Dear JB

While all of this is interesting, I find it odd that you refuse to accept the statement of CF at face value, he stated clearly that it was the weekend and that he was waiting to contact the site owners. I appreciate your and all of our concers. But your ability to produce collateral damage is appalling!

You set out a vast list of questions and answers and expect immediate replies, some people have lives and work you know! lol Do you honestly think that they will just say er, um ok JB we will spend time and money, yes money! on running down to the offices you mentioned and filling in forms, writing legal letters on a whim.

For a start they will need to read all of the web pages and do their own reseach. Thats download a small novel and also probably seek clarification from other sources, not just internet based speculation. I say speculation because we still have no proven case against CH. There has been no arrests, trial, caution that we are aware of.

My standpoint has always been that CH called himself a physician of Tibetan Medicine, any action he as performed should be judged by the same standard of ethics as any other doctor and treated as such under UK law.

James

Before you state the possibility.. no I am not associated with CH, no I am not associated with Tibetanway.

James



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/2008 06:13AM by Real-name-gone.

posted this in the wrong place by accident.. damnation.. its morning and I need more tea!

In light of the public statement featured on Hansard's website

[www.bonmedicine.com]

there would seem to be an association between Christopher Hansard and Tibetan Way, through the apparent involvement of former Eden Medical (sic) Center associates and marketing of so-called medical products 'formulated' by the ex-'thunder being' and his un-seeing, un-aware and un-critical colleagues.

That being the case, as Hansard's claims to being a Physician of Tibetan medicine have been shown to be completely bogus, any assertion or promotion by Tibetan Way to be preparing and selling authentic Tibetan Medicine must now be considered seriously misleading and inaccurate.

There is of course also the possibility that Mr.Hansard's recent statement is designed to deflect attention away from his own involvement, anything is of course possible with the Master of Dur-Con.

Matters may now be taken to the appropriate authorities, who no doubt will be rather interested to note the trading activities and claims made by Tibetan Way.

Jeff,
Please be more mindful of the accusations and statements you make on this site. You're serious investigation and knowledge of Tibetan culture are valued, but there may come a time when potentially defamatory remarks on the internet are taken more seriously by law.

Dear Treatmegood,

Please re-read my comment with more care, and you will note that it opens with the term 'speculation' clearly emphasised to make clear that there was no longer any doubt concerning reports of abuse, or indeed Hansard's troubling activities

"Speculation as to whether Hansard abused people in the past, or is not engaged in such odious actions presently, with respect, is a redundant debate..."

I am unsure how this could be reasonably interpreted as me implying that the abuses per se were not relevant, or of critical concern, any more than I am unfeeling or disrespectful of those who make such charges. I hope that clarifies my position for you.

Atlantic, thank you for your kind comments, my critical examination is, as always, presented within a speculative framework.

However, as I have stated previously I would welcome any opportunty to examine, under legal and public scrutiny, the claims and activities of Christopher Hansard and his various projects.

Okay, this is basically an exercise in teaching your grandmother to suck eggs and those who hold the Tibetan concern dear- such as Jeff Bowe whose learning on the subject is much greater than mine- please don't get worked up, but I just want to say I am heartily sick of this whole Tibetan argument. Really, whether promoted by Christopher Hansard or Tibetanway or any other western organisation, claiming to provide Tibetan medicines, spiritual traditions etc. is misappropriating culture or at best following the trend to syncretism.

It is really extraordinary the romantic grip Tibet has taken on the western imagination; its inaccessibility giving it a mythic quality. All those Theosophists struggling through blizzards trying to break its boundaries. Neighbouring Nepal, practically colonised by the divine Sir Ed. I'd like to suggest that the DL perhaps wouldn't have been able to become an international representative for peace had he had the responsibility of actually governing the country. An effectively powerless government-in-exile arouses considerably more sympathy in the imperial/colonial mind than an extant government. Can we remember that before the "brutal" Chinese invasion, which after all was no new thing - there was just a respite of 40-odd years when China was in civil war after 1911 - Tibet was a brutal theocracy?

As a powerless country, overshadowed in our minds by remnants of the Cold War, still difficult of access and extensively mythologised by westerners, Tibet has become the new black and no doubt that is why many western practitioners draw on the Tibetan label as a hook to draw in the punters. Whoever is doing it, it has an element of bogusness.

It is interesting how this forum seems to have become sexually or should I say gender-divisive; the men arguing points of law and the women wanting to understand and resolve their experiences. Oh la la! (she strikes her forehead.) LOL

Oh dear Elizabeth...I admire your eloquence but methinks you throw the baby out with the bathwater. For sure many people in the developed world are suffering from the Shangri-la delusion. For sure there were barbaric punishments in *old* Tibet. For sure HHDL's trajectory would have been very different if the Red Army had not invaded Tibet, massacred 6 million Tibetans and starved an equal number to death. In fact HHDL might not have survived his 20s if the Chinese had not invaded Tibet. Most of his predecessors were assasinated by regents determined to hold onto their powers. Even his immediate precursor, the robustly healthy 13th HHDL, suddenly dropped dead at the age of 50 something. But none of this negates the fact that *old* Tibetan society was geared primarily to supporting spiritual endeavour. If they wished, people there could spend their lives as hermit yogis and no-one would accuse them of exploiting the welfare system. Quite the contrary in fact, they were cherished and venerated by the lay community. Over centuries the people of Tibet developed an awesome system of scholarship and contemplation based in a fusion of Indian Tantra, Buddhism and the indigenous Bon tradition. This system is one of the most sophisticated, most effective and most subtle extant on planet earth today. It is worthy of our respect. But those who plagiarise it, abuse it, play games with it and exploit it for financial gain are numerous in our midst. Christopher Hansard is undoubtedly a guilty party in this respect.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/2008 10:37PM by pema.

Well, Pema, that is what I meant by misappropriation of culture and bogusness. My point was that there has recently been a focus in this forum on grappling between two differently disseminated forms of misappropriated culture, which seems a bit irrelevant to the cause at hand.

Dont think that the men are totally without heart some of use do have one. There are a few exceptions who seem to think that abuse issues are 'redundant'.

Quote
jeff bowe
Speculation as to whether Hansard abused people in the past, or is not engaged in such odious actions presently, with respect, is a redundant debate, he deliberately misrepresented himself as a qualified physician of Tibetan medicine (Bon or othwerwise), mercilessly exploited Tibetan Bon culture, and invented a bogus account of his supposed 'training' and 'lineage'. This has been thoroughly researched and publicly exposed as a complete fraud.


I feel that some of the men concentrate on physical issues because they can be proven, being nasty in general or pretend mystic, is not a prosecutable offence. Medical misconduct is. It may be that those who have the dreams and nightmares were attracted to him for some spiritual reason that he has abused, but as he is not a member of the clergy that option is not open to us either.

Having spoken to many of the people here I know that the experiances are genuine, which makes the abuse accusations even more awful. As I always state, he called himself a Master Physician and should be judged under the law as would any other health professional on aspects of misconduct.

James

This was sent to me today by CF, before posting I checked Jeff Bowes blogs.
Sadly its true, Jeff has removed all of the replies from CF and left the accusations.
He has distorted the nature of the postings to such an extent that I can only describe it as fraudulent.
Jeff you have no honesty as a researcher or as an individual.

Dear James,

I hope you are well and I wonder if you could help me.

As you are aware - for whatever reason - I cannot post to the forum.

Now as you may have noticed - and despite his assertion on page 102 of
the forum that "I value free speech and dissent and welcome an open
debate" - Bowe has removed all of my comments from his blog. Clearly
speech is only free if it is in support of his viewpoint - an
interesting point of view from someone who supposedly supports Tibet in
the face of Chinese imperialism.

In order to demonstrate to the users of the forum that I have been
attempting to post there and also that I have actually posted on Bowe's
blogs there is now an initial page at the Tibetan Way website that
contains my comments on his blog today. Copies of all my other comments
there and my attempts to post to the forum will appear there over the
next few days.

I would be most grateful if you would pass on the URL of the page
[www.tibetanway.co.uk] to the forum.

Hopefully the many objective readers of the forum will realise that I am
being denied any right of reply to the various accusations that have
been made and will read the comments there and draw their own conclusions.

Thanks in advance for your help

Chris