About 10 years ago I used to hang out with a large group of Polish immigrants in London and for a few weeks I dated one girl who was on the periphery of the group. We remained friends and she introduced me to DWB and several years later I eventually became a member.

In conversation with other friends it was revealed that she was regularly helping herself to other people's things (including mine) and when questioned she would argue that we were the ones who had an issue with attachment to their material possessions.
I decided to confront her about this as it goes against Buddhist ideals and it seemed a very cynical ploy to use the idea of non-attachment to justify such behaviour, but when I did she became completely unreasonable about it and I thought I had heard the last from her as we were obviously no longer on good terms.
Soon after that I started getting threatening phone calls from Polish members of the DWB London Sangha claiming that I had stolen from this girl.
I even had an angry phone call from Steve James demanding that I return her "stolen" credit card, something which I clearly knew nothing about, but I was told to take a break and not come to the centre for a while.

About 6 months later I was encouraged by other (non-Polish) members to return to the centre on the basis that she was the one with the issue and I shouldn't let that affect my practice, but a day or two later I received a text from Daffy Morris telling me I was no longer welcome because I had made a phone call to this girl threatening to stab her and other Sangha members. The next day I was arrested on the charge of threatening behaviour, however upon investigation it became clear to the police that I could not possibly have made a threatening phone call to number I did not have while I was asleep. Even though this was made clear to Daffyd Morris at the time, he chose to ignore the police evidence, and I can only guess that it was for the sake of group unity at the expense of the truth.

Looking back now and reading SteveLpool's posts, I actually think the real reason I was treated that way was firstly because I didn’t buy into the whole Ole Nydahl "worship" thing and secondly because there was an obvious clique of young Polish guys who seemed more interested in sex that Buddhism.

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In conversation with other friends it was revealed that she was regularly helping herself to other people's things (including mine) and when questioned she would argue that we were the ones who had an issue with attachment to their material possessions.

That is a standard mind screw used by crooks who know just enough about Buddhism and sincere practitioners to pervert the teachings for their own sordid purposes.

Ha. Wonder how this girl would have felt if someone had taken her prized possessions away from her?

No one can presume to know enough about other people's minds and hearts to dare suggest they are at fault for taking offense at being stolen from.

Thats the reasoning of a street thug who has discovered ways to pervert religion--any religion--to exploit honest people from whom that thief has stolen.

Con artists and crooks identify the methods of religion and thought that exist in the community. In the old days, Christianity was dominent, so thieves would have found ways to exploit Christianity to justify thier actions.

In the peace movement, I have seen crooks use marxism to justify theft.

Now that Buddhism and Hinduism are becoming popular, crooks like this girl have found out how to turn your own practice against you if you dislike them stealing from you.

Years ago, Lawrence Shainberg, a Zen practitioner, told in his memoir, Ambivalent Zen, how someone played loud music past 10 pm, and when Shainberg asked the guy to turn it down so he could sleep, the guy replied, "You should use this as a practice opportunity." --turning the focus from his own violation of neighborly courtesy and local noise ordinanances and putting the focus on Shainberg.

This is a classic method of evasion--do a turn around so that its all put back on you. The crook will find anything about you, anything, even a tremor in your voice, and turn the focus of conversation onto you, guaranteeing you forget about the real issue--that someone stole your stuff.

If the thief is at a Buddhist center, he or she will learn enough of the jargon to flip your Buddhist practice against you. But anything will do.

A true Buddhist center would refuse to harbour such people.

Here is an example from Len Oakes, author of Prophetic Charisma.

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A common manipulative strategy used by the leaders in this study was an argumentative style that was calculated to subtly shift the ground of any discussion from whatever matter was being talked about toward some area of an opponent's personal insecurity.

In this technique, the leader observed the process of an opponent's conversation and identified some point of hesitency or uncertainty. This was not always a flaw of logic or an error of fact; the conversation may have been on some topic about which the leader knew little and would ahve been unable to detect such a mistake.

Rather, it was more likely to be some personal unsureness on the part of the opponent that the leaders/recruiter's exquisite social perception targeted.

In some way, often by metacommenting (Oakes means commenting about your manner of saying something, rather than responding to what you have said--my note), the meaning of whatever insecurity involved was exposed.

Typically what was said was an observation that the opponent seemed "a bit steamed up about this" or was "finding it hard to say what all this is about."

In this way, the opponent was invited, sympathetically and seducatively to expand upon the very point of weakness. Or the leader(recruiter) claimed not to understand what was meant at a particular point, perhaps even saying the opponent was not making sense. This usually led to a further exposure (confessional of personal weakness or perplexity-my note) until the opponent stumbled over his words and began to look uncomfortable. At this point, a well timed, dismissive glance from the leader was all that was needed to intimidate...'

(Oakes pp 89-90)

Corboy note: You have to be a psychopath not to be steamed up or stammer in such a situation. If you do stay calm and articulate,a crook may pretend you are not making sense. Or if you still refuse to cave in, you may be accused of being cold, or that you are prejudiced against the group that the crook belongs to. If you are female and refuse to be fooled and stand firm, you will be accused of being without compassion or accused of being a b**** or a s***. If you are female, take this as a compliment that you are savvy and cannot be manipulated)

Never allow your dharma practice to be used against you in such a vile manner. Anyone who does this isnt practicing the dharma. They're verbally sophisticated thugs.

Whoever steals has ceased, in that instant, to be a practitioner.

Except a practitioner of crime for self gain.

A thief puts poison into the larger community.

The energy needed to maintain alertness and guard ones possessions when a thief is known to be at work is energy not available for practice.

One's mind and body and emotions get more tense when one has to keep extra watch on one's belongings.

And, I am partly of Eastern European background. I can appreciate the pleasures of being in a group of fellow countrymen/women.

But this isnt what Dharma is about.

Support a Polish Cultural Centre or a Sikorsky Society. But one should not let a dharma center be turned into a clubhouse.

And its serious business for a credit card to be stolen. It not only can be used for illicit purchases, but that information can be sold to criminal elements.

Hi Corboy, thanks for your response.

"Wonder how this girl would have felt if someone had taken her prized possessions away from her?" As is often the case those who play dirty are usually the first to cry "foul", but what really struck me was that she was clearly paranoid that someone would do to her exactly what she was doing herself. The phrase "live by the sword, die by the sword" comes to mind.
My understanding of Buddhism is that it discourages that sort of mindset and encourages people to take responsibility for themselves. The phrase that stuck in my mind was one often uttered by Ole that "we need to protect women" (especially those who we want to sleep with), which somehow meant that common sense went out of the window in this case.

"we need to protect women"

Horrors have been perpetrated by those who mouth the words "We need to protect women".

Men use this to justify thuggish oppressive behavior.

And it implies that the rule of law and customs of prevailing society are not enough.

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I remember Ole Nydahl trotting out that phrase about protecting women at lectures. Very typical of his sexist approach. What he is really saying is that he sees us as inferior or not capable of being in charge of our own destiny. Fits perfectly with his view that women are only good for two things. Having sex with, and creating the 'white babies' he wants more of. I once heard that Ole actually has many children with various women. Anyone else hear that? Any idea how many and with who (followers he's abused to get sexual favours with, I presume)?

Nydahl's views about women, in common with his views other races and religions, do not belong in the 21st century.

I also remember how that same line about 'being too attached' to possessions was regularly used to guilt trip members into donating money.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2012 12:59AM by ~*~ k a t e ~*~.

Hi PeterLondon.

I totally agree with your comment about 'protecting women'. It seems to me that this idea of protecting women within the Diamond Way was a means of ingratiating yourself with them with the hope that they'll thank you by having sex with you.

I understand Nydahl's ploy here. He focuses on Islam where we can often see instances where women have fewer freedoms than men. But his warnings that we will all be subjugated by Islam just isn't true. Europe fought against facism some 70 odd years ago so I don't see how Islamic nations are going to roll in with tanks and occupy our cities. Only yesterday I read this story; "Hundreds of people in northern Mali have protested against plans by an Islamist group to amputate the hand of a thief".

[www.bbc.co.uk]

Nydahl claims that Muslims are using our western democratic stuctures to undermine democracy and, to some extent, he is right. Extreme Islam groups and preachers arrive, preach their messages of hatred of the West and then use our democratic systems to avoid punishment and extradition. But, and I countered Nydahl's arguement with this many times, we see people, men, women and children fleeing countires where radical Islam is being imposed. It makes no sense for these people to flee this oppression only to arrive on our shores to try and establish the same regime. Of course there are radical elements which must be stopped but lets not make the mistake of thinking all Muslims are radicals. As the BBC story illustrates many Muslims abhor the hardline policy of the radicalized elements.

Edward Bernaise was Sigmund Freuds nephew. Bernaise used his uncles ideas on the subconscious mind to help big corporations manipulate what we buy. He got the American economy moving agian in the early 1900's by convincing people "to buy things they didn't want or need". To do this he looked at a product and found a way to make us feel uncomfortable or inadequate if we didn't have that product. After creating a 'fear' that didn't really exist he could then launch the product as the antidote to the fear. Very clever man.

Nydahl does a similar thing. Create the fear then sell the antidote. The fear is that our women are under threat from Islam. Now you can feel as though you are fulfilling your macho role by protecting them. Surely Nydahl should be focusing his attention and the resources of his 'charity' where it's really needed ... in Islamic states where women really are treated very badly. But no, Nydahl would rather spend the charity's money on building stupas which face North Africa so as to ward off it's evil influence (his words on the stupa in Benalmadena, southern Spain).

I also worked with several Russians in America many years ago and to be honest their attitude towards women was deplorable. But of course I don't think all Russians treat women in the same way just as I don't think all Muslims are radicals.

Now Nydhal feels women should be protected. But I wonder if this extends to him having 'protected sex' with his students? I have been told he has fathered several children to different women over the years although I have no direct proof that this is the case. But, if it is true, does his level of protection extend to financial support of his children and what of the male influence which is oft cited as being needed in raising well balanced children. If he is supporting these children is it with his own money or the charity's money?

Steve

Quote
~*~ k a t e ~*~
I remember Ole Nydahl trotting out that phrase about protecting women at lectures. Very typical of his sexist approach. What he is really saying is that he sees us as inferior or not capable of being in charge of our own destiny. Fits perfectly with his view that women are only good for two things. Having sex with, and creating the 'white babies' he wants more of. I once heard that Ole actually has many children with various women. Anyone else hear that? Any idea how many and with who (followers he's abused to get sexual favours with, I presume)?

Nydahl's views about women, in common with his views other races and religions, do not belong in the 21st century.

I also remember how that same line about 'being too attached' to possessions was regularly used to guilt trip members into donating money.

Hi Kate,
I agree completely. In fact the idea of protecting women seemed to be the basis for one of his main gripes against Islam, but as you say, his own motivation seems to be just as dodgy as those he is warning against.


@Steve
"It seems to me that this idea of protecting women within the Diamond Way was a means of ingratiating yourself with them with the hope that they'll thank you by having sex with you." Yes, this is exactly the kind of motivation I witnessed in DWB, and which creates quite an unhealthy competitive environment for any man in the group wishing to learn about Buddhism.

"Nydahl claims that Muslims are using our western democratic stuctures to undermine democracy and, to some extent, he is right."
I found this line of resoning from Nydahl to be a bit insulting myself. The UK has centuries of stability and even with the situation with Irish Republicans, has finally taken some responsibility and made steps towards a peaceful resolution. I think it says something when the politicians (and the police force) seem to have a better grasp of conflict resolution than someone claiming to be a Buddhist Lama.

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SteveLpool
Nydahl claims that Muslims are using our western democratic stuctures to undermine democracy and, to some extent, he is right.

This argument would carry a lot more weight if Nydahl was promoting the values of democracy. The fact that his own stance is also a cynical attempt to undermine democratic values is what puts him in direct competition with Islam. Made even worse because while Islam is explicit about their values, Nydahl relies on political rhetoric to conceal his true motives.

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SteveLpool
Edward Bernaise was Sigmund Freuds nephew. Bernaise used his uncles ideas on the subconscious mind to help big corporations manipulate what we buy. He got the American economy moving agian in the early 1900's by convincing people "to buy things they didn't want or need". To do this he looked at a product and found a way to make us feel uncomfortable or inadequate if we didn't have that product. After creating a 'fear' that didn't really exist he could then launch the product as the antidote to the fear. Very clever man.

Nydahl does a similar thing. Create the fear then sell the antidote. The fear is that our women are under threat from Islam. Now you can feel as though you are fulfilling your macho role by protecting them.

This is an excellent and insightful analysis of the way Nydahl operates.

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corboy
And it implies that the rule of law and customs of prevailing society are not enough.

It's a cynical ploy to claim that Islam is attacking our "values" when really it is hardliners like Nydahl who are the ones attempting to change our values - the result would be for us to become a lot more like the (imagined) "enemy" based upon this response to his fear mongering.

@ Peter, welcome and thanks for contributing, and @Kate too - I think your posts show exactly just how full of holes Nydahl's "logic" is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2012 04:02AM by suenam.

Thats the problem with the teacher role in premodern societies that, as Professor Cantor put it, lack objective methods of examining leadership role and power in terms of consequences and instead see teachers, rinpoches, as unquestionable forces for enlightenment, regardless of their behavior toward human beings.

In such set ups, the teacher can interpret the rules any way he or she pleases.

Imagine what would happen to football if all at once a team could move the goal posts and change the scoring system any time that team were to lose points.

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PeterLondon
The next day I was arrested on the charge of threatening behaviour, however upon investigation it became clear to the police that I could not possibly have made a threatening phone call to number I did not have while I was asleep. Even though this was made clear to Daffyd Morris at the time, he chose to ignore the police evidence, and I can only guess that it was for the sake of group unity at the expense of the truth.
.

I guess if you are brainwashed enough to believe that Ole Nydahl is a Lama, a tulku, and that he can switch rainbows on in the sky (yes I've read hate mail to former members saying that!), then disregarding/ignoring/mentally blanking out police evidence is a small feat...