David Schirmer, in a you tube video (which I will not link to for aesthetic reasons) said that the media would sensationalise it, "and it doesn't matter whether it costs businesses, lives or relationships..."

So people will die because of the media coverage.

Here is a nice video of him locking himself in the toilet to escape a journalist. (Hmmm, maybe like really does attract like.) He got it removed from you tube, but it's still here.

[vimeo.com]

Notice that known investment scammer David Schirmer is trying to reframe intelligent and courageous criticism as murder, meanwhile James Arthur Ray is IN JAIL PENDING A MURDER TRIAL. Who's the murderer? And with an appeal to a literal interpretation of the bible? Are you serious?

"Some of the filth and utter trash said about James Ray on the internet by people who don’t know him, don’t know what he does, or the circumstance is nothing short of shameful and pathetic. These people who portray hatred through their words rather than show love are murderers – That’s not me saying that, that is what the bible says, "If any of you hate your fellow man you are a murderer.""



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2010 09:04AM by buffman.

Some of these LGAT Gurus are manipulative persuaders, advanced salespeople, conversational hypnotists and propagandists with complicated personalities...

Some are just crooks, and brazen liars.
As in the same ballpark as a mini Bernie Madoff, and other white collar crooks.

Schirmer is simply a crook.
Perhaps one day the (non-golden) handcuffs of justice will pay him a visit too.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2010 01:08PM by The Anticult.

schirmerexposed.blogspot.com

There are many websites that expose David Schirmer for what he is, a scammer.
What is interesting, is that the mainstream media pretty much ignores almost all scammers, with a few exceptions, until its too late and there are criminal charges.

But in recent years, due to the internet, CITIZEN ACTIVISM is happening all over the place, and those who are interested post their investigations and analyses of people like David Schirmer.
Former customers also post their complaints.

But what drives scammers like David Schirmer and Joe Vitale ABSOLUTELY CRAZY, is that there are many people who post in blogs and in threads, who just carefully analyze the scams of David Schirmer and Joe Vitale, simply for their own reasons, often being a bemused curiosity at their ridiculous scams they are trying to pull on people.
These analyses then spread virally through blogs, and critical thinking forums, until they are all over the internet, and are very convincing as they are based on facts, and happen to be true.
So a basic search of the scammers name brings up all sorts of critical information about their scams.

Schirmer and Vitale cannot comprehend why everyday people would expose scams on their own time, simply because they believe its the decent thing to do.

Schirmer and Vitale and many others like them, get up everyday, and try to think of new ways to dupe people to try and make money off them, and scam the hell out of them.
They literally can't wrap their minds around the fact, that there are many decent people out there, who have taken an interest in their scams, and have written them up in great detail, often just because they want to.
And Schirmer and Vitale cannot stop them.

This is why David Schirmer is getting so hysterical, and trying to move into using religion as a propaganda weapon. It would not be surprising to see him move right into New Agey religious content, as that gives the scammer more latitude.
If you pull an investment scam and get caught, you can go to jail.
But if they do a new agey scam like The Secret, they can be a lot more vague, and make more outrageous claims to make money.
And when the products fails, its YOUR fault for not believing hard enough.
Its the perfect scam.

Looked at bluntly, if you are a scammer by nature, and greedy and lazy, you'd be crazy NOT to go into the New Agey area of scamming, like all these LGAT Gurus. That is heaven for them, especially if they can hide behind a type of religious non-profit, with no tax, and religious freedom protections.
They can do basically anything short of causing the deaths of more than a few people, before anyone in authority pays any attention to them.

So its up to the internet Citizen Activists to expose these crooks. The mainstream media won't do it, and the authorities don't (or can't) act until its too late.

Perhaps the power of the internet to allow direct Citizen Activism against these crooks, combined with the Google search technology which gives such high ranking to the valuable criticism of the scammers, will be the very thing to drive them out of business, or at least seriously marginalize them.

David Schirmer is feeling this daily, as anyone who puts his business and name into Google sees instantly he is listed as a scammer all over the place. That is why Schirmer is so hysterical.

You hit the nail on the head. These guys are so driven by greed they literally can't understand why someone would do something ALTRUISTIC like helping others to avoid their scams with no desire for compensation in any way whatsoever.

Quote
The Anticult
...
Schirmer and Vitale cannot comprehend why everyday people would expose scams on their own time, simply because they believe its the decent thing to do.

Schirmer and Vitale and many others like them, get up everyday, and try to think of new ways to dupe people to try and make money off them, and scam the hell out of them.
They literally can't wrap their minds around the fact, that there are many decent people out there, who have taken an interest in their scams, and have written them up in great detail, often just because they want to.
And Schirmer and Vitale cannot stop them.
...
So its up to the internet Citizen Activists to expose these crooks. The mainstream media won't do it, and the authorities don't (or can't) act until its too late.

Perhaps the power of the internet to allow direct Citizen Activism against these crooks, combined with the Google search technology which gives such high ranking to the valuable criticism of the scammers, will be the very thing to drive them out of business, or at least seriously marginalize them.

David Schirmer is feeling this daily, as anyone who puts his business and name into Google sees instantly he is listed as a scammer all over the place. That is why Schirmer is so hysterical.

Also, when they try to attack a specific blogger with threats, like the Duff McDuffee situation, it backfires, and makes everything 100x worse for the scammer.
The info gets spread around even more, and everything gets cross-posted.

Its almost like the blogosphere, twittersphere is developing a type of anti-scamming antivirus system.

The key component is the Google search algorithms [www.google.com] which give much more weight to material written and linked by actual humans, as opposed to the phoney spam blogs these scammers create with robots. So a basic search turns up the facts and dirt on these scammers.

This must be why the scammers like Schirmer and Vitale are getting so hysterical, as they can't stop it. They can't ignore it, they can't stop it. All they can try to do is say its all crazy talk written by haters who are jealous of their success.
But most people have to be able to see that is bullshit.

And as soon as the SCAMMER button gets pressed and linked to them, its 50x times harder for the scammer to pull off their scam. And when the techniques are exposed in detail, it can be game over.

So the clever scammers will continue to move into Non-dual Quantum Physics New Wage scamming, where critical thinking is avoided at all costs, and the Mind is seen as an evildoer.
And also move into the alt-health scams to take advantage of people who are desperate.

There are some EXCELLENT bloggers who clearly expose these crooks as a hobby in research and writing, and some do it in a satirical way for edutainment as well.
It drives these crooks INSANE trying to figure out why these strangers are exposing their scams, for no apparent reason other than its the ethical and decent thing to do.

Quote
buffman
You hit the nail on the head. These guys are so driven by greed they literally can't understand why someone would do something ALTRUISTIC like helping others to avoid their scams with no desire for compensation in any way whatsoever.

Quote

It drives these crooks INSANE trying to figure out why these strangers are exposing their scams, for no apparent reason other than its the ethical and decent thing to do.

Exactly. And you always see their true colors coming out in their rebuttals. I find it so fascinating how these cons ALWAYS accuse adversaries of being exactly what they are themselves. I've only just begun my research and writing and have already experienced a bit of backlash. And it doesn't scare me one bit.

The sad part of it is that through my research I've realized a parental family member of mine has been subjecting me to this kind of treatment for many years. At first I thought it was just her personality with a little wiring gone wrong due to early drug use, but now I realize that she's been involved with, following and manipulated by various scam artists for many years. She had become one of them somewhere along the way a long time ago and I've watched her try to do some pretty horrible things as I've grown up. Now, whenever I tell her what I think about these groups and their tactics, she responds the same way these guys do. So I've stopped all contact with her for now. It has become a monumental form of therapy for me to get involved in this ethical form of activism.

I want to help others realize what I have realized, by sharing my story a little bit at a time as I come to grips with it. And at the same time educate people who think "why do so many people fall for these scams?" and help them understand the kind of manipulation that is involved so they aren't so quick to blame the victims.

And to you, The Anticult, I thank you for your extremely well articulated and informative posts here.

Anyway, this thread is about James Arthur Ray, perhaps we should get back on topic!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2010 09:53PM by ResearchingTruth.

Prescott e-News has an interesting article and audio of the indictment hearing. Read the analysis of the 'not guilty' non plea--clearly some lawyerly maneouvering going on in trying to manipulate the news feeds with what they want them to hear and report:

prescott enews



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2010 11:24PM by Stoic.

Quote
Stoic
Prescott e-News has an interesting article and audio of the indictment hearing. Read the analysis of the 'not guilty' non plea--clearly some lawyerly maneouvering going on in trying to manipulate the news feeds with what they want them to hear and report:

prescott enews

I transcribed an interesting excerpt from this audio regarding the $5 million Bond and Ray's financial information. Mr Kelly, Ray's attorney says that his private and confidential financial information "has nothing to do with the merits of the case":

Quote
Ray's attorney to the judge, at the initial appearance
"During our discussions with Mr Hughes from the County attorney's office, as it relates to the reasonableness of the bond, we were going to provide some private financial information on behalf of our client. And I believe, with agreement, that the County attorney's office would ask for a protective order that that private and confidential financial information, that has nothing to do with the merits of the case, may relate to the county attorney's opinion as to the reasonableness of the bond be protected from disclosure to any third party."

The defense attorney had no objection, and the judge said that it would be ordered.

Oh, but his financial information has EVERYTHING to do with the merits of the case, don't you think?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/09/2010 12:09AM by ResearchingTruth.