Quotesman - I don't think Christians find it acceptable that Christ suffered - most are deeply saddened by this, mourn his passion, and mourn their own frailty when they consider how weak they are and yet look what Christ did.

Anyway - I do not want to get into a debate with you either, nor I am even remotely qualified to do so. I prefer to look at the similarities of Christianity and Vaishnavism - loving and serving God. I see no difference in Krishna and the God of Abraham.

However, as so beautifully evidenced by the prayers of Queen Kunti - I think Vaishanavas pursue a much more personal relationship with the Lord himself.

Another observation of FL - he doesn't seem to talk much about HIS relationship with the Lord. As Queen Kunti prayed - "you reveal yourself to the surrendered souls". Years ago, a close member of his inner circle asked him to reveal to the devotees his intimate relationship with Krishna - but he never has.

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hoax108
Quotesman - I don't think Christians find it acceptable that Christ suffered - most are deeply saddened by this, mourn his passion, and mourn their own frailty when they consider how weak they are and yet look what Christ did.

Anyway - I do not want to get into a debate with you either, nor I am even remotely qualified to do so. I prefer to look at the similarities of Christianity and Vaishnavism - loving and serving God. I see no difference in Krishna and the God of Abraham.

However, as so beautifully evidenced by the prayers of Queen Kunti - I think Vaishanavas pursue a much more personal relationship with the Lord himself.

Another observation of FL - he doesn't seem to talk much about HIS relationship with the Lord. As Queen Kunti prayed - "you reveal yourself to the surrendered souls". Years ago, a close member of his inner circle asked him to reveal to the devotees his intimate relationship with Krishna - but he never has.

I agree with you it is better to find harmonious points rather than fight over who is right. Just like a diamond may be viewed from different angles. One will say the diamond is yellow, another green, yet another orange. All contradict each other and all are correct. God is a lot bigger than any of us can comprehend and I am sure there will be major surprizes for all of us at the anointed hour.

What FL has is a personality cult. It is all about what FL says, it all points to him. Just look at the stuff appearing on the internet now. FL says this Fl says that, FL is pure, FL knows it all, bla bla bla. Yes you can see the big difference between a Vaishnava (Queen Kunti) and her behavior as opposed to FL.

The most absurd thing is he HAS indicated his relationship in subtle ways. In fact not only has he NOT realized his SIDDHA SWARUPA, he never even realized Brahman.

A brahman realized soul does not take sannyasa and then marry his spiritual daughter. This is not the behavior of even a bona-fide impersonlist, who has realized Brahman much less a Vaishnava.

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hoax108
Quotesman - I don't think Christians find it acceptable that Christ suffered - most are deeply saddened by this, mourn his passion, and mourn their own frailty when they consider how weak they are and yet look what Christ did.

Anyway - I do not want to get into a debate with you either, nor I am even remotely qualified to do so. I prefer to look at the similarities of Christianity and Vaishnavism - loving and serving God. I see no difference in Krishna and the God of Abraham.

However, as so beautifully evidenced by the prayers of Queen Kunti - I think Vaishanavas pursue a much more personal relationship with the Lord himself.

Another observation of FL - he doesn't seem to talk much about HIS relationship with the Lord. As Queen Kunti prayed - "you reveal yourself to the surrendered souls". Years ago, a close member of his inner circle asked him to reveal to the devotees his intimate relationship with Krishna - but he never has.

Actually according to Vaishnava philosophy God gives the faith to know Him in different ways. He says all are on the path and He rewards accordingly. There is absolutely nothing wrong with you thinking your path is the best. If not why would you follow it? Similarly I think I am on the best path and if I did not I would change it. That is the Vaishnava view of things. I may try to convince you to change your path but if I cannot then I encourage you to go on the path you are on with faith. That is how we are supposed to preach Krishna Consciousness. Of course if we are challenged we DO take challenges.

I think my view of the diamond is best and you think yours best. We can have harmony in diversity within our different religious beliefs.

The point being. Stick to the path you are on. Do not mix things up. That instruction was also given by ACB to others who could not accept the Vaishnava path.

Yeah - good point about his marriage. Just focusing on that one point is enough to question what the heck is going on.

So - to any devotees of Siddha there who are reading this - and we KNOW you are - how you you address the fact that he took sannyasa and then married his disciple?

Are you okay with the fact that he is making up his own rules?

How does this NOT contradict his supposed spiritual enlightenment?

There are other questions but this is a good start.

Something else I will throw out here that is mostly common knowledge within the Krishna Conciousness movement now. These stories are accept as fact by many. One of ACB follows was a transvestite who are switching back and forth. ACB instructed him to try to figure out if he was male or female and then stick to one. On another occaision one gay discple admitted he could not give up illiciti sex. ACB instructed, and I quote, ’then find a nice boy and settle down.’

Anyone can take these things anyway they like but there are even acharyas in the movement who believe that is what was said. Do I believe it? It think it is very possible that a liberal Vaishnava Guru would say such things.

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Regarding the restaurant, why they should get salary? There should be no salary. You are working without salary, so why they should take. [b:4b75f2a4f9]They are not very important men[/b:4b75f2a4f9]. So after this month arrange for no one to get any salary there. That will be nice.

A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami

:( Yikes - whatever happened to "we are all equal in the eyes of God"?

What about the story of Ramachandra admonishing the monkey king for saying the little spider was not important??? (the spider had tried to help build the bridge to Sri Lanka by kicking a very small bit of dirt into the ocean.)

:?

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quotesman
On another occaision one gay discple admitted he could not give up illiciti sex. ACB instructed, and I quote, ’then find a nice boy and settle down.’

.

Methinks that some perverted followers of ACB took the "BOY" part too literally.
It's one thing to be gay between consenting adults.
It's one thing to not be able to be celibate.
But it is quite another to ruin innocent chidren's lives! :evil: :evil: :evil:

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just-googling

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Regarding the restaurant, why they should get salary? There should be no salary. You are working without salary, so why they should take. [b:b59d331add]They are not very important men[/b:b59d331add]. So after this month arrange for no one to get any salary there. That will be nice.

A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami

:( Yikes - whatever happened to "we are all equal in the eyes of God"?

What about the story of Ramachandra admonishing the monkey king for saying the little spider was not important??? (the spider had tried to help build the bridge to Sri Lanka by kicking a very small bit of dirt into the ocean.)

:?

In this FL Prabhufraud was the perfect mimic and follower!
Isn't the rotten attitude self evident!

Okay. Enough.
There are over a hundred pages
from all different angles
about FL and his little cult.
(I'm not suggesting that the discussion should end).

But now what?
What is theSOLUTION?
Can we discuss and FOCUS ON SOLUTIONS for:
The children still in the cult?
Members who want to reform things?
People who want out but are afraid?
How would you advise these people?
Support them?
What will make a positive difference in their lives?