger and Jean Darnall. I used to love those meetings with visiting speakers because you always went away feeling uplifted instead of beating yourself up over your failure to be holy enough for God, yet again.

I like your extra rules btw. :-)

As always huge love and biiiiiiig huggggggs to all
God Bless xx