Hi. I'm a newbie to all this and am doing some research on cults, specifically Messianic churches. Does anyone know if they're considered a cult? Are they dangerous? I know they believe in Jesus, but that's about it. I've never had a good feeling about them. Thanks.

Such groups are controversial regarding their claim to be "Jewish."

But other than that they seem to be pretty typical evangelical and fundamentalist churches, which essentially fall within the parameters of Baptist or Pentecostal theology.

See [www.culteducation.com]

They can be devisive in certain situations and have generated significant complaints over the years.

See [www.culteducation.com]

Just to answer from one point of view --
I am Messianic, attending a shul in Washington State. While the leader who started our shul is Jewish, as are many others, we are not all Jewish, and non-Jewish members are welcome. We do not attempt to "convert" people to be Jews.

The founder of the shul attended and taught in Baptist seminaries, and some of what is taught at the shul follows Calvinist-Baptist doctrine. We embrace the Bible as a whole, without division, and portions are read every Sabbath from several areas of the Bible.

We are liturgical. Much of our liturgy is in Hebrew, but for new-comers, the English translation is also printed in our siddurs. Much of our music is also in Hebrew. Those attending are offered biblical-Hebrew language classes, and this year, we have been offered a beginning modern Hebrew language class.

We observe the feasts of G-d, from Sabbath to the yearly feasts, but do not observe the Christian holidays. We celebrate the birth of Jesus, whom we call Y'shua (or Yeshua) during an 8-day Fall feast and commemorate His resurrection during two different yearly feasts. We observe Chanukkah because our L-rd did, and our desire is to live as He taught us to live and to do as He did.

I have been a member of my shul for over 10 years and have visited a few other Messianic communities when first beginning. I chose this particular shul mainly because of the integrity it holds toward the Scriptures, for the leadership, and for the membership.

Raina:

Let's stick to the historical and avoid religious rhetoric that is insulting to Jews, Judaism and only serves to confuse others.

None of the members of your church are "Jewish" and it is not a "shul" or synagogue.

You are all born-again Christians and based upon your statement are actually Baptists by theology.

Having a Jewish relgious background doesn't make you "Jewish," which is a religion not a race or nationality.

You can't be a "Baptist for Buddha" any more than you can be a "Jew for Jesus." Each faith is mutually exclusive.

It appears that some members of your church might be correctly called apostate Jews. That is, they were once Jewish, but have chosen to convert to another religion.

Jews are many races, nationalities and ethnic backgrounds, just like Christians, Mulims and other religions.

You cannot be two religions simultaneously.

It is insulting to Jews to make false claims concerning Jewish identity, Which denigrates the real meaning of Judaism, synagogues and Jewish observance.

Christians have no right to determine the parameters of Jewish identity and/or to offer their own version of Jewish religious observance.

Though Christianity historically was founded by Jews, it quickly became a seperate religion with its own distinctives.

Again, it is disrepectful and offenisve for those who have chosen to leave Judaism and/or other religionists to presume they have the right to determine anything about Jews, Judaism or Jewish religious observances.

I am completely amazed at your response. Shocked would be more truthful. You are entitled to your opinions, even though you have no idea what I am talking about, when you group all Messianic groups into one. We have nothing to do with "Jews for Jesus" and never did, nor do we have anything to do with UMJC.

You have deliberately done my shul a disservice without knowledge.

Raina:

What is shocking is your attempt to mislead people at this forum.

You do not belong to a "shul," which is a Jewish reference to a synagogue.

You belong to a church that you have already admitted teaches Baptist doctrine.

You are a "born-again" Christian (Baptist) believer.

"Jews for Jesus" was a reference to those who say they are "Jews," but conversely believe in Jesus. This is not a reference to any single organization.

You have the right to believe whatever you want, but you do not have the right to do anything you wish in the name of those beliefs.

Usurping Jewish identity and/or attempting to redefine its historical meaning is not your right and has no basis in fact.

This is not an "opinion."

See [www.culteducation.com]

The organized Jewish community has made all this quite clear for some time and no one has the right to define Jewish identity outside of that community.

You and your church should know better.

Don't insult others by trying to use another religion's holidays, symbols or related specific vocabulary for your own religious purposes.

This can be seen easily as anti-Semitic.

You may not like that label, but once again it reflects the sentiments of the legitimate Jewish community.

Surprising and interesting thread.

What I am most surprised about is the insistence that Judaism, and the Jewish people, are nothing more than a religion. If that's your belief, you hold a minority opinion within Judaism. Ask your local Israeli consulate if you could emigrate to Israel, under the law of return, if you are a Christian of Jewish heritage. The answer will be yes, because "Jewish" is a unique term in that it holds both religious and ethnic meaning.

I am a little confused by the need/desire of Jewish converts to Christianity continuing to practice Passover and other Jewish rituals, given that Christianity holds that these rituals were mere shadows of what was to come in Christ. However, to say that Jewish converts to Christianity are "usurping Jewish identity" is preposterous. As to redefining the historical meaning of Judaism, every Christian, of every stripe, has done and is doing this. Christianity at it's very heart involves a redefinition of what Judaism is, and what it's role was in redemptive history.

I'm not a messianic Christian but it was always my understanding
that you are Jewish if your mother was.

I think the Jewish culture is great and if I had Jewish blood, been
raised as a Jew and later in life believe the Jesus was the messiah,
I wouldn't want to throw away my culture.
I don't see why someone can't be a messianic Jew.
I mean if Judaism is still your heritage why can't you continue
to keep praciticing the Jewish rituals that don't conflict with
you becoming a Christian?

I'm not arguing...I just don't understand why that would be wrong.

You are not making any sense.

Jews are not a race, blood type or simply a culture.

Jews are a religion.

Christians are a religion.

You cannot be two religions at once.

See [www.culteducation.com]

You can't be a Christian for Krishna or a Mormon for Mohammad.

If someone converts to another religion they should identify with the faith of their choice not their former religion.

Canuck:

Please do a little research and get your facts straight.

No Jewish denomination recognizes former Jews that have converted to another religion (i.e. apostates) as still "Jewish" without qualification.

They can only correctly be called "apostate Jews."

No legitimate synagogue would knowingly acknowledge them as otherwise.

Claims to the contrary have been officially rejected by Orthodox, Conservative and Reform Judaism and their rabbinical authorities.

The Supreme Court in Israel has upheld that apostate Jews may not immigrate to Israel under the Law of Return. They have no Jewish status to do so.