It is an old cliche that those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it - exactly how much do these followers know about the history of their religion/organisation/guru? Read your guru's books - ALL of them. Read his tax return. Figure out that Qi-gong and Kundalini are the SAME damn thing.

This is what was posted on a discussion in 2005

Does anyone know his current mailing address? [u:8f81017642]One of the things I'm suggesting is that the family write to him directly about the behaviors of his followers that disturb them.[/u:8f81017642] I found an address but I don't know how current it is.

What I have is:

Srila Jagad Guru Siddhasvarupananda Paramahamsa
P.O. Box 27-450
Honolulu, Hawaii 96827

I think it may be that he isn't aware of all the things they do and if they are behaving in a coercive manner he ought to know about it. If he doesn't intervene, then that is a good indication of where he's really at. But I'm betting that he'd be unhappy to know that they are pursuing a minor in an aggressive fashion. Even on the level of wanting to preach it's counterproductive to risk such bad publicity. I'd think they'd want to present themselves as very different from ISKCON with its pushy tactics.

[www.gaudiya-repercussions.com]

Can there still linger any doubt that Siddhaswarupananda is NOT aware?Does anyone here feel that he is actually disturbed? One would think that he has certainly been shaken - although it would not be for the first time it is quite serious and obviously very difficult to dismiss but it does not appear that Siddhaswarupananda takes the issues seriously. Why indeed has he not simply come down and said ok you want instruction then here is my instruction?

Has anyone here tried to write to or email him besides cultreporter? Would it be worth the effort?

Jeannie Bishop is clearly not qualified or confident enough to deal with these issues - once she is saying that you cannot accept anyone but guru's instructions then she is handing out instructions. Plainly it is said to her I want to talk to the organ grinder not the monkey and yet there is only monkies to be had!

It seemed to me to be a last ditch attempt on her behalf to appeal to the regulation of Vaishnava Aparadha and fancy the audacity to appeal to the goodness and spiritual integrity of someone you have just denounced as a demon?!? Learn to read Jeannie - no demon would continuously appeal to reason and reform. It is in the league of saints to have sympathy for the devil and his disciples.

And who is this Jeannie to talk when she was shacked up with guru himself? That is much the pot telling the kettle it has a dirty bottom isn't it? Anyone who has ever read here knows that all this trouble started from a girl doing exactly that but considerably less considering that hers was just a noneity of a student of no consequence whatsoever. On top of that we have that Jeannie started this entire thread by stealing a child??

Chaitanya was thought to be a fool by his own spiritual master - he completely changed everything - so to say that one should follow the example of Chaitanya is to only encourage them to be a revolutionary! [www.gaudiya.com]

Siddhaswarupananda had enough sense to realise that orange dresses and painting Krishna's foot on your head fresh from a cold shower was just unappealing - but that was way back in the seventies.

Siddhaswarupananda should look fondly on one that is following his own example and that Jeannie Bishop should be apologising herself for being such a beligerrent hypocrite.

Dont you worry all you confused and mystified wandering about followers. Here is old used car salesman Zelic to help you out! When the Master returns from the surf, he will answer all your questions in full, but in the meantime, good old Zelic himself is here and although his english grammar is not the best, he has a good hart. Remember that young snotty nose pup Rama. Its an old douche bag like me who can reports on execctly what heppened then! When you were still a 3 yr old pup catching a nice wave on waikiki. I was your old uncle watching you in the background and thinking, hell, what did we spawn here? A goddemmn radddical free thinker! Yessuh, i love it, Ima grammar mashing punk thru and thru.

Somebody is running the show, on some level. JG may have his nest egg, but there are still a few people at the top who are interested in keeping the whole thing alive and guarded. They must be getting something out of it, right? No one would be so concerned in shutting you up if they didn't have a vested interest in guarding the cult secrets.

This is really the hard stuff. If its really a show, their people need to know! They run their whole lives on this gig, and if its shit, they need to know its shit.

Nah, zelig, you ain't no grammar mashing punk, just an insane creepy old man.

GET A LIFE and stop sucking it out of everyone else.

And by the way, we don't need your report since we have already had it twice. Not to mention your truly creepy open letter to Chris Butler... more like a love letter. "Oh, to stroke your hair once more, Chris, to frolic through the dewey daffodils like we used to... you used to be such a sweet and becoming PSYCOPATHIC CONTROL FREAK/HELL SPAWNED JIBBERING DEMON CREATURE. Come sweep me off my feet once again."

Brilliant, man. Really great.

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Rama Das (slave name)
Not to mention your truly creepy open letter to Chris Butler... more like a love letter. "Oh, to stroke your hair once more, Chris, to frolic through the dewey daffodils like we used to... you used to be such a sweet and becoming PSYCOPATHIC CONTROL FREAK/HELL SPAWNED JIBBERING DEMON CREATURE. Come sweep me off my feet once again."

Brilliant, man. Really great.

Sai Speaks page 5 - a picture really does say a thousand words :wink: - not to mention :

When you were still a 3 yr old pup catching a nice wave on waikiki. I was your old uncle watching you in the background - you like to hang out watching young boys at the beach? I've heard of disciples like you and its all bad :x

Z'sUSEDCARSALESYARD has been banned from the board.

Seemed like another "troll."

But let's not have "flame wars."

Most people familiar with the Science of Identity Foundation know of its member's political activism in the area of opposition to lesbian and gay rights. Some would know about their anti abortion positions and activism.

People keeping an eye on SIF are probably less familiar with its efforts and success in fighting fluoridation of drinking water in Hawaii.

As background, readers should know that Hawaii has some of the worst dental statistics in the nation. Tooth decay among Hawaii children is 100% higher than the national average.

[www.healthysmileshawaii.com]

The success is that in January 2004, Honolulu City Council passed Bill 66 which banned water fluoridation on the Island of Oahu. (The ordinance does not apply to military bases. Drinking water is fluoridated on all Hawaii military bases.)

[the.honoluluadvertiser.com]


I had heard on the radio that Mike Gabbard, who was a Honolulu City Councilman at the time, had introduced Bill 66. But it looks like it was introduced by another councilman, Rod Tam.

There are anti water fluoridation articles on the Down To Earth website.

[www.downtoearth.org]

There were anti water fluoridation pamphlets in all the DTE stores that I have visited.

And, of course, word went out on a weekly radio program that is run by a member of the cult.

I have wondered why the cult would be so interested in promoting bad dental health. I suspect that it might because of karma. If someone is prorone to tooth decay, that might be because of their karma from a previous life. Having fluoride in the water, to prevent or reduce that tooth decay, would interfere with that karma.

I would be interested in comments from others who are familiar with the cult's teachings (and Hindu fundamentalist teachings, in general).

I believe that Mike Gabbard set up a non-profit called "The Healthy Hawaii Coalition" to fight against fluoridation, among other things.

Right now water fluoridation is banned only on Oahu. But cult members and others are gearing up for an effort to get it banned on all the islands.

Just for the record, there was no fluoridation of public drinking water anywhere in Hawaii, except at military bases, before Bill 66 was enacted. There was no serious discussion of even enacting legislation to fluoridate Hawaii's water at the time Bill 66 was enacted.

Of the 50 largest cities in the U.S. only four do not have fluoridated water, including Honolulu.

Dr. Mark Greer, who is the Division Chief of the Dental Division of the Hawaii State Department of Health, is a proponent of water fluoridation. As you can imagine, he is a target of derision of SIF cult members.

Clearly you have found yet another example of how SoI exerts their influence politically, well done. As to the question of why they are interested in this from a modern hippie perspective :

There is a lot of information available that actually supports not having flouride in the water, it is a trend among the health conscious and alternative minded to avoid flouride and campaign against it. If you pick up any of those natural living papers or magazines (I assume they have indy media in America) then you will see a variety of products to neutralise flouride in drinking water and recurring articles on the subject.

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For decades the message that fluoride safely prevents tooth decay has been considered sacrosanct. This idea came from the same "chemicals for better living" era that also told us that smoking cigarettes soothed the throat.

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Meanwhile, tooth decay trends tracked by the World Health Organization from 1970 to the present show that the incidence of decayed, missing or filled teeth has been steadily in decline with each passing year in the U.S., France, Germany, Japan, Italy, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Norway, The Netherlands, Northern Ireland, Austria, Belgium, Portugal, Iceland and Greece. And why are the numbers of decayed teeth on the decline? Better oral hygiene and improved dental practice is the most obvious answer. It's certainly not the fluoride. Because of all of those countries, only one adds fluoride to the public water supply: the United States.

[www.ghchealth.com]

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Fluoridation is a totally new idea, from a Constitutional point of view. It's nothing like adding chlorine. Although chlorine has toxic side effects, it actually does something beneficial to the water - chlorine purifies the water. Fluoride does no such thing. Fluoride is a drug, a medication that supposedly has beneficial effects for a small percentage of the population.

"The purpose of administering fluoride is not to render the water supply pure and potable but to contaminate it with a dangerous toxic drug for the purpose of administering mass medication to the consumer without regard to age or physical condition."

[www.mercola.com]

Rama das is it possible that I could talk to you though PM or email?

Hi, I made a post a little while ago to see if the board was still active. Since then I have been reading the posts from the very beginning. Quiet an eclectic set of topics since the initial question.

My question is more in regards to moving on after having been a member for sometime. Life after Siddha if you will. I have been out of the group for 10 years and was a serious member for 5. As I mentioned before I was very serious and was considered an advanced student going as far as approaching for initiation. I lived in Hawaii for a while even doing personal service for JG. Some of what I have read is true, some has been news to me and has opened my eyes and some has been speculation and wild exaggeration.

I have known many of the advanced devotees discussed and found them to be sincere and committed to their spiritual life as they understood it. Even the closer I got I always felt I had the option to say no and in the end I did say no more. However, since the beginning all that anyone ever asked of me was to chant the holy name. And they seemed genuinely concerned that I do this

I think what also needs to be taken into account when discussing any group is the effect of group think. Some symptoms of Group think is include

“In order to make groupthink testable, Irving Janis devised eight symptoms that are indicative of groupthink (1977).”
1.A feeling of invulnerability creates excessive optimism and encourages risk taking.
2.Discounting warnings that might challenge assumptions.
3.An unquestioned belief in the group’s morality, causing members to ignore the consequences of their actions.
4.Stereotyped views of enemy leaders.
5.Pressure to conform against members of the group who disagree.
6.Shutting down of ideas that deviate from the apparent group consensus.
7.An illusion of unanimity with regards to going along with the group.
8.Mindguards — self-appointed members who shield the group from dissenting opinions.

This phenomemon is not exclusive to cults and could readily explain the people in charge of the lead up to the gulf war.

Anyway back to me. Definitely the first crack in my unquesitoning belief was the anti-homosexual activities going on. It was first explained as we are not our body so identifying with your sexual preference is identifying with your body. But why all the effort to stop it? Isn’t identifying oneself with one"s ethnicity the same thing.? Why not a campaig against that?

My question though is I thought I really found something and I really connected with the holy name. I still love to chant. I rarely chant japa (beeds) but do my own kirtan all the time. If it was all bullshit and brainwashing is the chanting also? Am I just deluding myself? Has anyone been a devotee and fallen out and found their way back to the life of a viashnava? Since 10 years has gone by I feel I have made some peace with it all, at first I could not even chant the maha mantra. Now I enjoy singing the names and it feels spiritual and I know I could benefit from instrution and association. Man that is a lot to type and I have much more to say/ask/explain but I hate writing.

My new mantra is trust those seeking the truth, doubt those that have found it!

Namaste,
yournamedas

p.s.

I never went back to eating meat and that feels right too.