Z'sUSEDCARSALESYARD:

Please refrain from name calling.

Z'sUSEDCARSALESYARD

third time's a charm, I guess.

yeah, definately zelig.

what a douche bag.

Again, please refrain from name calling.

I'd like to provide some food for thought:

I have heard some of Jagad Guru's lectures on Jesus and read some of his writings regarding him as well. It always appeared to me that he had great reverence for Christ and considered him to be a bona fide representative of God.

Personally, I think that Christ was much more than God's representative but I am certainly not here to preach, nor am I in a position to preach. But since Jagad Guru holds himself out to be God's representative and his followers worship him as such, I think it is important to make a comparison. In other words, how does JG hold up against Jesus?

I recently came across a description of Jesus as having exhibited to perfection the following 9 spiritual fruits: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control.

If these are the characteristics of a "pure devotee", do we see JG manifesting them to the fullest as well? Has he made it his mission to instill in his followers the same qualities? How is JG taking the instructions from Jesus and applying them in his life and inspiring others to do the same?

I know that Jagad Guru falls well short here. Anyone else have any thoughts?

I am pretty sure that we have seen the broken rasta style talking before from memory it was buckwheat?? When the weather is too bad for surfing or theyre not drawing cartoons for guru I think the young devotee guys still need something to do. Maybe that is a bit sexist but I dont think the girls would know how to use a computer or have time between cooking and babies and all.

A little bird has told me back when this thread started that there was a controversy going on with SoI which explains all the interest taken in trolling the thread and the apologetics that were banned way back. The story as it was told to me makes quite a bit of sense.

Firstly of all there are at least two cases in the Phillipines of SoI taking legal action to ensure that they get to assume control over children/teenagers rather than their parents. I hear that there is one case in Poland where this happened that actually received some media coverage going back a few years and have seen references to a case in America for child custody where it was alledged by a lawyer that SoI had a documented history of taking people's kids.

From my time in the cult I would say that I know of at least three cases where this happened although at the time there definitely is a shortage of legal documents available. The instances mentioned above I am doing what I can to get hold of the documents so they can be published.

Apparently the key players outside SoI are dead now under co-incidental if not downright suspicious circumstances.

The original upset I am told was a child being taken to Hawaii by Jeannie Bishop. The family wanted her back and the cult wasn't having it. What the connection to the cult and the child was I am not sure but the family was determined to get the facts about SoI so that they could get the authorities to act. Apparently I should ask Jeannie Bishop what happened to Rosalie? although somehow I dont think that she will answer.

Quote
hoax108
If these are the characteristics of a "pure devotee", do we see JG manifesting them to the fullest as well? Has he made it his mission to instill in his followers the same qualities? How is JG taking the instructions from Jesus and applying them in his life and inspiring others to do the same?

I know that Jagad Guru falls well short here. Anyone else have any thoughts?

Not only that but every example of a pure devotee including Jesus for those who recognise him as such actually KNEW their disciples and ensured that they had the oppotunity to learn from them before being declared competent teachers and representatives on their behalf. Chaitanya also made his disciples and they carried on his mission in the same way. None had more students than they were able to teach or be responsible for. Jesus knew and loved his disciples very intimately but Chris Butler wouldn't even be able to name his let alone know anything about them.

It think it's interesting to note that Yogananda (although he himself is most likely also guilty of being a "bogey yogi"), defined the word "Chaitanya" as referring to "Christ Consciousness".

Again - an important point is that all good teachers lead by example. What example is JG demonstrating?

What you are asking is more or less a rhetorical question, even if you did not intend it in that way since if you have to ask, expecially when you have associated with his followers and had access to his teachings then Jagad Guru definitely isnt leading a very good example.

In the disciplic sucession the ability to follow the example of all the spiritual masters before you is the quality of a bonafide guru.

[u:4b8672988b]Chris Butler DID NOT EVER follow the instructions of AC Bhaktivedanta Swami [/color:4b8672988b][/u:4b8672988b]therefore he is not bonafide - end of story.

Good point about JG not following the instructions of ACB. That does really say it all right there.

The funny thing is that this is kept hidden. I've heard lectures where JG goes on about his spiritual master to create the impression that he was surrendered to him and served him and so on.

I'd often wondered about this as well. I mean the story kind of went that JG had achieved the "merging into the light - the brahmajoyti" but then somehow came into contact with ACB who told him that he could go higher.

So JG becomes his disciple and then fairly soon thereafter is a pure devotee of Krishna. Just doesn't sit right with me.