Quote
rrmoderator
Cameron Cope:

You say that "Desteni is not a belief system," but admit "that our products have not yet been peer-reviewed in any journals..."

Don't you and other Destini devotees believe in "channeling" and various other "New Age" religious claims?

Isn't it true that Destini is little more than a composite of such essentially religious beliefs and claims?

Rick Ross,

When I use the term "Desteni" I am referring to the Desteni Group based in South Africa. When I use the term "Desteni Education" I am referring to The Desteni Education company based in Houston, Texas which is a separate legal entity from Desteni.

Please do not confuse the two. I said that Desteni is not a belief system and I gave perspective on why I say that.

Then I explained that the products being sold by Desteni Education have not yet been peer reviewed.

Let me ask you. Has your kitchen oven been peer reviewed in a credible journal? Has your bathroom toilet? Have the pants and shirt you are wearing been peer reviewed in an academic journal? Have the vast majority of products you use on a daily basis been peer reviewed in a credible academic journal? Please answer directly.

To answer your other questions. again, i do not speak for others, however I do not believe that the information produced through "channeling" is credible. I would not base any decisions on information obtained through those sources. I would however, if i was curious, listen to what is being said and use common sense to decide on a case by case basis whether the information was of any use to me. I don't know what "various other 'New Age' claims" means specifically, but it sounds to me like you are casting a wide net in hopes I will say something that will somehow discredit me. What specific claims are you asking whether I believe in? I have obviously answered you with regards to channeling.

--Cameron

LeilaZamoraMoreno:

So Destini never does anything wrong and there is no other organization or company that exists that is equal to Destin in helping people.

Interesting.

That kind of thinking is often expressed by "cult" members that believe there group alone has any meaningful answers or solutions.

For example, Waco Davidians, Heaven's Gate members and the people of Jonestown would have said the same.

Quote
rrmoderator
LeilaZamoraMoreno:

So Destini never does anything wrong and there is no other organization or company that exists that is equal to Destin in helping people.

Interesting.

That kind of thinking is often expressed by "cult" members that believe there group alone has any meaningful answers or solutions.

For example, Waco Davidians, Heaven's Gate members and the people of Jonestown would have said the same.

I'm sure the employees as Apple would say the same thing about their company. Is it wrong to have confidence in the organizations one participates in?

Cameron Cope:

No.

Apple employees would not answer in that way.

You are attempting to spin the answer.

BTW--why are you attempting to answer for someone else? Isn't that something you previously stated that you would not and should not do?

What is the role of Sunette in Destini?

Please explain.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/09/2010 02:44AM by rrmoderator.

Every sect these days also tries to get a secular business process going on alongside their other processes. Its a way to generate money, and to covertly spread their message into the secular society at large. Of course they also usually try to conceal the connections between the groups and processes.

Desteni Education offers no credibility whatsoever on their websites.
Testimonials are useless.
anecdotal (testimonial) evidence [www.skepdic.com]

They are selling an alleged Vocabulary and Reading product.

QUOTE: "Desteni Education is currently conducting free Reading Diagnostic Assessments in Houston and the Surrounding Areas. Contact a Desteni Educational Consultant"

What is that? Its another standard technique, where the fisherman gives away the worm to the fish for "free". Of course the worm is on the end of a barbed-hook, and is then reeled-in. Every sect does that as well, that is what Scientology has done with its "free" bogus Personality and Stress tests.

Desteni Education is offering "FREE In-Home Reading Diagnostic". So parents need to be notified, aware and know the facts.
Desteni Education is targeting young children and their parents.

Those who are running Desteni "Education" are closely linked with the channeling "Desteni" as shown above.
Bernard Poolman is associated with "Esteni de Wet" as shown above. [forum.culteducation.com]
Esteni-Desteni (D-Esteni)
Tomato-Tomahto.

The parents of those children have a right to know that their namesake "Desteni" is marketed to be a New Age "channeling Portal" entity, that they (Bernard Poolman and others) says channels ADOLF HITLER.
Is Desteni channeling Hitler? Of course not, its a hoax.

But even just for the sake of argument, what if Desteni was channeling "Hitler"? Hitler was personally responsible for the slaughter and torture of millions of innocents. That is not an abstraction. Just the other week there was some video footage showing the Nazi's dragging an elderly woman by her hair over the ground, and then executing her. They committed countless crimes against humanity.
The Desteni group is trying to claim they are "channeling" Hitler? Hitler is a billion times worse than "the Exorcist" which was a movie about a "channeling entity".
Hitler and the Nazis were not a movie, they were real.

So if there was a "Hitler channel" (there isn't), but if there was, that would be the definition of "demonic". Even those who believe in "channeling" believe the "demonic" is very dangerous, of course.
If a delusional and mentally unstable person believed they were "channeling Hitler" they could do horrible things to other people.
What if some deluded megalomaniac [www.wisegeek.com] sect-leader believed he could channel "Hitler" through one of his followers? That is a recipe for disaster.


So even though Desteni is a terrible hoax, Sunette better wake-up and take some personal responsibility for her actions. She might be young, but she should read up on the horrible historical facts about Hitler and what he and his henchmen did. It was not that long ago, and using "Hitler" as a hoax in a channeling marketing outrage is beyond sick.
Show some respect for the millions of innocent victims who were horribly slaughtered and tortured for years by that psychopath Hitler and his henchmen.


What about the Desteni Education products?
Where is the EVIDENCE about how this alleged "reading" software works? Where are the university studies analyzing how it works? There is absolutely NOTHING. Zero, zip, nadda. Just a few testimonials.

And look at the IMAGE used by Desteni Education, its the same type of strange WINGED image used by Desteni, and Bernard Poolman in their other materials.



The Desteni Education gobblygook is basically identical to the Desteni program they are using to modify people's LANGUAGE PATTERNS and meaning and vocabulary as stated right from the start! [forum.culteducation.com] As stated, Bernard Poolman knows exactly what he is doing, by taking control of the MEANING of the language, vocabulary, and cognitive INFORMATION PROCESSING in people's minds. He knows how it works, and is working it. You take control of that, and you literally can take control of the person.


By the way, the description below of how a child learns language below is beyond FALSE. Learning language is NOT like a brick wall, that is a horribly wrong metaphor. The syntax, grammar and structure of human language is nothing like they claim.
How a child learns language is not yet totally understood, but there are trained accredited professionals who have spent their entire lives on these issues. They are called actual educational researchers and teachers.

What is being preached and sold by Desteni Education is mis-educational quackery at best.
But what is really going on?
What kind of thought-reform system is at play, to try to re-language the meaning, vocabulary and information-processing language patterns in people's minds?
That is the question.
The answers will follow soon, piece by piece.



________________quote excerpt for educational analysis_______________
www.destenieducation.com/About%20Us.html

Who We Are
The Desteni Education System is a skills development and transfer program. The skills that are developed with this program are Information Processing Skills. The method used is diagnostics, then remediation, then preparation and then acceleration.
Information Processing Skills are the skills necessary for effective curriculum and information transfer, which should be the foundation of the schooling system.
Understanding the format and foundation of information processing skills are vital at the teacher / facilitator level. If these skills are not understood, no effective reading and effective information transfer is possible.

The process of building effective information processing skills is like building a brick wall, where each brick represents a word. If the child misses one word in one of its facets of spelling, meaning or recognition, one brick in the wall of understanding is missing. This missing brick will affect the child, when they are busy reading information where this word, that is missing, or is not understood, is used. The effect is, that the child will have been reading in the abstract phase (which is all the words they know) and then jumped to the concrete phase for this one word, which they don’t know. ...

....
...
Through deduction and logics the simplicity of this proposed revolution in education, must be clear to the concerned and informed decision maker, and participant in the education process.
The Desteni Vocabulary Builder is language independent and can be utilized and applied based on the above-mentioned principles in any language for no extra cost.
___________________________________



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/09/2010 02:54AM by The Anticult.

@sandman

you are presenting false information as fact. Desteni Education is a joint partnership owned solely by myself and Katherine Conklin registered in Houston Texas. It is not run by Esteni De Wet or Bernard Poolman. You may come visit us in Houston if you need proof or look up our business registration information with Harris County, Texas.

Your credibility is on the line here when you present opinion as fact.

--Cameron

Quote
rrmoderator
Cameron Cope:

No.

Apple employees would not answer in that way.

You are attempting to spin the answer.

BTW--why are you attempting to answer for someone else? Isn't that something you previously stated that you would not and should not do?

What is the role of Sunette in Destini?

Please explain.

Rick Ross,

Do not spin my words, I said that If i gave perspecitive on another's posts it would be done so voluntarily. And that i would not do it simply because you demand it.

You would have to ask Sunette what her role is. That would obviously be up to her to determine. I met her in person and she is a nice, polite, direct person. I am quite sure she would be willing to answer any questions you have on the Desteni forum, although i can't speak for her, obviously.

Is your statement that Apple employees would not answer in that way based on objective verifiable evidence or is it based in assumption?

--Cameron

Quote
The Anticult

QUOTE: "Desteni Education is currently conducting free Reading Diagnostic Assessments in Houston and the Surrounding Areas. Contact a Desteni Educational Consultant"

What is that? Its another standard technique, where the fisherman gives away the worm to the fish for "free". Of course the worm is on the end of a barbed-hook, and is then reeled-in. Every sect does that as well, that is what Scientology has done with its "free" bogus Personality and Stress tests.

Desteni Education is offering "FREE In-Home Reading Diagnostic". So parents need to be notified, aware and know the facts.
Desteni Education is targeting young children and their parents.

Whenever we give a presentation and demonstration of our reading software to parents, we objectively measure the child's reading speed. we do this by giving them a passage to read on the computer and timing how long it takes them to read it. We then divide the number of words by the time it took to give an quantifiable result for their reading speed.

We then ask comprehension questions based on the story they read to determine their comprehension level based on their tested reading speed.

We do this for free for the parents and child, regardless of whether they decide to purchase our products. Even if they don't decide to invest in our programs they at least have some information to understand whether their child actually has a reading problem or whether they are at the level they should be at according to their State School system's guidelines and if so then they can consider the option of accelerating their child's abilities, whether through our programs or with a competitors.

What about this bogus exactly?

--Cameron

Quote
rrmoderator
LeilaZamoraMoreno:

So Destini never does anything wrong and there is no other organization or company that exists that is equal to Destin in helping people.

Interesting.

That kind of thinking is often expressed by "cult" members that believe there group alone has any meaningful answers or solutions.

For example, Waco Davidians, Heaven's Gate members and the people of Jonestown would have said the same.

I said that I do not disagree. Right and Wrong has got nothing to do with that. Please do not interpret my words and turn them around in order to fit your perceptions.

Quote
The Anticult

By the way, the description below of how a child learns language below is beyond FALSE. Learning language is NOT like a brick wall, that is a horribly wrong metaphor. The syntax, grammar and structure of human language is nothing like they claim.
How a child learns language is not yet totally understood, but there are trained accredited professionals who have spent their entire lives on these issues. They are called actual educational researchers and teachers.

@the anticult

How is it that you can claim that how a child learns language is not yet totally understood and in the same paragraph state that Desteni Education's perspective is FALSE. How can you say that with complete confidence?

Your credibility is at stake here.

The brick wall metaphor is used to demonstrate how a foundational error in the child's learning process can lead to a much more noticeable problem in later years. It is not meant as an all inclusive explanation of the child's learning process.

--Cameron