This morning I have a challenge for any and all persons who may be reading this: please find and show us a single recorded instance of Prabhupada having said or written either "Krishna has appeared as ISKCON" or "ISKCON is my body" (or even anything like that). I've researched this quite extensively, and I cannot find anything like that anywhere. Therefore, I reject that as a bona fide "Prabhupada said" quote, and regard it as apocrypha. But, I am open to the idea that I could be mistaken and that such a quote exists, but that I just did not find it. So please: if anybody reading this can find such a quote, then please show me. If I were a gambler, then I'd bet that you cannot do it.

If it's so critical to believe that ISKCON is Prabhupada's body, then why did Prabhupada not write that down?

"I have instructed everything in my books." --SPL (VI 1987) Dina Dayala das 25/02/76



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2020 12:57AM by The Whirlwind.

The Whirlwind Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This morning I have a challenge for any and all
> persons who may be reading this: please find and
> show us a single recorded instance of Prabhupada
> having said or written either "Krishna has
> appeared as ISKCON" or "ISKCON is my body" (or
> even anything like that). I've researched this
> quite extensively, and I cannot find anything like
> that anywhere. Therefore, I reject that as a bona
> fide "Prabhupada said" quote, and regard it as
> apocrypha. But, I am open to the idea that I
> could be mistaken and that such a quote exists,
> but that I just did not find it. So please: if
> anybody reading this can find such a quote, then
> please show me. If I were a gambler, then I'd bet
> that you cannot do it.
>
> If it's so critical to believe that ISKCON is
> Prabhupada's body, then why did Prabhupada not
> write that down?
>
> "I have instructed everything in my books."
> --SPL (VI 1987) Dina Dayala das 25/02/76

There is a precedent involving devotees making claims for and about Srila Prabhupada, that Prabhupada never made for and about himself. These claims involve deifying Prabhupada, making him into a "godman" (such as calling him the "savior of the entire universe", for example). In the summer of 1970, four sannyasis at New Vrindaban began preaching that Prabhupada was himself Krishna (God), in the flesh. But Prabhupada put the kibosh on that madness pretty quickly, and fired and banned (but later reinstated) the four sannyasis who were preaching the deviant philosophy. Prabhupada never said or wrote that ISKCON is hid body, so I don't buy that one either. I think that some sannyasis made that line up, in order to make criticism of ISKCON, as an institution, a sinful thing for devotees to do. Prabhupada is not a godman, and I do not believe that ISKCON is his body. If it's so critical to believe that ISKCON is Prabhupada's body, then why did Prabhupada not write that down?

But the cancer had not been checked. Halting in Japan en route to India, Prabhupada learned that four of his new renunciants had begun preaching a strange gospel. At a huge gathering of ISKCON faithful at New Vrindaban on Krishna’s birth anniversary, 1970, they had announced that by leaving America, Prabhupada had rejected his disciples for failing to recognise that Prabhupada was actually Krishna Himself. This was nothing but another aspect of impersonalism. While Kirtanananda had previously failed to distinguish between the personal and impersonal conceptions of Godhead [during his bout with maya three years earlier], the new sannyasis had failed to distinguish the guru from the Godhead. Vaishnavas teach that the guru is the servant of God, but never the Godhead Himself. A Vaishnava spiritual master will never say that he is God or that God is impersonal.

[www.harekrsna.com]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2020 03:28AM by The Whirlwind.

Correction:

The Whirlwind Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Whirlwind Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > This morning I have a challenge for any and
> all
> > persons who may be reading this: please find
> and
> > show us a single recorded instance of
> Prabhupada
> > having said or written either "Krishna has
> > appeared as ISKCON" or "ISKCON is my body" (or
> > even anything like that). I've researched this
> > quite extensively, and I cannot find anything
> like
> > that anywhere. Therefore, I reject that as a
> bona
> > fide "Prabhupada said" quote, and regard it as
> > apocrypha. But, I am open to the idea that I
> > could be mistaken and that such a quote exists,
> > but that I just did not find it. So please: if
> > anybody reading this can find such a quote,
> then
> > please show me. If I were a gambler, then I'd
> bet
> > that you cannot do it.
> >
> > If it's so critical to believe that ISKCON is
> > Prabhupada's body, then why did Prabhupada not
> > write that down?
> >
> > "I have instructed everything in my books."
> > --SPL (VI 1987) Dina Dayala das 25/02/76
>
> There is a precedent involving devotees making
> claims for and about Srila Prabhupada, that
> Prabhupada never made for and about himself.
> These claims involve deifying Prabhupada, making
> him into a "godman" (such as calling him the
> "savior of the entire universe", for example). In
> the summer of 1970, four sannyasis at New
> Vrindaban began preaching that Prabhupada was
> himself Krishna (God), in the flesh. But
> Prabhupada put the kibosh on that madness pretty
> quickly, and fired and banned (but later
> reinstated) the four sannyasis who were preaching
> the deviant philosophy. Prabhupada never said or
> wrote that ISKCON is HIS body, so I don't buy that
> one either. I think that some sannyasis made that
> line up, in order to make criticism of ISKCON, as
> an institution, a sinful thing for devotees to do.
> Prabhupada is not a godman, and I do not believe
> that ISKCON is his body. If it's so critical
> to believe that ISKCON is Prabhupada's body, then
> why did Prabhupada not write that down?
>
> But the cancer had not been checked. Halting in
> Japan en route to India, Prabhupada learned that
> four of his new renunciants had begun preaching a
> strange gospel. At a huge gathering of ISKCON
> faithful at New Vrindaban on Krishna’s birth
> anniversary, 1970, they had announced that by
> leaving America, Prabhupada had rejected his
> disciples for failing to recognise that Prabhupada
> was actually Krishna Himself. This was nothing but
> another aspect of impersonalism. While
> Kirtanananda had previously failed to distinguish
> between the personal and impersonal conceptions of
> Godhead [during his bout with maya three years
> earlier], the new sannyasis had failed to
> distinguish the guru from the Godhead. Vaishnavas
> teach that the guru is the servant of God, but
> never the Godhead Himself. A Vaishnava spiritual
> master will never say that he is God or that God
> is impersonal.
>
> [www.harekrsna.com]

When the management of ISKCON in Dallas told that pujari to leave their temple-provided housing and forced this person out of the dhama, they violated state and federal law in so doing. This is a fact. They gave this person two days to vacate, just because they refused to work like a slave. If that is not abusive, then nothing is. So I do not feel bad in the slightest, in taking action and calling for the TP of Dallas to step down from his position. The TP of Dallas is not somebody who I respect very much, at least not anymore.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has issued an Agency Order that halts evictions for nonpayment of rent for renters who meet certain criteria. The Order went into effect on September 4, 2020 and will remain in effect until December 31, 2020. It was issued to help prevent the spread of COVID-19 which, the agency argues, could be worsened if many people across the country are evicted and are forced to live in group settings, such as homeless shelters.

[guides.sll.texas.gov].

The Whirlwind Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PS: Here's what the Dallas temple management
> council is like: they're like a group of Mafiosi
> in an Italian neighborhood in the old days (minus
> the threat of overt violence). They run the dhama
> as if they are a law unto themselves, they are
> accountable to none but themselves, and they try
> to handle everything "in house" and involve law
> enforcement in certain matters, only when
> absolutely necessary. If you cross them, they
> won't kill you or even break your legs, but they
> WILL try and ban you from the temple and/or force
> you to move out of the neighborhood. They've done
> that to two people lately: both were banned, and
> one lost their place to live. And it's wrong, how
> they abuse devotees.
>
> It's doubtless that certain people are going to be
> able to figure out who I am; some devotees who are
> reading this will be able to figure out my
> identity. But I do not give a damn, and I am not
> scared. I am protected, and I don't just mean by
> Lord Narasimhadeva. :-)

I already wrote about the pujari who recently was illegally removed from their temple-provided housing. This person is one of the two recent cases I know of in which devotees have been removed from the dhama, and banned from the temple. The other case I cannot write about in very much detail, since it involves a child. The CPO is reportedly investigating this case, now.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/23/2020 09:41AM by The Whirlwind.

In ISKCON of Chicago, the temple president (TP) was married to the local GBC representative, so there was a conflict of interest, and a closed-loop, self-sealed management structure in place there too (similar to what we have in Dallas, except that in Dallas, the TP and GBC are the same person). However, I have received a credible report that the TP of Chicago recently resigned their position, for reasons that are murky. That's a good thing. Now the TP of Dallas needs to resign, too. The way that devotees in Dallas are abused, is reprehensible.

HARE KRSNA JOKE OF THE DAY:

Q: How many ISKCON devotees does it take to change a light bulb?

A: I don't know; that's not my service.

:-)

"No, I am not Caitanya Prabhu. I am not.... Why you are comparing me? I am an ordinary man."

--ACBSP, March 11, 1976, Mayapur (morning walk)

[vaniquotes.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/2020 11:46AM by The Whirlwind.

The Whirlwind Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PS: Here's what the Dallas temple management
> council is like: they're like a group of Mafiosi
> in an Italian neighborhood in the old days (minus
> the threat of overt violence). They run the dhama
> as if they are a law unto themselves, they are
> accountable to none but themselves, and they try
> to handle everything "in house" and involve law
> enforcement in certain matters, only when
> absolutely necessary. If you cross them, they
> won't kill you or even break your legs, but they
> WILL try and ban you from the temple and/or force
> you to move out of the neighborhood. They've done
> that to two people lately: both were banned, and
> one lost their place to live. And it's wrong, how
> they abuse devotees.
>
> It's doubtless that certain people are going to be
> able to figure out who I am; some devotees who are
> reading this will be able to figure out my
> identity. But I do not give a damn, and I am not
> scared. I am protected, and I don't just mean by
> Lord Narasimhadeva. :-)

APS and CPS have been made aware. Law enforcement has been notified. I will not allow these people to perpetrate, and then try to cover up, their abuses. They put an elderly woman out of her residence, giving her two days to vacate, in the middle of a pandemic. That's wrong so many levels, that it makes me sick.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/2020 11:58PM by The Whirlwind.

The Whirlwind Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Somebody who is on the Dallas temple council (I
> will not say who), once told me that he believes
> that Lord Brahma administers the affairs of this
> material world, through the disciples of Tamal
> Krishna Goswami. This is his mentality, and this
> is the mentality he operates under. That is
> simply insane, that idea.

Most of the temple management council are disciples of Tamal Krsna Goswami, and this explains why it is that they seem to believe that they are accountable to nobody outside of the dhama. They are mistaken, and they will shortly be held to account for their abuses, by the relevant civil authorities.

“Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said; Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge? Gird up now thy loins like a man: for I will demand of thee and answer thou me.”