In the Vedas, there is always talk about the Illusory energy of God: Maya. Unlike the Abrahamic religions, in the Vedic traditions there is no Satan (Devil).
Maya is the ultimate trickster. She does not operate alone and is subservient to the “Supreme”. This material world is her playground and she is a rutless ruler. We are all constantly under the influences of the mind, senses, emotions....
It is not very important to know if Jesus really existed. However he was the embodiment of what a good shepherd should be.
The 40 days in the desert is symbolic of the temptations we, the soul, go through all of our lives. It is not just 40 days unfortunately.
In the Vedas there is a beautiful story about a great Saintly person:
His name was Haridas Thakur and he was also temepted by Maya.
[www.bhagavatam-katha.com]
A “true” Spiritual master is as rare as a Unicorn these days. We have many imitation ones around.
I consider mine a “Hybrid”. A very complex figure that I have never been able to figure out. And this is why he is a master manipulators.
A true Saintly person must pass the tests illusion (Satan) puts on their path with an A+. There is no room for error. Otherwise they cannot be considered Guru in disciplic succession.
They can teach you in theory, but they are not the real deal.
A true Lover of God should not be able to stand the suffering of another spirit soul. What to speak of making them suffer.
When you look for a Spiritual master, you must put the bar really high. A top surgeon can once in a while make a mistake and kill a body.
When a Guru makes one mistake they destory the soul.
Now that I am no longer afraid of offenses and judging my ex teacher (chris butler), I can see that he is not the YODA he pretends to be. He is more like an excellent magician or a mentalist.
In my personal experience, he has a good way to impart knowledge but he does not walk the talk.
His actions have made me see that he is ABSOLUTELY not free from the strings of Maya.
Treating others with anger, humiliating them in public, making them work for free in order to save millions in salaries is indication to me that he has failed the very rough tests of the Power of the Illusory energy.
I have come to forgive him because I see now how he is in a deep illusion that he is beyond illusion. And he has been able to make his followers believe the same thing.
I personally have embarked on the individual path which is not for the faint of heart. I have tapped into invisible teachers and my own guidnace.
I know how to extract what is valuable from any path. Even the New Age movement.
I am learning to protect myslef from the “ennemy” and don’t need a Guru to hold my hands.
However the great majority of people are not ready to let go of support and enter the jungle with no friends and teachers.
It is not for nothing that a true teacher is called MASTER. A true Master is not allowed to get currupted by power, money, many folloers, adoration...
He is supposed to have reached a level of Mastery over the great powers of “Illuions”. The “negative” forces that can attack both internally and externally.
He is not supposed to gain Mastery over his followers and this is what most false gurus do these days.
Followers become puppets of a puppet master who himself is a puppet of the greatest puppet master!
A true Saint should never install fear in the hearts of his followers. When this happens you can know that this person is operating under the forces of illusion and not a divine force.
My not so perfect teacher thaught me many things (in theory) however I see now that his teachings as well as himself are tinted by his narcissistic personality and led me to a bipolar schizophrenic relation with God.
They can keep their self made army method spiritual booth camp.
They say that nobody is perfect. Unfortunatley one who claims he is the external manifestion of God cannot be less than perfect.
You cannot hand over your soul to just ANYBODY lightly.
There is no room for sentimentality.
One must be very rational when handing over their soul to a “mortal” entity.
I did not only judge the guru, I put him on trial for destroying so many sincere seekers. He may have helped some but he has no right to damage even ONE soul.
I put all the “abusive” gurus on trial and call them out!
My theory is that if such manipulators are truly representing God, then we are all in trouble!

“A “true” Spiritual master is as rare as a Unicorn these days.”

Well, if everyone is busy looking for the true spiritual master it won’t ever be found will it? :-D

The moment people stop looking is the moment that little drama ends.. but everyone is entitled to seek an adventure so why not?

“However he was the embodiment of what a good shepherd should be.”

Jesus, in those days he, and not to mention many others (check out renaissance paintings) suffered and gave their lives upon a stake or a cross in their communities as a way of “proving” or showing how selfless they were to the world. Jesus was the trending one. It could have been any of them.

Today, people have got it easy. We can just go on the internet to show the world our supposed goodness that way instead of the previous fashions of doing so. Nothing much is personal, it is made public and that is largely none other than for show.

Guru’s claim to act in order save the world, humanity and life on Earth is the be cherished and loved - but how many celibate? Humanity discontinued because the act of sex is deemed bad - really it creates an uncomfortable problem for the only good show that they need to project. Love and light.. no sex and bbq’ing of meats. Leave it to the meagre householders I guess.

Show, like with the Peacock bird, is to get needs met for oneself is it not?

I don’t think peacock is particularly concerned with wether the paparazzi are present.. but humans, we take it to that next level by our other needs to want to come across a certain way. Fear shaming is rife amongst spiritual community for this reason. Personally, I do not disclude Jesus or related figures from the need to show.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/25/2021 02:38AM by facet.

Facet, the rabbit hole goes very deep and this forum is not really the place for me to go much deeper.
I personally do not have any issues accepting that sometimes a person may have more wisdom than me.
That they have gained more or different insights. That they may be more connected to the divine.
I am not against genuine spiritual teachers. But I am against surrendering my mind and life completely to that person. Or not having the right to ever question them.
I believe that each soul is on a different level and different journey.
I just want to do my best to help aspiring seekers not to fall into the same holes that I did.

I understand, though it is a bit like having new pet in the house, some day they want to go out and explore things in the chaos mix, and the chance encounters may not always have best at heart for that pet. That’s why looking after ourselves is so important.

It also models to others how to look after themselves, so they may stand a better chance too. Like you say, so they may not fall in the trap.

Do you really believe that any other person could be more connected to the divine than of anybody else? Than you?

They wish. Nobody is more special than another in the eyes of nature we are all equals, and with our differences absolutely. People put themselves as “more” connected for a reason. I see it as false.

If you had experience of bipolar and schizophrenia I am sorry to hear this. It must be scary sometimes. I hope that you have a trusted professional who knows about these things and the brain chemistry to help you.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/25/2021 05:14AM by facet.

I meant my relationship with God was transformed into a Bipolar /Schizophrenic one due to the Yoyo teachings of the Guru. It was an analogy.
As well as the fear based group dynamics.
Like on one side they tell you God appreciates the smallest act and on the other side they tell you, you are not doing enough...
I think a psychosis is easier to handle than a “mental” spiritual group.

Psychosis is no fun either, I appreciate your comparison and also your earlier analogy to demonstrate how you are feeling.

It is like that with manipulators isn’t it? Once or twice, here and there.. something will be correct and fantastic, the large majority of the time everything is incorrect and we strive to gain correctness.

That’s a little trick played by someone who knows full well what they are doing.

Guru is like the parent, and we want to please them. They know.

We always have the right to remain ourselves and you were correct the whole time because you do not agree with giving your whole autonomy over to them, which is what they need as you know.

It would be great if people didn’t need to behave like this, but they do and likely always will realistically speaking.

Sometimes we fall, and that is ok.

I fell and as someone who falls hard, every time, I become stronger.

Maybe you feel the same :-)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/2021 12:38AM by facet.