If thoughts of eckhart are troubling you, you can use the power of your conciousness to de-energize and stop it.
Watch the thought, don't judge as that's more thought creeping in through the back entrance just watch and be the observer of your mind.

No but seriously Eckharts a good guy not a cult. The books need to be read carefully you shouldn't feel like Eckharts judging you.

Theres a lot of misunderstanding about what he teaches.

Eckhart doesn't teach passivity or inactivity he teaches to take action but if action is not possible accept it ! hes basically saying when stuck in a situation change your attitude and it becomes a more tolerable experience. Dwelling in negativity is pointless when there's no action you can take.

Eckhart doesn't teach that thinking is the enemy or to stop thinking.He teaches you to think in a more focussed manner to not be driven by thoughts and to be sceptical about them as they may be driven by the ego or painful emotion which can lead to poor judgement . Too much of our time is spent wondering around in a torrent of thoughts these thoughts are of past and future and can make us miserable this stops us from appreciating the present moment. Appreciation of the present is vital as we have nothing else.

My only problem with eckhart is that the present state he describes as an inherently joyful experience seems in my experience to often be more of a peaceful indifference which is great when your being tormented by the mind but doesn't compare to lost in the more typical state of upbeat thought :)

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tolle 'has become a disease"

If he thinks, wonderful. If we think, we are diseased and negative

If you actually read the books you'd know he has no problem with thinking its compulsive thinking tainted by ego he has an issue with. Thoughts can trigger negative emotions which can cause bad decision making, general unhappiness and ego compulsive thoughts flow completely uncontrolled which can lead to unhappiness.


Oscillating between thought and no thought with the default state 'no thought' is the aim, you can't function without thinking there's nothing wrong with functional thought.

There is a lot of falsehoods stated above about Eckhart Tolle.
Having researched his material, its clear what he is doing.

Tolle is ironically, an Egomaniac, who wants a captive audience to listen to his endless New Agey pontificating, and to send him loads of money, for his endless products.
Notice how Tolle does NOT want close personal contact with his followers, just a one-way street from Tolle to Tolle-TV, through hs products.
He wanted to make millions, and to feel like an "intellectual" with a captive audience of followers.
He just copied others material, and put new wrapping paper on it.
He has a fake name. He is a businessman.

He appears to have schizoidal [www.mentalhealth.com] tendencies, and he has a strong desire to be the Guru, the Leader, and to have his followers admire him from afar.

There have been dozens of threads about Tolle here, exposing what he is all about.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Eckhart Tolle search [forum.culteducation.com]

'Oscillating between thought and no thought with the default state 'no thought' is the aim, you can't function without thinking there's nothing wrong with functional thought.'

Actually, Jman, it is not possible to be in a state of 'no thought.' The state that you and Tolle call 'no thought' is a state of self-hypnosis where you have hoodwinked yourself--via Tolle's BS-- to believe that there are no thoughts.

Unfortunately this state of so-called 'no thought' is one where the mind is wide open to suggestion and the implanting of new beliefs--it would be a great pity if those new beliefs involved an unswerving dedication to a businessman whose only interest is in taking your money.

I have meditated for decades, it is powerful tech, but you really do need a solid understanding of how your mind/brain works before repeating the bullshit advertising slogans that have made Tolle and many others wealthy.

My main objection is not to their wealth but to the progressive decay of the thinking abilities of their mindless followers.
If you can come out with the 'no thought' rubbish then he already has you hooked. Do a bit more research and some critical thinking and become very picky about the influences you allow into your one-and-only, irreplaceable headspace. There are far more useful thoughts to 'not think' than Tolle's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2010 06:13PM by Stoic.

Long term fame indicates a lingering bondage to the ego states of greed and illusion.

One cannot remain high profile on the spiritual celebrity network unless one wants it and works at it.

And that means one still has the ego state of clinging.

And if a teacher is successful, no student becomes emotionally invested in that teacher's public persona.

Emotional investment in a teacher's public persona is also dukka/ego driven attachment/desire/clinging.

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Unfortunately this state of so-called 'no thought' is one where the mind is wide open to suggestion and the implanting of new beliefs--it would be a great pity if those new beliefs involved an unswerving dedication to a businessman whose only interest is in taking your money.

Tolle talks about this in 'A new Earth' where he discusses watching television and how people go into a state of 'no thought' and become highly susceptible to advertisements. This is "trance like" state is not the one tolles trying to cultivate. He says its "below thought not above".

What is the difference between the "trance like state" and Tolles concious no thought is an interesting question. Tolle claims you are thinking the thoughts of the program and arn't really concious. I can't really give an answer tolles answer isn't that intuitive maybe ill ask on the obviously biased eckhart forums :)

I disagree that it Is not possible to be in a state of 'no thought." If you close your eyes and concentrate on your breathing where are the thoughts ?

It is great to see all the examples around of people strangely equating money/success with evil. "Oh look Eckharts been successful and made money he must be a hypocritical, egotistical fat cat heartlessly brain washing the vulnerable with nonsense solely designed to thicken his wallet".
The idea that his book may of actually helped thousands of people and that the money is a well deserved never seems to be considered yet they accuse the eckhart fans of lacking critical thinking ! how ironic.

Theres a lot of people with this negative view of eckhart around but no real reason why they think this. Jealousy ? I think its cynicism inbuilt cynism is a nasty affliction its becoming easier and easier to agree with eckharts when he says the current mind is dysfunctional.

Jman:

The last paragraph of your last post comes across as a personal attack against anyone that criticizes Tolle.

"Jealously?"

"inbuilt cynicism is a nasty affliction..."?

This isn't a meaningful response to Tolle's critics.

If you want a dialog please respond to the points, rather than resorting to personal attacks.

Jman has been banned from this message board.

The real reason that I take a negative view of Tolle is that he is encouraging naive people, for a price, to follow him into the bliss bunny land of 'no thought.'
What an absolute gift that is to a charlatan, to have their rubbish taken at face value because it carries a 'spiritual' label.

Cynicism has a very good pedigree in the tradition of western wisdom.

[en.wikipedia.org]

'Cynicism, in its original form, refers to the beliefs of an ancient school of Greek philosophers known as the Cynics. Their philosophy was that the purpose of life was to live a life of Virtue in agreement with Nature. This meant rejecting all conventional desires for wealth, power, health, and fame, and by living a simple life free from all possessions. As reasoning creatures, people could gain happiness by rigorous training and by living in a way which was natural for humans. They believed that the world belonged equally to everyone, and that suffering was caused by false judgments of what was valuable and by the worthless customs and conventions which surrounded society. Many of these thoughts were later absorbed into Stoicism.'

In modern usage 'cynicism' has a synonym in 'jaded.'

"Idealism is what precedes experience; cynicism is what follows." It can be said that modern cynicism is the opposite of optimism and a more accurate antonym is naiveté, which further supports this view.

Traditionally, spiritual seekers were expected to spend twelve years in study and investigation before finally deciding on a suitable teacher. If a little cynicism was to be expected in the selection when it was forbidden to charge for such teaching, why sneer at employing a little protective cynicism in today's crowded and expensive spiritual marketplace?

Its the welfare of your own mind that is at stake, not Tolle's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2010 02:54AM by Stoic.

I have some problems like people here as well especially the "blank mind". I took up meditation a few times, I listened to some New Age "gurus" and bought into this idea that "the ego is bad", "silence the mind", "watch your thoughts but don't react to them" etc. I am constantly going though each day apathetic to pretty much everything. I have no real opinions on things and I don't seem care much about others (except my family) not in a bitter way but more indifferent. I miss that energy, the feeling of being excited about something, being dissapointed, being really happy, even sad. Yet all I seem to feel these days nothing, I feel neutral, not sad, not depressed, nor happy, content yet not really feeling anything at the sametime. It almost seems like my soul is gone in a way, certain music used to lift me up or even make me moved now it rarely has any effect, when I used to gaze at a woman in her eyes I used to feel a bit nervous and some kind of tension now I feel nothing, I know when I am attracted to a woman but there is no feeling there like before. I only emotion I seem to feel these days is laughter say If I watch a funny movie or someone says or does something funny.

I can anyone relate? If so how did you get over this "empty, apathy" feeling? I honestly think it will be impossible to get out of this emotionally blank mind state of mind.