Kailua sleuth ~ I sent you a PM.

Posted by: IamtheAntiChris ()
Date: February 07, 2013 08:37AM

Mike and Carol Gabbard were the head teachers in the short lived Ponomaloa school.
this is where it started for the children to be turned into the perfect servants for Chris Butler.

most the ex-students have struggled through relationships, addiction, incarceration, abandonment, and general confusion about reintegrating back into society.

Posted by: IamtheAntiChris ()
Date: February 07, 2013 08:37AM

Mike and Carol Gabbard were the head teachers in the short lived Ponomaloa school.
this is where it started for the children to be turned into the perfect servants for Chris Butler.

most the ex-students have struggled through relationships, addiction, incarceration, abandonment, and general confusion about reintegrating back into society. HOW MANY KIDS THAT WENT TO BUTLER SCHOOL TO BECOME ROLE MODEL DEVOTEES OF BUTLER ENDED UP UNEDUCATED ...DRUG ADDICTED OR IN JAIL ...NOBODY REALLY KNOWS .

Posted by: corboy ()
Date: March 12, 2013 07:31AM

If one has consumed foot bath water or guru toe nail clippings, one has crossed a huge boundary marker.

Disgust is hard wired into our nervous system. Its of the utmost importance in assisting us to maintain boundaries.

Tamper with someone's disgust by persuading them that consuming toenail clippings is a honor and blessing, and that person's boundaries will be disrupted in all kinds of ways.

And imagine the price of waking up and changing one's mind. One has to live with the horrifying realization that one was persuaded to consume vile products of the guru's body. One would likely feel horror and disgust, not only towards those who conned us, but also would feel horrifying self disgust as well.

Many would stay locked in rather than face all this.
UNFORTUNATELY, THERE ARE LITTLE PSYCHOLOGICAL RESEARCH DONE ON SUCH EXPLOITATION
OF CHILDREN...HOW DOES AN ADULT THAT AS BEEN IN SUCH A CULT CAN RATIONALIZE THAT HIS PARENTS SAID "ITS A BLESSING TO EAT BUTLER TOE NAILS "

Posted by: VitaminC ()
Date: April 20, 2013 01:03PM
ANOTHER TESTIMONIAL OF AN EX MEMBER OF BUTLER CULT ...HUNDREDS MAY FEEL THIS WAY
EVEN IF THEY NEVER MET BUTLER IN PERSON ...KIDS IN CALIFORNIA ..AUSTRALIA ...POLAND ...WHO WHERE FORCE FEED THAT THE GURU BUTLER WAS THEIR TICKET TO SALVATION ...
For years, we were indoctrinated that to speak ill of Butler would be spiritual suicide. It became ingrained. For me, the fear was to be excommunicated, and there were those who we were told we could never talk to, never acknowledge, or interact with in any way because they were "displeasing" to the guru, so we knew the threats were real and I didnt want to be on that side of the wall.

He lost his power over me when I realized that he never cared about me, hell, he didnt even know my name. There was no spiritual connection at all, just lies for control.

The Indifference of Butler
Posted by: Vera City ()
Date: April 21, 2013 03:31AM
ANOTHER GREAT EXAMPLE OF HOW YOU CAN GIVE YEARS OF YOUR LIFE TO BUTLER
24/7 AND HE JUST FORGET WHO YOU ARE AND WHAT SERVICES YOU MAY HAVE DONE .
TO SERVE HIM ALL THOSE YEARS ...HE IS SELF ABSORB....ITS ABOUT HIM AND ONLY HIM AND A FEW AT THE TOP OF THE CULT PYRAMIDE

Your story reminds me of another exer who describes a similar experience of how Jagged Prabhufraud lost power over her. She had been a devoted servant for years - full time, 24/7. In the chaos between projects she had no place to stay or go. She had been moved around so many times on various projects but ended up with no income or means of support. Butler did not let her get married when she asked... so she returned to the mainland to get an education and continue her devotional practices with other devotees set up there. She always had in mind to return to Hawaii and Butler's direct service again, but with new and more profitable skills.

She was so poor at times working for her guru that she had to beg for tampax from women like Devahuti Gabbard or steal toilet paper from Down to Earth! Tulsi has no idea of this side of her cult! Their family always kept their distance from the worker bees. Oh sure, they will use them to hold signs on street corners, but not fraternize.

This exer recalls the days when she saw Butler daily. She felt very close to him. He would tease and joke her and always asked after her welfare. He would tell her how pleased he was with her service. She remembers his smiles and chanting with him and listening to lectures at least once a week in person. He always seemed happy and relaxed and loved to make jokes and have fun. The kirtans were magical. She felt it was such a spiritual and high time. Her letters to her mother from this time reflected happiness, peace, love, and purpose. There were no drugs or inappropriate touching or sexual things going on. Followers worked day jobs in the fields or in construction and had great vegetarian feasts on Sunday. It was a simple and peaceful life, as has been reported by several exers on this forum.

But, as the story goes, that all changed when Butler returned from India and later got interested in politics...

This exer continued to practice the religion and went back to school. After a year or two, she was called back to Hawaii to help with another big project. In the past, she would get calls personally from Butler... now he was using a secretary reminiscent of Rosa Krebbs, the James Bond villian! (From Russian With Love). Behind her back she was called Prima Donna Devi Dasi. The directive contained a veiled threat and darkness -- that Butler was displeased and her spiritual life was in danger. This secretary was the perfect messenger.

At any rate, this exer always intended to finish her degree and return to serve her guru... now she was being called back before she had completed her studies. Of course she returned to her guru immediately against the advice of professors, family, and friends.

Only this time she brought back with her the most sincere and loving boyfriend who was totally into Butler and Krishna. They were both put to work on separate projects.

She had to wait weeks before getting a meeting with Butler. In the past, she had instant and easy access to him. But being brainwashed she felt that the "guru of the world" is so busy and it would be arrogant of her to even be blessed with his presence at a kirtan, much less a glance, or even direct conversation! His message was reaching the world now and saving the planet! ...so she rationalized...

A lot had changed since she had gone away...
No more public appearances and rare private talks and kirtans. It was work all the time and listen to recorded lectures and kirtans led by his snobby and egotistical leiutenants like Mike Gabbard or Jivan Krishna das.

Her boyfriend, with whom Butler never met, set him up as an outcast from the beginning...leveling only menial jobs on him (even though he was a professional). The boyfriend took it in stride, feeling it was only meant to humble him. It did not occur to the exer that he might be jealous -- not of his girlfriend as a sexual object but an object of Butler's possession.

She remembers the meeting where she was to finally meet with Butler after being away from Hawaii. It was at some office. She was so excited to see him again after so long and couldn't wait to exchange loving greetings and smiles like they had in the past.

She instantly noticed a profound difference in him. but went into her full body prostration and obeisance recitation (as she had on a daily basis). When she rose and settled into a seating position on the floor, she noticed that his wife and another male were also in the room. His little band had grown since she had been gone so there were a lot of new faces. There he sat on his chair stiffly not really looking at anything. No light shining from his face as before. There was an akward silence between them. He looked so different now. He had no joy in his countenance, just indifference. But most curious of all, he did not seem to recognize or know who she was! After years of direct service...how was this possible!? Why such distance after all the years together?! He treated her brusquely and gave her brief but banal instructions putting her under one of his mafia leuitenants and sent away without another word. There were no "Howzit, How are you doing? What's going on? Let me tell you about my new projects..." or any indication of ever having worked with or known her...

She was so shocked by what she saw and heard that she lost her voice and could not speak. Nor was there any interest in anything she could say. Here she had given over her whole life to him and he did not even care. The brevity of the meeting and the unconcern of her guru lit a cold fire inside of her. Within a year she would physically leave the cult. It would take another 25 years to fully recover...

There were a few more instances of Butler being completely off the mark with her. But followers are brainwashed to believe that the Guru of the Universe knows ALL because he's Besties with G0d and hangs out with him in his hood... And that is the crazy thing. The evidence that Butler is not so divine was/is all over the place, but it is almost impossible to come to that conclusion. He really doesn't give a shit about anyone!

DEFINITION OF NARCISSISM
Posted by: Vera City ()
Date: April 22, 2013 04:52AM
VERA AS FOUND A GREAT DEFINITION OF WHAT IS A NARCISSIST
SO MANY ON THIS FORUM HAVE DESCRIBE THE SELF ABSORPTION OF BUTLER ...A PERSON WHO HAS CREATED SO MUCH PAINS IN SO MANY PEOPLE LIFES

The narcissist is trying to live up to a model he can't touch, to be bigger than he is as a way of hiding internal issues. Saddam Hussein is an expample. Time and again, I've seen the source as the narcissist either trying to better his father's image or to at least live up to it. The father may not have done anything to cause this, other than live a successful life.
Your challenge in having a relationship with a narcissist is that you only have value in terms of him -- you have no value, except how you impact his life. Things like your career, your family, and your pets all have to have value in his life in order for you to matter to him.
If you make him look bad, he's likely to lash out. He's already insecure. Hit his soft spots, and he will feel the need to retaliate."

Quote

"It's like being absorbed into a group of false, sometimes cruel friends. Cults have the illusion of solidarity, but Stein describes them as a perverse group of deeply lonely individuals who have lost the will and the capacity to make decisions on their own. "You can't confide in anyone in a cult," she says. "If you say, 'There seems to be a problem here,' you will be likely to be punished, so there's nowhere to go. You're scared but you've got nobody else left in your life, so you cling to the very people who are causing you that fear."

That's how cults operate: on a cycle of fear and attachment. It's Stockholm Syndrome, only more insidious and confusing because you feel like you made the choice to join when you started out."

Quoted from

[broadly.vice.com]

A cult studies psychologist named Alexandra Stein has published some
very interesting material describing the exact nature of the personal bonds
that distinguish cult leaders from genuine healers.

Fear is always part of the bond between a cultic leader (or abusive partner) and others.



A Cult Member Turned Expert Explains How Anyone Can Be Brainwashed

Dr. Alexandra Stein was brainwashed by a Marxist-Leninist sect as a young woman. Now she studies them for a living.

Quote



[broadly.vice.com]


How totalism works

The brainwashing methods of isolation, engulfment and fear can lead anyone to a cult. I should know – I was in one

Alexandra Stein

How totalism works

The brainwashing methods of isolation, engulfment and fear can lead anyone to a cult. I should know – I was in one

[aeon.co]

Professor Stein has also published a book:


Terror, Love and Brainwashing by Alexandra Stein

[www.google.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2018 10:00AM by corboy.

Posted by: corboy ()
Date: April 22, 2013 11:06AM

VERY IMPORTANT DISTINCTION OF NARCISSISM ...FOR SURE BUTLER
SOUND TO MELIKE WHAT corboy describe" Narcissistic Behavior Disorder"
SO MUCH ABUSES OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE GIVEN THEIR LIFE TO HIM ...

To extend the discussion of narcissism, here is further info.

Heinz Kohut found a distinction could be made between two forms of narcissism, one less severe, which he termed narcissistic personality disorder and a more severe manifestation, narcissistic behavior disorder.

There is an important distinction between narcissistic personality disorder and narcissistic behavior disorder.

In NPD, one feels emptiness, but in NBD the person goes so far as to use/abuse other people as objects to self soothe or self repair. In one of the citations NBD is characterized by "

These days Narcissist and Narcissism are flung about.

Each of us has a tinge of narcisisistic personality wounding...none of us has ever had a 100% trauma free upbringing.

But Narcissistic Behavior Disorder " characterized by perverse, antisocial, and addictive behaviors" is very much more grave--one is using and abusing people to repair and sooth one's fragile sense of self (which requires constant propping up) and this usage of and disposal of people leaves a trail of wreckage in one's wake.

This makes sense when one hears reports of some guru cherishing and seeming to favor someone as unique, then abruptly treating that person as an object to be disposed of.

The constant quest of a cult leader for new fresh recruits can be seen as similar to an addicts' drug seeking behavior. When that bottle of vodka (or whatever) is empty, its no longer an object of desire, but something to be tossed aside.

Posted by: tellyoulies ()
Date: May 18, 2013 06:36AM
ANOTHER VERY IMPORTANT TESTIMONIAL FROM A EX STUDENT OF THE BUTLER CULT .
AS I MENTION BEFORE I THINK ITS VERY USEFUL TO PUT IN ONE PLACE AS MUCH INFORMATION AS POSSIBLE SO THAT PEOPLE WHO RESEARCH QUICK INFORMATION ON THE BUTLER CULT WILL BE DIRECTED TO THOSE PAGES.
I was raised in this religion. I have bowed my head at Mr. Butlers feet, yes I had eaten the soups and foods made with this toenails... (not real proud to say this but it is what I was told was in the soup... got me closer to god fore sure ) Mr. Butler wanted the children not to go to public school, as the public school system was full of wicked demonic people who would help form the children in to materialistic zombies.

Mr. Butler was treated as "good as god". All sorts of people were attracted to this religion... crazy hippies, weirdos, smart wealthy people... all kinds of people. It was strict and very fundamentalist. Strict eating codes, when to eat certain foods etc etc. No meat fish our eggs.. etc etc. Did we think we were normal? I think so... but we were closely kept with all the children who were in the religion as well. So we build friendships and bonds like all children would. Our exposure to the outside world was kept limited. We went to markets, stores, but TV was restrictive. Male/Female contact was carefully monitored. boys with boys girls with girls. and our friends were devotee friends. This style of upbringing is similar to how many secular religious children were and still are raised.

I am in contact with people who are still very devoted to him. I am in contact with people I grew up with, who are no longer devoted to him. I am working on removing the blame and resentment towards Mr. Butler and my parents because.... what can I do? hate? hahahh that will not bring about anything good.