Quote
You make it all sound so sinister, facet.

Merely sharing the experience from this point, it doesn’t sound sinister.. it is sinister. That is the reality.

I cannot (and do not) speak for the various global and individual groups - not at all, this is why what you state, along with others, is so good for everyone to see.

What is said by me, is my small contribution towards large networks.. but this does not make my contribution any less valid than anyone else’s.

Some adherents may not be this way, but what they will be doing is supporting those who are.

Recruitment to an ideology, to support the beliefs in question - as before, just because there is no physical place of gathering (at least in some areas as you mention) does not mean that there is no recruitment of adherents. Believers may be a better word? Recruitment does not = a physical location. It = people’s minds. Location or not.

Also note the vegetarian restaurants set up, the “festival” style events (pre covid) that take place advertised by glossy colourful leaflets offering free vegetarian feast of food.

Nothing mentioned about krisna consciousness until the small print.

People can do what they want and try to agency of themselves in these things, no problem, but personally, I would not knowingly support abuse or trust anything to do with a network that has a history of it, and with ongoing cases.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2021 01:27AM by facet.

Facet, I hear ya. I am hardly trying to act as some kind of apologist here. However: I do chant every day, and am a vegetarian. These things are part of my life and are very much a part of my personal spirituality, and I'd recommend them to just about anybody. For my own part, I have little to do with mainstream ISKCON and (once again) regard it as (pretty much) a quasi-Hindu cult. And I do not believe that Prabhupada was a bad person, either.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2021 01:31AM by The Whirlwind.

Noted :-).

I used to be a vegetarian, and I used to chant every day.

These things used to be a part of my life, and I would not recommend them to anybody.

My natural brain chemistry, and hormones, where it is returned to today, I have learned to value it greatly.

The Whirlwind, I wish you best in every way. Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Likewise, facet, thank you very much. Personally, I find these practices to be helpful in more ways than one, and I believe in a Personal God. But that's just me, and my experience. Others' experiences and beliefs are, of course, different and I respect that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2021 01:45AM by The Whirlwind.

The Whirlwind Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Facet, I hear ya. I am hardly trying to act as
> some kind of apologist here. However: I do chant
> every day, and am a vegetarian. These things are
> part of my life and are very much a part of my
> personal spirituality, and I'd recommend them to
> just about anybody. For my own part, I have
> little to do with mainstream ISKCON and (once
> again) regard it as (pretty much) a quasi-Hindu
> cult. And I do not believe that Prabhupada was a
> bad person, either.

In other words: I would defend the basic beliefs and practices of the institution, but not the institution itself (ISKCON).

This is a very important thing to realize (in my opinion), facet: Prabhupada was not omniscient with respect to the material world and all that goes on in it, and he never claimed to be.

Not sure how my post turned into an “Iskcon is not trying to recruit” thread.
Whirlwind your spiritual journey and relationship with God is yours and yours alone.
We are all extremely unique beings and sometimes when you spend years with a group, we lose sight of that personal relationship.
We just become part of the devotee flock and under the microscope 24/7.
And our relationship to the divine is also very unique. As well as our “mystical” experiences.
This forum is mostly here to expose the destructive sides of groups as well as narcissistic type, misleading leaders.
Arguing about philosophy and beliefs lead absolutely nowhere.
It is truly liberating to just honor where we stand and let others do the same when it comes to their journeys.
Honor your own path and whatever feels right in your heart.
We are all being guided in different ways.

Truth wins Wrote:

> This forum is mostly here to expose the
> destructive sides of groups as well as
> narcissistic type, misleading leaders.
> Arguing about philosophy and beliefs lead
> absolutely nowhere.
> It is truly liberating to just honor where we
> stand and let others do the same when it comes to
> their journeys.
> Honor your own path and whatever feels right in
> your heart.
> We are all being guided in different ways.

This is called the "Cult Education Forum", not the "Try to make groups you don't like look bad forum". I am here to educate people with respect to a group about which you have nothing good to say, owing to your own experiences with it. I do not blame you, either. I've been abused within ISKCON, myself, but I still chant and refrain from eating meat. And I agree fully, with your point about beliefs versus behaviors. This is the basis on which groups are to be judged, you know, on the basis of belief versus behavior.

facet Wrote:
>
> Why are the pretty books simply not on a drop down
> menu and pumped out free via the web? If it’s just
> word?

No offense, but this was just a ridiculous question. Anybody who knows the first thing about the Hare Krishnas in the 21st century, would already know that all of the books are online, free for the taking.

It's obvious (to me, at least) that the person who asked this question is not really interested in having an open and honest discussion about ISKCON and/or Krishna Consciousness, but instead is here (basically) to try and make it all look as bad and evil as possible. I'd wager that facet REALLY knows about as much about ISKCON in the 21st century, as I do about...something I know little about.

Again: this is called the Cult Education Forum, NOT the "Try to make groups you don't like look bad forum".



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2021 10:07PM by The Whirlwind.

facet Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>

Quote
You make it all sound so sinister,
> facet.
>
>

>
> Merely sharing the experience from this point, it
> doesn’t sound sinister.. it is sinister. That is
> the reality.

That's your opinion, and it's not a very qualified one, either. Meaning no disrespect.

That’s perfectly fine by me The Whirlwind.

I understand that you see my points as unqualified, but I’ll reiterate I value what I see in reality as part of the larger picture forming, and always share my part. If others see the same or not means nothing much to me. It makes no difference in my mind.

I definitely do not like abusive groups, and am transparent about that.

I stand by everything I say and continue to share.. qualification (validation) for that is granted by me and me alone, not you nor anybody else.

I steer my own ship :-) (I selected this choice from a drop down menu, for free, in my head - wow @ the individual technology, disused by many).

In my view today, anything that needs some sort of big ass book in order to try and convince me of anything can go and try entering someone else’s head to control. I’m just not interested :D

Krisna is not short of these big ass books is it? Online already you say? Let’s see it then I’ll take a look.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 05/05/2021 01:01AM by facet.