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Re: James Arthur Ray - Thank goodness this maniac is off the streets
Posted by: Penelope ()
Date: February 04, 2010 11:00PM

Quote

"One participant in the latest sweat lodge questioned the worth of having Ray behind bars and said he could do more good by speaking publicly about how to handle adversity and contributing financially to the families of the deceased — something the families have said hasn't been done so far.

"'He can't change what happened, but he can respond to what happened in a concrete, tangible way," said Kristina Bivins of San Francisco. "His desire is to help the families, to help the Native American community, to make sure that nothing like this ever happens again.'"

Uh, yeah.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - Thank goodness this maniac is off the streets
Posted by: Hope ()
Date: February 04, 2010 11:23PM

From ABC News, 2/4/10

"James Ray accepts responsibility for what happened in the Sedona, Ariz., sweat lodge that led to three deaths, but that does not make it a crime, said one of his lawyers, Brad Brian.

James Ray's lawyer says he "accepts responsibility" for deaths.

"After this happened he immediately reached out to the families. We have been meeting with the families' lawyers. But again, that doesn't make it a crime. We think turning this into a criminal charge we think is unjust and we look forward to proving his innocence in court," Brian said on "Good Morning America" this morning. "

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James Arthur Ray, covert hypnosis seduction, modern Svengali complex
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: February 04, 2010 11:25PM

There will be a sad and sickening sub-plot to this.
Pretty much the only "fans" James Ray appears to have left are young women, he has used his advanced persuasion techniques on them for a long period of time, and still exercises a lot of power and control over them.

James Arthur Ray, covert hypnosis seduction, modern Svengali complex [forum.culteducation.com]


That person "Kristina Bivins" is literally regurgitating exactly what James Ray suggested and programmed she think and say. You can see her phrase..."to make sure that nothing like this ever happens again" is literally the precise phrase James Ray has put out many times.

James Ray also programmed young women to dress in black to be his Death Angels, to cover up injuries at seminars, cover-up the death of Colleen Conaway, among many other things.
He has used various powerful covert techniques to engineer those ldealized feelings and beliefs about James Ray into many young women. He has targeted them directly, as can be seen in the fact he surrounded himself with many young women who he groomed to apparently do anything he asked of them, and ordered them to do.
Its very disturbing, and it has been seen before.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: quackdave ()
Date: February 05, 2010 02:00AM

This is great news. Great for a multitude of reasons. A light has now been thrown on one of the many flavors of the New Age leaning that has afflicted the USA and the world. One can imagine this to be the first sign of an increased awareness of the true personalities of the hucksters, shaman, self-styled gurus and snake-oil salespeople who have infected the very minds of a whole generation. Very good news, indeed.

A few websites, such as SaltyDroid, a number of blogs, some letters and emails sent to authorities, and the work both seen and unseen on this forum and thread, have seemingly started a ball rolling. It is my considered opinion that the very continuance of this kind of pressure on those in authority could actually aid in bringing this whole disgusting crowd to task. What I'm saying is: Now is not the time to back off. This is a minor skirmish, compared to the war against the skulduggery that is afoot; the type that has begun to be the undoing of James Arthur Ray and his organisation. But enough constant pressure can bring about real change, I believe.

I have never before been as hopeful as I am now; I am mostly a fatalistic cynic in these matters. But I had to speak my mind about this latest news, and what I believe it can mean to all of us. I, for one, will continue to do what I can, and what I do, to help.

qd

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: February 05, 2010 04:37AM

Who would have guessed? Pleads 'not guilty'

not guilty plea

And some rebuttal of the White Paper and NY Times whitewash, from a recovering participant:

beverly bunn rebuttal

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: objektivist ()
Date: February 05, 2010 04:49AM

I just wanted to pass on this link,

[www.youtube.com]

especially to anyone that's newer on here, like I am. I found this site on my trail through the beginnings of the end for death ray, haven't really gone to the recovery pages here, just kept reading about ray, byron katie, etc and I'm sure I'm not the only one so that's why I'm posting here.

I now get how people like byron katie get into the "it's your fault" thing, it really jumped out at me when I watched the first video in this series.

Hope this is as useful to someone else as it is to me.

Thanks again to all of you who have come here before me and continue to spend the time and energy to help educate those of us alot newer and much in need.

Thanks again.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: Penelope ()
Date: February 05, 2010 01:17PM

JR's lawyer is on Larry King right now. He says James had CPR staff on hand and that James held someone's IV until the paramedics arrived. There's no one on right now to give the other side to the story.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - Thank goodness this maniac is off the streets
Posted by: taraverti ()
Date: February 05, 2010 03:49PM

Quote

"His desire is to help the families, to help the Native American community, to make sure that nothing like this ever happens again.'"

This just makes me ill. How arrogant of him to suggest he even has one atom of help to offer the Native American community as far as sweats go. He had no business doing a sweat in the first place, the arrogant SOB. Native American spiritual leaders have been warning of unqualified people doing sweats and have asked repeatedly that they stop it, to no avail. And HE wants to help THEM?????? How patronizing, how wrong wrong wrong. How insulting to the real keepers of the real sweat lodge. They know how not to kill people. They don't need James Death Ray's help.

His arrogance is unbelievable.

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Re: James Arthur Ray, covert hypnosis seduction, modern Svengali complex
Posted by: Christa ()
Date: February 05, 2010 04:04PM

Quote
The Anticult
SNIP
That person "Kristina Bivins" is literally regurgitating exactly what James Ray suggested and programmed she think and say. You can see her phrase..."to make sure that nothing like this ever happens again" is literally the precise phrase James Ray has put out many times.

Kristina Bivins is the president of an enterprise software company called MuseGlobal. Here are links to a couple of her YouTube videos.

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

She appears to have a responsible, high-salaried job. And she seems like someone who will howl like a stuck pig when she sees her name on this site.

Yet doesn't seem to mind spraying her name all over the international press, defending soon-to-be convicted murderer (I mean, manslaughterer) James Arthur Ray. Just google "kristina bivins james ray". (Proxy up, because this is a person who might well go to google, demanding search logs) I got 88 results on this story alone.

If I were an investor in this company, I would be on the phone with MuseGlobal's board of directors before close of business today. How can anyone risk her company's reputation in this way? In this economic environment? I sure hope she's brain-washed, because if she isn't, she's nuts.

To paraphrase Australian Sen. Nick Xenophon, free societies place no limits on what people can believe. But they do limit how people can behave. I don't care what guru she follows or what she believes in; publicly defending these indefensible acts demonstrates shockingly poor judgment.

She is placing this sociopath's interests above creating shareholder value. This is a level of irresponsibility on a par with a married North American governor who uses state money to visit his South American mistress. She should just be happy I'm not on her board.

There is no evidence for any of James Ray's claims about his behavior at the Death Lodge. On CNN tonight, Anderson Cooper held up 700 pages of evidence for the claims against him.

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Re: James Arthur Ray - 2 die at Arizona retreat's sweat lodge
Posted by: laurarobert23 ()
Date: February 05, 2010 04:45PM

I am new in this forum but I got a great discussion here.

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