Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
RUN_FOREST_RUN
()
Date: September 13, 2024 06:13AM
Exactly!
And therein lies the danger in many of these groups and how cults and most religions spawned: Someone made some claim with little to no way to verify it and used either the mechanism of charisma, tall tales, or self-delusion groupthink to try to convince others. Think of yoga and Patanjali. Sure, some aspects of yoga make "sense" (like clogging your nostril and breathing through your asshole, for example). But in general, that is only because people apply sensible thinking to it in modern times. Because at face value if you read the yoga sutra and all the claims it makes and rituals it proposes to achieve some "state" of mind, we have NO actual verifiable examples of any of it actually working or having much value beyond making you slightly peacful while actually performing the meditation.
Once you take in ALL of the supposed vedic works, there is actually very little in the way of functional and applicable aspects of it that don't amount to much more than confirmation bias. We say some mantra has "power", but power to do what? Power to purify what? Is there a way to actually measure and see this "power" and "Purification"? Is Butler or Tusli Gabbard "purer" and less agitated by life than the average person? Is there a way to verify that most of the claims made by "Gaudiya" Vaishnavas are nothing more than the fanatical, wishful thinking of followers of their epileptic Chaitanya saint? Only they claim that he was an Incarnation of a god. Not a single other Vaishnav sect accepts or believes that, nor is there any authentic scriptural support outside of their own cult's fantastical stretch of the imagination and readings of literally 1-2 verses that only they seem to be translating to fit their agenda.
Every religion claims their saint or god is the one true and only. They only claim that some mantras have some significance, or some sciptures are "authentic" (by what measure of authority???), and some are superior (AS IT IS). The rest is PURE conjecture.
Even their goddess, whose "appearance day" it is today, is a completely made-up thing that is not even mentioned in any of their own scriptures! They say that she is mentioned, but in a very roundabout "secret" way, and claim that the fictional author of the Bhagavatam, Vyasa, would fall into a trance if he uttered her name. That is so incredibly naive and laughable to even say that it would stop any sane person from following another word. But alas!
But happy "radhasatami" to those who believe in the completely modern invention of the Radha goddess, not found in ANY scriptures. Her existence was totally manufactured and fabricated by Jayadev and subsequent medieval Indian erotic poets fixated on the sexlife of the also otherwise more recent puranic god Krishna. She only came into vogue as a worshipable deity in the last 500-1000 years MAX. She is not "Vedic" even by a gigantic stretch. Nor is Krishna, for that matter, let alone Chaitanya. NOTHING RELATED to the Vedas at all. Read the vedas and use your own mind to try to understand hem nd don't let some guru spoonfed you a line that they know the "secret". Knowledge is accessible and available to all with a functioning brain in their skull. No need to handicap yourself by listening to some self-absorbed guru like Butler who would literally die in one day if his followers left him. same with Bhaktivedanta and bhaktisiddhanta. Their missions were built and supported by the hard work of gullible, wishful thinkers. If they even asked one rational question about what these gurus were blabbing about it would fall apart. shoot, who are we kidding? It did all fall apart and continues to basically be a fallen-apart cult that has to stay relevant by rubbing shoulders with trump, kim kradashina and other foolish nonsense.
It's the straightforward and apparent mechanism of all cults:
A group of people huddles around an eccentric, charismatic leader who shares some ideas/wisdom/knowledge that may or may not have any actual use or verifiable science behind it.
They then all get addicted to doing the same activities as a group, tapping into our tribal past, and then attribute any "pleasant" feeling they get from these otherwise known pleasant activities to the cult leader/god/scripture/rituals/ideology.
Confirmation bias at that point takes hold, and there is little to nothing that can be said to dissuade the practitioner from their addiction other than if it stops serving them and causes them enough suffering in the long run.
However, as with all additions, quitting once a certain number of neuroplastic changes have occurred is complicated.
If you smell the bullshit in this and other Hare Krishna cults, do what the cool kids do...
RUN
And therein lies the danger in many of these groups and how cults and most religions spawned: Someone made some claim with little to no way to verify it and used either the mechanism of charisma, tall tales, or self-delusion groupthink to try to convince others. Think of yoga and Patanjali. Sure, some aspects of yoga make "sense" (like clogging your nostril and breathing through your asshole, for example). But in general, that is only because people apply sensible thinking to it in modern times. Because at face value if you read the yoga sutra and all the claims it makes and rituals it proposes to achieve some "state" of mind, we have NO actual verifiable examples of any of it actually working or having much value beyond making you slightly peacful while actually performing the meditation.
Once you take in ALL of the supposed vedic works, there is actually very little in the way of functional and applicable aspects of it that don't amount to much more than confirmation bias. We say some mantra has "power", but power to do what? Power to purify what? Is there a way to actually measure and see this "power" and "Purification"? Is Butler or Tusli Gabbard "purer" and less agitated by life than the average person? Is there a way to verify that most of the claims made by "Gaudiya" Vaishnavas are nothing more than the fanatical, wishful thinking of followers of their epileptic Chaitanya saint? Only they claim that he was an Incarnation of a god. Not a single other Vaishnav sect accepts or believes that, nor is there any authentic scriptural support outside of their own cult's fantastical stretch of the imagination and readings of literally 1-2 verses that only they seem to be translating to fit their agenda.
Every religion claims their saint or god is the one true and only. They only claim that some mantras have some significance, or some sciptures are "authentic" (by what measure of authority???), and some are superior (AS IT IS). The rest is PURE conjecture.
Even their goddess, whose "appearance day" it is today, is a completely made-up thing that is not even mentioned in any of their own scriptures! They say that she is mentioned, but in a very roundabout "secret" way, and claim that the fictional author of the Bhagavatam, Vyasa, would fall into a trance if he uttered her name. That is so incredibly naive and laughable to even say that it would stop any sane person from following another word. But alas!
But happy "radhasatami" to those who believe in the completely modern invention of the Radha goddess, not found in ANY scriptures. Her existence was totally manufactured and fabricated by Jayadev and subsequent medieval Indian erotic poets fixated on the sexlife of the also otherwise more recent puranic god Krishna. She only came into vogue as a worshipable deity in the last 500-1000 years MAX. She is not "Vedic" even by a gigantic stretch. Nor is Krishna, for that matter, let alone Chaitanya. NOTHING RELATED to the Vedas at all. Read the vedas and use your own mind to try to understand hem nd don't let some guru spoonfed you a line that they know the "secret". Knowledge is accessible and available to all with a functioning brain in their skull. No need to handicap yourself by listening to some self-absorbed guru like Butler who would literally die in one day if his followers left him. same with Bhaktivedanta and bhaktisiddhanta. Their missions were built and supported by the hard work of gullible, wishful thinkers. If they even asked one rational question about what these gurus were blabbing about it would fall apart. shoot, who are we kidding? It did all fall apart and continues to basically be a fallen-apart cult that has to stay relevant by rubbing shoulders with trump, kim kradashina and other foolish nonsense.
It's the straightforward and apparent mechanism of all cults:
A group of people huddles around an eccentric, charismatic leader who shares some ideas/wisdom/knowledge that may or may not have any actual use or verifiable science behind it.
They then all get addicted to doing the same activities as a group, tapping into our tribal past, and then attribute any "pleasant" feeling they get from these otherwise known pleasant activities to the cult leader/god/scripture/rituals/ideology.
Confirmation bias at that point takes hold, and there is little to nothing that can be said to dissuade the practitioner from their addiction other than if it stops serving them and causes them enough suffering in the long run.
However, as with all additions, quitting once a certain number of neuroplastic changes have occurred is complicated.
If you smell the bullshit in this and other Hare Krishna cults, do what the cool kids do...
RUN
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
RUN_FOREST_RUN
()
Date: September 13, 2024 06:17AM
On a related/belated note, this "surfer guru" hare Krishna (now dead), one Narasigha Maharaj, is shown here in his full authenticity as the violent crazy asshole he really was. But alas, we are talking about a "pure" person here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbYfFT7gknM
Similarly, we have seen many videos and heard tapes where Butler is preaching hate and vile ideas while sitting with his eyes closed tight in contemplation on his oversized ego.
Butler does not care a fig about his Polish disciples, his Filipino followers, or anyone. Even his wife cannot tolerate living with his dumb ass. He has ZERO true respect from his followers. It's all worship out of control and fear, not love and compassion and truth.
Bhaktivednata also taught like this. His favorite section of bhagavatam to translate and have his followers illustrate, and describe was the yamaraj suffering and hellish planets and kali-yuga end-days. He wanted his followers to be petrified of believing or knowing anything else. The best way to accomplish this was to isolate them in little ashrams where all they did, talked about and believed was his books and lecture tapes. If that's not a cult, I don't know what is. It's communist propaganda level bullshit. One authority/one doctrine/one belief. And they have the balls to speak of "pluralism" and non-sectarianism.
Get a load of this LOOOOOOOONNNNNNNGGGGGG ass list of ISKCON/Hare Krishna cult grievances and fallout on reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/exHareKrishna/ so damn sad.
RUN AGAIN!
Similarly, we have seen many videos and heard tapes where Butler is preaching hate and vile ideas while sitting with his eyes closed tight in contemplation on his oversized ego.
Butler does not care a fig about his Polish disciples, his Filipino followers, or anyone. Even his wife cannot tolerate living with his dumb ass. He has ZERO true respect from his followers. It's all worship out of control and fear, not love and compassion and truth.
Bhaktivednata also taught like this. His favorite section of bhagavatam to translate and have his followers illustrate, and describe was the yamaraj suffering and hellish planets and kali-yuga end-days. He wanted his followers to be petrified of believing or knowing anything else. The best way to accomplish this was to isolate them in little ashrams where all they did, talked about and believed was his books and lecture tapes. If that's not a cult, I don't know what is. It's communist propaganda level bullshit. One authority/one doctrine/one belief. And they have the balls to speak of "pluralism" and non-sectarianism.
Get a load of this LOOOOOOOONNNNNNNGGGGGG ass list of ISKCON/Hare Krishna cult grievances and fallout on reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/exHareKrishna/ so damn sad.
RUN AGAIN!
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
RUN_FOREST_RUN
()
Date: September 17, 2024 01:06PM
Crazy attracts crazy https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/other/ryan-routh-tulsi-gabbard-fan-who-wanted-to-negotiate-with-kim-jong-un/ar-AA1qEDHs
RUN
RUN
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
Culthusiast
()
Date: September 17, 2024 06:55PM
RUN_FOREST_RUN Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Exactly!
>
> And therein lies the danger in many of these
> groups and how cults and most religions spawned:
> Someone made some claim with little to no way to
> verify it and used either the mechanism of
> charisma, tall tales, or self-delusion groupthink
> to try to convince others. Think of yoga and
> Patanjali. Sure, some aspects of yoga make "sense"
> (like clogging your nostril and breathing through
> your asshole, for example). But in general, that
> is only because people apply sensible thinking to
> it in modern times. Because at face value if you
> read the yoga sutra and all the claims it makes
> and rituals it proposes to achieve some "state" of
> mind, we have NO actual verifiable examples of any
> of it actually working or having much value beyond
> making you slightly peacful while actually
> performing the meditation.
One technique is to escape forward. Raising a more subtle, profound, detailed topic that allows the "guru" to maintain the image of the most advanced. Still the most enlighted.
>
> Once you take in ALL of the supposed vedic works,
> there is actually very little in the way of
> functional and applicable aspects of it that don't
> amount to much more than confirmation bias. We say
> some mantra has "power", but power to do what?
> Power to purify what? Is there a way to actually
> measure and see this "power" and "Purification"?
> Is Butler or Tusli Gabbard "purer" and less
> agitated by life than the average person? Is there
> a way to verify that most of the claims made by
> "Gaudiya" Vaishnavas are nothing more than the
> fanatical, wishful thinking of followers of their
> epileptic Chaitanya saint? Only they claim that he
> was an Incarnation of a god. Not a single other
> Vaishnav sect accepts or believes that, nor is
> there any authentic scriptural support outside of
> their own cult's fantastical stretch of the
> imagination and readings of literally 1-2 verses
> that only they seem to be translating to fit their
> agenda.
One can discuss the influence of mantras in the context of the brain as a neural network and the dynamics of this neural network. Without feedback, with feedback, an impulse network, then move on to the mechanisms of learning, i.e. consolidating and building new connections and of course connecting this network with the entire organism, taking into account the "second brain". Network dynamics, stability. The influence of mantras on brain waveforms. Of course, the chemical factor also comes into play here. Neurotransmitters, metal contamination, i.e. changing the characteristics. Dysokinesis of neurons. The very structure of the brain consisting of two hemispheres and other parts. The cerebellum. One can refer to certain issues from the Vedas, i.e. "tamas" - i.e. the influence of e.g. alcohol on neurokinetics. Food that suppresses the correct functioning of the neural network. Or "passion" - focusing on a narrow sensory area intensified by strengthening selected neural connections to the neglect of broader aspects of life. What influence is the mantra supposed to have on this? Conceptual? Suppress? Memory? Focus on narrow concepts?
Sound representation of reality. Frequency. Does the brain think in words or images or both images and words. Taste, smell, is it not a wave representation? Ultimately, one can also try to describe the orbitals of molecules in waves. The well-known and daily observed JPG compression is a two-dimensional cosine transform. Cutting off higher harmonics. Abrupt tonal and color transitions throw bugs to the edges.
In practice, in the case of sick people who have memory problems, it turns out that the memory, e.g. image memory, is recorded somewhere there but there is a problem with reading it. And here is the influence of food, drugs or emotions on facilitating access to this memory.
> Every religion claims their saint or god is the
> one true and only. They only claim that some
> mantras have some significance, or some sciptures
> are "authentic" (by what measure of authority???),
> and some are superior (AS IT IS). The rest is PURE
> conjecture.
Each sect offers exclusive salvation and only one complete vision and interpretation of the scriptures.
> Even his wife cannot tolerate living with his dumb ass.
Can you write more about it?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2024 06:56PM by Culthusiast.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Exactly!
>
> And therein lies the danger in many of these
> groups and how cults and most religions spawned:
> Someone made some claim with little to no way to
> verify it and used either the mechanism of
> charisma, tall tales, or self-delusion groupthink
> to try to convince others. Think of yoga and
> Patanjali. Sure, some aspects of yoga make "sense"
> (like clogging your nostril and breathing through
> your asshole, for example). But in general, that
> is only because people apply sensible thinking to
> it in modern times. Because at face value if you
> read the yoga sutra and all the claims it makes
> and rituals it proposes to achieve some "state" of
> mind, we have NO actual verifiable examples of any
> of it actually working or having much value beyond
> making you slightly peacful while actually
> performing the meditation.
One technique is to escape forward. Raising a more subtle, profound, detailed topic that allows the "guru" to maintain the image of the most advanced. Still the most enlighted.
>
> Once you take in ALL of the supposed vedic works,
> there is actually very little in the way of
> functional and applicable aspects of it that don't
> amount to much more than confirmation bias. We say
> some mantra has "power", but power to do what?
> Power to purify what? Is there a way to actually
> measure and see this "power" and "Purification"?
> Is Butler or Tusli Gabbard "purer" and less
> agitated by life than the average person? Is there
> a way to verify that most of the claims made by
> "Gaudiya" Vaishnavas are nothing more than the
> fanatical, wishful thinking of followers of their
> epileptic Chaitanya saint? Only they claim that he
> was an Incarnation of a god. Not a single other
> Vaishnav sect accepts or believes that, nor is
> there any authentic scriptural support outside of
> their own cult's fantastical stretch of the
> imagination and readings of literally 1-2 verses
> that only they seem to be translating to fit their
> agenda.
One can discuss the influence of mantras in the context of the brain as a neural network and the dynamics of this neural network. Without feedback, with feedback, an impulse network, then move on to the mechanisms of learning, i.e. consolidating and building new connections and of course connecting this network with the entire organism, taking into account the "second brain". Network dynamics, stability. The influence of mantras on brain waveforms. Of course, the chemical factor also comes into play here. Neurotransmitters, metal contamination, i.e. changing the characteristics. Dysokinesis of neurons. The very structure of the brain consisting of two hemispheres and other parts. The cerebellum. One can refer to certain issues from the Vedas, i.e. "tamas" - i.e. the influence of e.g. alcohol on neurokinetics. Food that suppresses the correct functioning of the neural network. Or "passion" - focusing on a narrow sensory area intensified by strengthening selected neural connections to the neglect of broader aspects of life. What influence is the mantra supposed to have on this? Conceptual? Suppress? Memory? Focus on narrow concepts?
Sound representation of reality. Frequency. Does the brain think in words or images or both images and words. Taste, smell, is it not a wave representation? Ultimately, one can also try to describe the orbitals of molecules in waves. The well-known and daily observed JPG compression is a two-dimensional cosine transform. Cutting off higher harmonics. Abrupt tonal and color transitions throw bugs to the edges.
In practice, in the case of sick people who have memory problems, it turns out that the memory, e.g. image memory, is recorded somewhere there but there is a problem with reading it. And here is the influence of food, drugs or emotions on facilitating access to this memory.
> Every religion claims their saint or god is the
> one true and only. They only claim that some
> mantras have some significance, or some sciptures
> are "authentic" (by what measure of authority???),
> and some are superior (AS IT IS). The rest is PURE
> conjecture.
Each sect offers exclusive salvation and only one complete vision and interpretation of the scriptures.
> Even his wife cannot tolerate living with his dumb ass.
Can you write more about it?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2024 06:56PM by Culthusiast.
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
Culthusiast
()
Date: September 17, 2024 07:07PM
Theoretical question: can chemical changes in neurons cause obsessive thoughts, auto-firing and winding up? Positive feedback? Let's say the shape of the impulse changes. So the Fourier series expansion is different. And if now some harmonic activates a given neuron anyway and it propagates further, it would mean that at the base the chemical influence that changed the frequency characteristic of the impulse causes the brain to fire on idle, parallel courses, auto-generated noise... And then such a guy runs down the street and howls...
Give him some mantra? But how to suppress these harmonics? Special ragi's? Non-linear?
1 min 36 second!
[www.youtube.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2024 07:12PM by Culthusiast.
Give him some mantra? But how to suppress these harmonics? Special ragi's? Non-linear?
1 min 36 second!
[www.youtube.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2024 07:12PM by Culthusiast.
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
Culthusiast
()
Date: September 17, 2024 08:24PM
Or of course another "mantra role" - military march (mood; with music; emotions). German example:
[www.youtube.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2024 08:24PM by Culthusiast.
[www.youtube.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2024 08:24PM by Culthusiast.
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
RUN_FOREST_RUN
()
Date: September 18, 2024 10:01PM
More and more people are aware of this cults connection to Tulsi Gabbard.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/tulsi-gabbard-says-she-would-be-honored-to-join-a-potential-trump-administration/ar-AA1qJqok]https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/tulsi-gabbard-says-she-would-be-honored-to-join-a-potential-trump-administration/ar-AA1qJqok[/url]
I see comments like this regularly on news posts:
Terry Smith
16h
She was raised in part with the teachings of the Science of Identity Foundation (SIF), a Vaishnava Hindu organization, connected with International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON). Gabbard was homeschooled for some years through high school, and also attended two years at an all-girls boarding school in the Philippines. Gabbard settled into the Hindu faith as a teenager. I see why a cult would be appealing to Tulsi.
RUN
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/tulsi-gabbard-says-she-would-be-honored-to-join-a-potential-trump-administration/ar-AA1qJqok]https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/tulsi-gabbard-says-she-would-be-honored-to-join-a-potential-trump-administration/ar-AA1qJqok[/url]
I see comments like this regularly on news posts:
Terry Smith
16h
She was raised in part with the teachings of the Science of Identity Foundation (SIF), a Vaishnava Hindu organization, connected with International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON). Gabbard was homeschooled for some years through high school, and also attended two years at an all-girls boarding school in the Philippines. Gabbard settled into the Hindu faith as a teenager. I see why a cult would be appealing to Tulsi.
RUN
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
just-googling
()
Date: September 25, 2024 05:31AM
Signs and symptoms of malignant narcissists:
1. Preoccupied with fantasies about beauty, brilliance, success, and power.
2. Unable to handle criticism.
3. Tendency to lash out if they feel slighted.
4. Likely to take advantage of others to get what they want.
5. Overly concerned about their appearance.
6. Expect to be treated as superior and craves validation.
7. Lack of empathy for others.
8. Inflated sense of self and inability to self-regulate.
9. No remorse for hurting others and no interest in apologizing.
10. Attitude of deserving the best of everything.
11. Tendency to monopolize conversations.
12. Hidden insecurity.
13. Tendency to blame others for their own bad behavior.
1. Preoccupied with fantasies about beauty, brilliance, success, and power.
2. Unable to handle criticism.
3. Tendency to lash out if they feel slighted.
4. Likely to take advantage of others to get what they want.
5. Overly concerned about their appearance.
6. Expect to be treated as superior and craves validation.
7. Lack of empathy for others.
8. Inflated sense of self and inability to self-regulate.
9. No remorse for hurting others and no interest in apologizing.
10. Attitude of deserving the best of everything.
11. Tendency to monopolize conversations.
12. Hidden insecurity.
13. Tendency to blame others for their own bad behavior.
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
RUN_FOREST_RUN
()
Date: October 04, 2024 03:26AM
Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 04, 2024 11:30PM
Traits of some narcissists when confronted with serious questions:
Long speeches - mind numbingly long speeches. Often it's the same speech with minor variations.
You are so bored you want to fucking scream.
People become afraid to question or challenge the person because they get sick of hearing the same verbal spew they've endured a thousand times before.
Long speeches - mind numbingly long speeches. Often it's the same speech with minor variations.
You are so bored you want to fucking scream.
People become afraid to question or challenge the person because they get sick of hearing the same verbal spew they've endured a thousand times before.
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