Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: PapajisaysNO ()
Date: January 31, 2019 12:09AM

Hi everyone.

I have found this thread extremely helpful. I see the clear points being made. Sometimes there so clear I do laugh out loud at what I too experienced at Sahaja and in retreats with Moo and the sangha. I would have loved to have had this thread when I was getting out, so I think it's invaluable.

All the censorship to criticisms, which in most cases are people's unfavorable experiences with Moo is control. Only that which feels threatened needs that kind of control. Moo makes it clear that his brand, his image, is more important than people finding truth with his censorship. It's obvious. If not people could be free to speak without being deleted. That's what he does though, he deletes you.

It's really sad because one of his quotes is "my heart is with you tell the end"...it's shallow though when you meet him. It is about if "he feels you" energically and so a lot of effort is put into keeping him"feeling you" being uber devoted, and if you are crushed then your too attached to him, to your mind.

I know for a fact he demeans, talks behinds people's backs, shouts and that people fear him. I know because he has said he was shocked to learn people fear him. He either lacks a tremendous amount of insight or he is extremely manipulative or both.

He doesn't want anyone to see other teachers. It's a form of betrayal and if he find out "he doesn't feel you" anymore. I know of women who cut off there hair at his feet to help him feel them. And he let them.

I know Krishnibia is his pit bull. I know people objected to his picture being placed in the area that has all the dead sages in it and she was furious. "Mooji is your Master" and she went at night in ceremony to put another one up. I know Mooji oked this because nothing is done that he doesn't want. You don't speak at meals because he doesn't want you too. You don't speak about anything to do with what your life is in private because he doesn't want you too. It's highly controlling. If he catches wind that you are having "Satsang" with another because you think you know something, you will be called on it. He doesn't want anyone to have a true spiritual experience is very true. I know 6 people who had them, spoke about them and were expelled from his group and also those who teach under him. One transcribed an entire book for him and tossed out. She can't ever go back and was told not to attend meetings with him with the new group she is at meets with him.

Where is the freedom in this?

It's taken me quite a while to see through the illusion of Moo as God. In a sense he is because we all are, nature is, animals are, the whole of creation is. It was confusing how exclusive people felt toward Moo. But I get it. He was abandoned by his mother, his father died. He was left to grow up on his own with an uncle. He was a popular kid in high school. And people like him because he's "cool". They want the show. The want to be in a movement they feel is going to save them. They want to feel this love he exudes in retreat and on videos. I did. But it's got a flip side. And because he doesn't acknowledge his humanity, his diabetes, his health, his past that influences his craving for love. Well we can't either.

I've gotten free of him. But I went there thinking he was God. Krishnibai reinforced to me how great it was I thought that because most people only see him as a wise person. Those where her words. But Krishnibai we are all god. And god is on this thread saying this isn't right, because that what is seen and it is also true.

So they want an experience. I did. Moo offers it. I felt out of extreme compassion but then I saw many things that were not at all compassionate and yes that was my mind and my common sense and my own compassion at play and I don't have to give any of that up for Frredom, or Truth because they are apart of it.

I really am grateful to those who were in Sahaja and are giving their stories. Not a one didn't ring true. Maybe the sexual stuff and the intention to defraud and brainwash seem a bit conspiracy theory but hey, they could also be true as far as I can tell and why because Moo is transparent. There is so much fear there, but not anything people would see if they went to retreat. If he feels you and you go to stay and you keep your evaluation as well you will see it too.

I left and everyone was surprised, they said you belong here, you love Moo so much. I did. And I do, but not from weakness anymore. But because I've seen thru him. He's messed up as much as he's not. He tells people "it would be better that you wet yourself, then miss this teaching" because he gets annoyed they have to use the toilets. He says he is up there with diabetes and he doesn't leave the stage and diabetes makes you need to use the toilet. Message I'm a martry, be one too. I care more for you then you do. You have to want freedom as much as I want it for you. Sorry Moo, God has to pee.

People leave the Satsang hall and he says "if I was your Master you would not leave before I leave the stage" that's a spiritual ego. No one says to him Moo "that's just your mind".

I know many people there and they are no honest with him. Why? Because they confide in me how much they hate the naming ceremonies that go on forever, how they want to leave but have to find a way to do it not to anger, yes to not loose friends and also not to lose their standing, they have learned how to manipulat him. But time and again, you see people who are honest get kicked out. Delete, next.

I was there when a girl was sharing with Moo that her parents felt she was in a cult and she was stuck because she loved him but didn't want to hurt them. He said "don't give up your chance for freedom for anyone" and the line he uses is to say we are a sect, an insect.

Bottom line. It's just what was said if you are truly devoted to truth, you will see past it. You will see you are being taken for a ride. But you will also see you were "take-able" and it's not your fault. It's where you were. And yes I never thought I was signing up for gas lighting, group think gone wrong, mind control and yet I did because I made him an idol. My bad and yes also shitting on his part. He does know better. And yet that's it. So much pain for people is caused by him but people also get a lot of benefit. It's a ride and I would never ride it again, never. He makes me a bit sick actually. But man oh man did I adore him once upon a time in never never land.

The bubble pops. It's just a matter of time. And when it does, if you are a true devotee to truth itself, you are fine and wiser for it.

But this is really helpful and I wish everyone, Moo fans and Moo nonfans....all the best. I have been both.



Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: PapajisaysNO ()
Date: January 31, 2019 01:17AM


Finally,

I think an example of my perception of his lack of compassion might help. I saw many, many instances of it. But as a fan you are led to believe that everything he says is perfect somehow.

Example,

A woman wrote in to ask Moo to stop haunting her, she sees him everywhere, she needs him to let her go, she has nightmares, etc.

Moo said "I'm glad this got in here so you can see the type of mentally ill people I have to deal with" then

He said, who is this? He looked at the email address and read her entire full name.

This was also put out on video.

Now tell me. If a person actually feels this way, if they have mental health issues, how is his response compassionate? Her anonymity taken. He didn't address her issue. He made it about him. "Poor me"

For all I know she killed herself from that.

No this is wrong, folks. Perhaps, Deadly wrong.



Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: PapajisaysNO ()
Date: February 01, 2019 08:33AM


He’s got everyone double bound

1. If you are anonymous you are a liar and a coward.
2. If you tell him to his face he kicks you out.
3. If you say anything online, his team deletes it if they can. Or trolls it if they can’t.

Perfect way to keep control.

I remember at one Zmar retreat a guy was frustrated that Moo just didn’t wake us all up. He wrote a passionate letter but didn’t sign it. Moo asked whoever it was to come forward, he wanted to meet the person who could write such a letter.

It took awhile but the author did step up. Moo ridiculed the hell out of him. Called him annonyMOUSE over and again...to the crowds delight and laughter.

Nice trick, Moo.

Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: Unknownlove ()
Date: February 16, 2019 10:08PM

I have been following this thread for a while and really contemplating everything said here and how it relates to my own experience with Mooji or Guruji as he is called in Sahaja. I have always had this weird feeling about him but I just figured with him being a powerful guru and all his energy is just a bit different so ignored all the signs for the most part. One thing that I did not see mentioned here which was something that always bothered me was the fact that if you follow his teachings long enough you start to experience memory loss. Mooji would mention that it was a sign of awakening but now I feel that it is a sign of his brainwashing taking effect.Many people at sahaja have loss their short term memory, and this has always bothered me. Also he talks alot about extraterrestrials which i found to be quite strange. Once he said that Aliens were living amongst us but our government was too afraid to tell us due to them being embarrassed and that soon they wouldn't be able to hide it. The film team made sure that type of talk never got out.

From seeing and hearing everything the past few days it has been a whirlwind of emotions. I didn't see the sexual acts first hand but I strongly belive the accusations to be true, as seeing how concerned he is with who is dating who and the chatter around sahaja. I always felt like he wanted all the women for himself and despised men who he saw as sexual competition. I know that is a strong thing to say but he always gave me that vibe. He kicked out a few men who were having sexual relationships there.

Im really glad I found this thread.

Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: 2cents ()
Date: February 28, 2019 10:52PM

I’ve been to Moo’s last 2 Rishikesh seasons, delighted to be a part of such a monumental, bordering on Hollywood, spiritual experience with like-minded beings - you know the drill. A week before coming to Rishikesh 3 weeks back, a friend mentioned Moo has some allegations surfacing. So I started researching and found this forum and truly everything came into focus that I had been suppressing/denying/ignoring/rationalizing around the ‘citadel’ that is Mooji. This was pure Grace! With all my heart, thank you to all who are contributing your experiences because this has been a major wake-up call, and good to know I’m not the crazy one!

I see that I have been experiencing Cognitive Dissonance: “Cognitive dissonance refers to a situation involving conflicting attitudes, beliefs or behaviors. This produces a feeling of mental discomfort leading to an alteration in one of the attitudes, beliefs or behaviors to reduce the discomfort and restore balance.” (Google)
Here are my ‘conflicting’ observances that I ignored:
1. I noticed a few years ago at Monte Sahaja, a ‘guru aarti’ was composed – also blending Papaji and Ramana, but mostly ‘Mooji Baba’. First reaction was , oh no, here we go – making Tony Moo ‘guru Moo’. Then calling him Guruji, Bhagavan, Master, Beloved Father, etc..
2. Then the touching and kissing the feet, then last year the sangha started walking backward when leaving the stage rather than turning their back to Mooji (old tradition in respect for holy people) – so gradually this full-blown guru trip has infested the entire scene. The worst part is that Mooji doesn’t stop or seem to object to any of it -but rather seems to expect it and enjoy it all.
3. Then, walking through the crowd displaying Jesus-like behaviors of putting his hand on people’s heads as if healing, wiping tears away, giving special attention to the Indian elders as if to assure them ‘he’ is equal to all the other ‘masters’ they might have known.
4. Also the fact that Mooji seems to pride himself on not having done any real study of ancient spiritual texts that foster authenticity and authority. Rather, he regularly reads some verses from Avadhut Gita to prove his teaching is legitimate – but it is quite obviously flawed because no one seems to be getting anywhere – in fact, there seems to be people breaking down and falling apart in despair from always returning to their human-ness. Moo seems to infer that if he never did any disciplined study or put forth ‘effort’, we needn’t either – discouraging true investigation and critical analysis. This definitely keeps the game going – lost people getting nowhere always will need directions – Moo.

Point is: all this was noticed (cognitive) and because I drank the Koolaid and felt I was getting the ‘real deal’ of a warm and fuzzy,simple effortless awakening to Self – I rationalized these disturbing things away in the name of ‘the means justify the end’ kind of thing (dissonance). Someone on the forum wrote about the body and mind should ultimately work together in harmony – well, I know my body always tells me ‘what’s for me’ and ‘what’s not’ – and it did – but I ignored it = Cognitive Dissonance. The most important part of this (for me) is not having anger towards Moo or the sheeple around him, but frustration, a sense of self-betrayal, sadness and disappointment within myself for ignoring intuition, knowing in my heart something was seriously ‘off ‘ and not listening because the ‘payoff’ of awakening and sense of belonging were greater. OMG, over it!!

I knew this was going to be a strange journey with all that has been revealed – and I sit now in my Rishikesh hotel– catching a few satsangs just to see what’s happening and I have to say – I was shocked to see Moo’s parents photos on the dais – this smells of serious and manipulative damage control -again, weird and disturbing. As I listen now, I see right through Mooji’s tactics, his endless tricks and turns to bring the person around to some acceptance that they are not ‘real’ – as they go into a somnambulistic trance - probably from being kept standing at the mike for an hour and a half!! I notice how he’s always looking for the ‘hook’ to start the endless dialog into the repetitive analogies, stories, quotes. Self-elevating statements like ‘ I want to eat someone today’, or ‘ Is there a Buddha here today’ only speak to Moo’s sense of superiority – and yet – when a truly sincere experiencer of the Self is at the microphone, he seems to dismiss them, or somehow finds his ‘hook’ and it’s off the races with endless indulgent verbiage.
Enough - you guys have said it all really – just adding my ‘take’.
I so appreciate the solid information you all are offering, and informative links to help understand this ‘drink the Kool-Aid” Tony Moo phenomenon. Thank you each and all!

PS: just occurred to me that Moo is actually using the sangha to prove his own self-proclaimed attainment: if someone would fully awaken, it proves Moo is the enlightened sage he thinks he is. Yet ironically, or paradoxically - it seems he can't tolerate anyone really awakening. Hmmmmm.

Amma Tanyas video: [www.youtube.com]




Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: StartingOver ()
Date: February 15, 2019 07:35PM


Here is a commment from Facebook from "Amma Tanya White"


Thank God Mahadevi Elayne Cohen Ashbey! I know this is difficult Sis. I myself, went back and forth on this despite things I observed particularly while doing seva on the medical team in India in 2016, that gave me pause and set off my internal gut alarm which had fiercely ringing for some years. But what did I do with it? I pushed it down by dismissing it as being my mind and identifying too much with being a 'person'. But I am grateful that Spirit has a way of always coming back around and not letting me remain unconscious for too long. So, as I was preparing for this year's Satsang and the same uneasy feeling arose within my heart, I decided to pay attention this time.And I am Sooooo glad I did. The confirmation of my doubts came in the form of the young woman devotee confiding in me. And when I looked in her tear-filled eyes and sensed her fear in sharing her story with me, because she was uncertain of whether she could fully trust me or not, I knew without a shadow of a doubt that she was telling the truth. For me, that was the nail in the coffin. And for those who say Mooji is allowed to have a sexual libido and be in a romantic relationship, I agree, yes he is. But that is not what this is. Mooji is having inappropriate sexual relations with young, beautiful, impressionable female devotees through the use of psychological coercion by telling them it is in service to the Guru to do these things and will help to quicken their awakening to the Divine truth of what they are. And that my friend has nothing to do with being in a relationship. That is an abuse of his power as a Spiritual Master, and is simply put. wrong.



Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: StartingOver ()
Date: February 15, 2019 07:45PM

Here is another comment from "Amma Tanya White"


"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it". Martin Luther King, Jr.

This is true on all levels. Today my world was rocked when I discovered that the Man I've called Guru, Mooji, for the past 8 years, is not at all the awakened Being I believed him to be.

I have never been a sheep herd mentality individual. It's simply not how I am wired. And I am truly grateful for that. I have always trusted Spirit's guidance although I haven't always been obedient to following it immediately, as was the case in my ignoring the blatant alarms that were firing off within me with regards to Mooji over the years.

I chose like so many of his devotees who trusted him with their whole heart, to ignore my gut instinct that something wasn't quite right.

And because I had yet to have my own personal experience with anything being off, it was easy for me to dismiss what many label as gossip and rumors.

That was until today.

When I directly heard someone who had experienced inappropriate relations with Mooji tell their story, I was disgusted and felt as if I wanted to vomit! My heart broke into a million pieces because the Man that I believed to be the real deal, turned out to be someone capable of manipulating and using women for his own sexual gratification, all under the guise of spirituality.

Simultaneously I was brimming with rage!! I mean I was seething inside!

How could I have been so gullible as to disregard all of the signals Spirit was sending me.

But here's the thing, when you have a void inside that you're trying to fill externally, you are more susceptible to falling for this type of cultist conditioning and brainwashing.

I realized that there was still a residual of the little girl who grew up in foster care and wanted to belong and have a family that was playing out, all be it under the altruistic role of being a spiritual seeker.

So, how could this happen ? Easily.

I am still grappling with how something that is meant for good has the potential to go so damn wrong!! Power and egoic stimulation is a seductive energy and can change a person and make them do things that perhaps even they themselves never imagined themselves capable of doing.

I will be praying for those who still believe in the image that Mooji portrays to hundreds of people around the world. It is for them that my heart breaks the most because they have bought the lie hook, line and sinker.

And to Mooji,I have this to say.....May God have mercy on your soul. You WILL ultimately reap what you have sown. Believe that!




from: Amma Tanya White's facebook page:

Mooji Update:

I am making this post public so that EVERYONE may view it.

Over the past several weeks I have been inundated with daily emails from both men and women who have shared both their gratitude for my speaking out as well as their own personal accounts of negative experiences they have had either at Sahaja, (Mooji's ashram) or with Mooji directly.

Initially, I attempted to respond to every email personally until it began to take a toll on me and my own process of grieving and dealing with the revelations that had come to light about the Man I once called my Guru.

So, I took a step back, shut down my page, (of my own volition by the way, not by Mooji, the Sahaja Sangha or FB; trust me I don't scare that easy and refuse to be silenced when it comes to speaking out against wrong doing) for some time before reappearing.

The emails continue to come on a daily basis, however, I no longer feel pressured to respond to each and every one of them as I did before. However, I do still respond to those which I feel called in my heart to do so.

Most recently, after having dealt with the initial, emotional avalanche of my own anger/rage, grief and profound disappointment that Mooji is not whom I thought him to be, I have been sitting with gaining clarity about what my role has been in revealing this information, what it is now and what it will be going forward.

I am fully aware that my video was an atomic bomb for many and has shaken many people to their core, myself included.

And while I do not regret for one second having spoken out via the video, I feel that it wouldn't be right to leave people impacted by this news, standing in the rubble of that announcement to fend for themselves, particularly, those of you who have emailed me telling me just how much this has impacted you.

Simultaneously, I am also aware that I must be mindful of my tendency to rescue and place my care taker/champion for the underdog hat on, sometimes to my own detriment.

So, I have gotten very clear about what is my fight and what is not and how I want serve in this situation going forward. It is important to me that I maintain healthy boundaries in this situation so that I don't find myself taking on and processing others trauma and grief vicariously, which with my being an empath is highly likely for me to do.

All of the above being said, here is what I've gleaned from the numerous emails I've received and continue to receive on a daily basis.

There are several distinct groups that most people fit into. There are those of you who have had your own personal experiences either with Mooji or Sahajah and the Sangha, but don't want to speak out for fear of retaliation from those associated with Mooji. Then there are those of you who know of the dysfunctional things that have been happening both at Sahaja and with Mooji because a friend has confided in you about their experiences and have thanked me for my courage in giving voice to it. And last but certainly not least there are those of you who feel that something should be done about this so that more harm is not done to others, and have expressed to me, in fact DEMANDED that the women in particular who have confided in me should come forward, to which I have responded and continue to say that is not a decision I can make for them. Everybody is in their process with this and has the right to determine what's best for themselves and how and IF they want to be vocal about it as I have chosen to do.

For those who feel that this news has rocked their world and they too have had an negative experience with Mooji and feel that you would like to communicate with others who like yourself have had similar experiences, I would like to put you all in contact with one another and allow you to support each other throughout your grieving/healing process. As I said to one of the women who confided in me, I can not begin to imagine what it has been like to hold this experience bottled up inside in secret for so many years with no-one to talk to. Therefore, I feel it would be highly beneficial and healing for you all to lean on and support one another. IF you feel that is what you're wanting to do, please email your personal email address and name and I will put you all in immediate contact with one another.

With regards to taking further legal action on this. I did not personally have a sexually inappropriate experience with Mooji. Therefore, that particular battle is not mine to continue to fight. I did my part by speaking out via my video when I discovered this was happening behind the scenes. However, if there are those of you who DO want to speak out and pursue legal action based on your own experiences, I will support you in whatever way I can 150%!! I just can't be the ring leader on that front. You must stand in your power, speak your truth and know that you are not standing alone. But it must be YOUR fight and YOUR decision to do so. I can not do that for you.

In conclusion, I want to say this. Silence and secrecy kills and allows dysfunction and abuse to go unchecked which allows it to fester and proliferate.

At times when reading some of the emails from those of you who have confided in me about your personal, negative experiences with Mooji or the Sangha in which you've ended by saying, but please don't mention my name or share this, I will admit I have felt extremely frustrated and angered by that stance. It is exactly that silence which has allowed Mooji to get away with this abuse of power for so long!

I know it can be scary to speak out. But I want to encourage you to dig deep and find the courage to do so because you will be helping countless people in ways that you can not even begin to imagine. And if you chose to speak out, please do so in a way that is productive, connected to your heart and in integrity.

When people go on a campaign of spewing toxic vitriol about people such as Mooji who abuse their position of power, adding fuel to a scandalous drama in an attempt to destroy and Mame, you do a grave disservice to the revelation of truth and the change that needs to unfold is hindered primarily because people won't take you seriously. They just chalk it up to people spreading rumors and gossip about the one in question. And often times as a result, victims remain in hiding and the abuse is allowed to continue.

So I say all of that to say, be clear, honest and hold the highest intention for good when and if you decide to come forward.

For myself, my intention has always been from the moment I posted the video exposing Mooji, to eradicate anything that is not in service to Light and uphold all that is. It has not been to destroy Mooji as some of those who have emailed me in support of him have suggested. In fact, I pray that Mooji himself finds the courage to get help, because clearly he needs it if he does not see that what he is doing particularly with some of his young, female devotees is wrong. Sometimes power has a way of deluding even the one in the position of power, which could very well be the case with Mooji.

Furthermore, what makes this situation most dangerous is that Mooji does point to and speak high, spiritual truths, even though his behavior is not in alignment with the truths about which he speaks. This I feel is what makes it challenging for people to reconcile within their hearts and minds that what people are sharing about their experiences both with him and the Sangha is true. I know it was what was challenging for me. I kept saying, "But how could the one who has helped me so much through the teachings, also be the one who is capable of doing these things" ?!

Simply put, it's TOTALLY possible.

So, I pray for him as well as for his victims.

I hope this is helpful to those of you who have taken the time to read it. While I can not be your savior in this crisis, (because believe it or not, I do have a life outside of Mooji lol), I will do my part to help in the creation of avenues that support you.

I am still processing what this is meant to teach me and will be for some time I'm sure. I am particularly exploring what kept me brain-washed and blind for so many years. I know that there are those devotees who feel that I am being blinded and following darkness and the devil, (yes this has actually been said sigh)...by choosing to believe the victims. I assure you nothing could be furthest from the truth!

I am actually Waking up from the thick fog of psychological conditioning and hypnosis that I was under for so long! My prayer is that others will wake up too!

I am at peace with my decision to speak out and have not one smidgen of regret about doing so! NOT ONE!

I have always been wired to speak up against injustice and wrong doing. That has never and will never change! I am however, learning to establish healthy boundaries and to discern what is my cross to bear and what is not, as well how to recognize when the caretaker/rescuer within me has been activated. In those moments, I take a breath, step back, assess and ask vitally important questions such as , "Ok...what is my part to play in this situation and for how long" ?

At this point, I have determined that role to be one of support to those who need it by connecting you with one another. And for those who desire to speak out about your own personal experiences up to and including legal action if you choose to pursue that route, I will be your unyielding, unwavering cheerleader and will direct you to the people and resources that will aid you in doing so.

Blessings to each of us as we continue to heal from this.

Om Shanti, Shanti, Shanti

REPORT OF A SUICIDE IN A MOOJI SANGHA IN 2017

Posted by: Chrissy ()
Date: May 13, 2019 10:50PM

Hi there, I thought I should share with you some info, since I am researching the mooji "cult" myself and questioning things.
In 2016 I first heard of Mooji and started watching his videos. I joined an official Sangha in Johannesburg (South Africa).

I never met him personally, and although I will admit I was initially taken in by him, I got an unsatisfactory response from him in one of my letters and started losing interest him when I noticed how impatient and unkind he would be to other people in his videos (in a passive way). The "worshipping" made me uncomfortable too but I was told it was just my mind... Most of us were on a tight budget, but we were not deserving of him coming to visit us here as we were considered too small. There was a kind of lottery where you could get a free ticket to see Mooji. I'm glad I never got it.

There was a suicide in our Sangha in 2017, here in South Africa, by one of its dedicated members.
I thought I should mention this, since I've only seen two suicides mentioned here (one in India and one at the Ashram).
So yes, it has been kept very low key.
As a result our Sangha was closed.
We received no response or message from Mooji when this happened, which I think would have been the right thing to do, from a loving and accountable guru. Instead, the group of us were abandoned as it were. The leader of our Sangha withdrew completely.

A couple of teacher's I've come across seem to have this careless approach about their followers / students. They seem to think it's okay to just up and leave you when it suits them. This is clearly the case here and I think it's why the suicide happened here in the first place. There was very little support to facilitate this teaching of Mooji's, if it was genuine in the first place.

When I finally lost interest in Mooji (before I even considered that it was maybe a cult), I was watching one of his videos and I realised he was doing exactly what he was telling all of us NOT to do: he was operating and acting and thinking from his mind. And I realised, with everything else (the fact that he is so reprimanding, and that we in Africa are not deserving of him), that he is a hypocrite and something is definitely off about him.

I have fortunately had the state of mind to see this. But that's the whole problem with Mooji though, he is dismissive of the mind, in a negative and non-loving way. It's a very clever and misleading manipulation. But even I still feel guilty saying that, which shows even the effect it has had on me.

I just wanted to share a link to a BBC documentary about the science behind hypnosis. As some of you who are reading this might be aware, some of the most effective and successful cult leaders know how to use trance induction or hypnosis to draw unsuspecting people in.

Osho was one of these successful cult leaders and Mooji is another one.

[www.youtube.com]

Notice towards the end of the video, a British doctor who uses hypnosis working with patients in his clinical practice compares hypnosis to 'brain-washing"!
I found this fascinating.

This doctor (who treats people with IBS - irritable bowel syndrome) seems to be getting some good results, and clinical trials are reporting that his techniques are successful.

He says that once a person is under the influence of hypnosis, you basically just "drone on and on" repeating and repeating "lots of pleasant suggestions". He says it's like you are "brain washing" the person. His words!

And I feel that this is exactly what Moo does. And it works. Also I found an article published in an independent British newspaper about the science behind hypnosis:

[britishhypnosisresearch.com]


Again, we see hypnosis compared to 'brain-washing' or thought control! The author does say that a type of indirect hypnosis can be used on people without their consent (they have no idea that they are being hypnotized) and that this is skill is dangerous, if it ends up in the wrong hands.

Pretty damn interesting.

I am sure this is what happened to me... I was hypnotized without my consent. In hindsight it is obvious to me. It's obvious to me now... but at the time, I don't know, I just thought that something seemed to be wrong with my head. But it wasn't an especially unpleasant feeling. Then Old Moo was there to tell me "that is just your mind". So you can see how easily it is to become confused!

Moo is very, very manipulative and cunning.

If you want to leave Moojis cult this might be helpful:


1. Video about trauma bonding with a narcisisst [www.youtube.com]


2. Many people on the main Mooji thread found it helpful to read "the guru papers" written by Joel Kramer and Diana Alstad. Here you find free parts to read: [joeldiana.com]


3. recommended book "Enlightenment- The Path through the Jungle" by Dennis Waite.


4. Documentary "Wild wild country" about Osho


5. Movie "Kumare"


6. Reach out for support and help OUTSIDE Moo sangha: family, friends, partners and if necessary: a therapist


7. Focus on daily tasks for grounding yourself, take time for healing, go out into nature as much as possible, find joy again in normal life, help others, exercise and educate yourself about how cults operate. Stand your ground and claim your power back from Moo. If you have psychological issues do not hesitate seeing a therapist!

Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: Valma ()
Date: March 12, 2019 08:37PM



On questioning Mooji let us listen to what someone has to say:


" As a person who has been involved in investigative journalism for 25 years, I would say that what Be Scofield reports is both credible and troubling. It is not perfect, but it raises a number of points which deserve more scrutiny, something that many are clearly trying to avoid.

A bit of background: I was involved with Rajneesh (Osho) both in Poona and for the entire experience in Oregon from 1980-1985. I was very close to Sheela and the inner circle around her, as well as with many of Rajneesh's closest disciples, who lived with and took care of him. I know what went on behind the curtain, and how it contrasted with what was presented when Rajneesh was "onstage". The theatrics surrounding Mooji are disturbingly similar to what Rajneesh had going on, and the behind-the-scenes stories are also familiar.

To those supporting Mooji, I would ask: Have you been in his presence when he is not "onstage" performing his act in front of all his followers? There are sannyasins today who still think Rajneesh was the "Master of Masters", a perfect realized being showering his love and grace upon the Buddhafield. They are laboring under this illusion to this day, knowing nothing of how he was in the privacy of his home, or his micromanagement of all aspects of the commune; of his heavy drug use, or the fits of anger, his physical violence with his girlfriend, the manipulation of his followers and sexual improprieties with his female disciples, of which I have firsthand knowledge from those who were subject to it.

To those to whom the illusion of his "enlightenment" still plays an important role in their lives, the discussion of these facts are met with denials on all levels--from tortured justification to outright denial. The pattern fits perfectly those who are presently refusing to consider Mooji's human failings. I am not saying that Mooji is a "bad person", nor am I comparing him directly to Rajneesh, who had different weaknesses. What I am saying is that Mooji is not what he presents himself to be. The whole "perfect realized one" act is show. He is as human as the rest of us, and that is where the problem lies--not that he is human, with human failings, but that he must maintain a fiction.

The real problem lies with those who follow him, and must create the fiction of a "realized being" in order to avoid their own responsibilities for their lives. They use him to escape themselves, not to find themselves, in the same way that one would use drugs to get high, or go to a rock concert in order to join a group mind and check out of themselves. More and more they use him for catharsis, and the release they get they mistake for some sort of awakening.

It may well be that Mooji serves some people in a way that they find valuable, but he is not what he pretends to be. The acid test will be how his present disciples react when more information comes out, which it is sure to do. If Mooji or his organization were not afraid of how the bad publicity would affect their bottom line, they would not be hiring lawyers to threaten his critics. These are not tactics of love, but of power."

Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: clearvision ()
Date: March 13, 2019 03:40AM



The following comments were written in response to the recent Joan Tolifson article on Mooji (they were deleted later) The commenter was present for a lot of the things in Scoflields article that are dismissed as "gossip" or "rumor"


“I saw him yell at his daughter in little Jamaica after she said she wanted to leave Sahaja. I know he had the heron killed. I was in the meeting and one of his bodyguards said “can’t we just get more fish from the store” he was told “No, that’s not how Mooji wants it handled.” He ordered it killed (SHOT DEAD FROM THE SKY)!!!!!
I saw him throw water in the face of my friend. I will not tell you her name! She does not deserve your doubts! I saw him backstage after satsang and I heard him say to go be with other teachers if you love them too. I adored him. It broke my heart to see what I did. I can not follow a man who DOES ask to surrender to him, as a guru, not as a clean vessel of light. He is not clean!!!! You guys are so upset whenever any one says what they saw and then you ask people to come forward. And Joan it is not well known (until now) that he is having sex with Krishnabi. You all are being given hard fought through truths that have been absolutely heartbreaking to experience and treating them as gossip. I’m not gossiping. That’s all I will say. You don’t know. Karen knows. I know. And I’m called arrogant and presumptuous with too many expectations. No. I love Christ with every ounce of my being and that’s what speaks now.”

“And for the record seeing what I did, outside of retreats and the “on stage” Mooji was heartbreaking, and it’s the best thing that ever happened because I don’t have to call the article “gossip” and I am free of him and on my way.”

Re: Mooji a cult? new
Posted by: clearvision ()
Date: March 23, 2019 10:01PM



This is a great post from Chidambar Stef on the facebook group Nonduality Salon:


New guru same old same old scandal.

I have known a certain now famous and wealthy guru for many years since he first started arriving in Tiruvannamalai with the Lucknow crowd after Papaji’s passing in the mid 90’s.

At first I liked him a lot as he was funny, warm and relational and was not so interested in manifesting the “great man at the centre of the circle ” role that he later perfected. I met him and chatted with him in some of the shanty cafés around Tiruvannamalai and later noticed that he was beginning to develop an aura of “one who knows” and was often surrounded and clearly enjoyed the (then) small group of mostly female seekers and few sensitive men that surrounded him.

While I had zero interest in hanging with gurus, having been in a highly guru-centric cult for several years, I went to a few Satsangs over the years. Whilst I enjoyed the group meditation and earnestness of the attendees, I noticed how he was developing his style and subtly shifting his presentation of “we are all here together in this” to “I am here enlightened and you are too but you don’t know it” to “Just hang with me and you’ll be fine”. It was a short hop to tears of devotees, foot-washing and the sale of the “sacred soil” He had walked on.

Many of these professional teacher/gurus operate in a similar style to the professional“psychic mediums” who perform in theatres. In front of a large crowds; these apparent psychics say, “I am getting a ‘J’ is there someone in the audience who had someone recently passing with a J? ” Of course, there is always someone in a large audience who had an uncle John or aunty Joan recently passed. From then on in the audiences content is reflected back to them.

This guru points to the present aliveness that is clearly here and now in everyone who is reading these symbols in this moment. Concerns of the audience are undermined in classic Advaita Vedanta style by pointing the questioner to their own awareness.

This type of Satsang depends on what the audience bring and of course they are mostly full of projection about what the “wise one” will say. What is clear to me is that this wise one was often winging it and while there clearly was some insight and understanding, one could find the same among many who had been engaged in spiritual practice for more than a few years.

The professional “guru” needs the disciple to give him the submissive attention to empower his role as “wisdom holder”.
There is self abasement and self disempowerment of and by the seeker, who is used to this submission via parental and societal programming. There is a group energetic field that arises when any group focus on one person or persons, be it at a football match, political rally, music concert or Scientology meeting. That buzz indeed may lead to a limited type of self-transcendence and one feels part of a greater whole.

Pop stars, sporting events, politicians, including National Socialism, the Nazis, and Trump appeal and work the same territory. “Forget your everyday and look at me!”

The understanding of group dynamics is essential for the modern professional guru. An inner core of totally devoted followers must be created and maintained through both cajoling the “ego” or “mind” of those that have any doubts, and praising the self abasement and imagined progression of the seeker as s/he surrenders more and more of her/his previous points of view. A new “healthier” and more “spiritual” group point of view is encouraged and one suddenly finds oneself embraced, welcomed and “loved” by the community. One has suddenly “found the one, the way and the truth”. The honeymoon begins...

Surrender of one’s moral framework happens step by step until a little way down the line one becomes both addicted to the buzz of being with the “perfect one” and the fuzzy feeling of merging with the group mind, such that one lives in a state of suspended investment of one’s previous mental/emotional condition and constantly turns to the guru or the group for guidance and re-assurance. Anything that seems suspect is interpreted as “resistance”, “ego” or “mind”.

I watched this particular teacher rise and assume the mantle of “The Guru” with all the business, videos, books, retreats and the necessary self promotion that goes with that role. As the crowd grew so did the usual insider/outsider game. I watched as he appointed others, who had “got it” to teach his method and watched them become “holy”, start off their own franchises and be able to pronounce that others were “getting it” or “not quite yet”.

I was curious because there was indeed a buzz in attending these larger groups and they reminded some of the Satsangs around Papaji where a taste of present moment freedom would spark off in one and then spread to many.

So if people were experiencing freedom in his company what was the problem? I felt in my core that this was off but didn’t know exactly how? I asked within to be shown the answer to this question.

A few days later it was this teacher’s birthday and after Satsang he walked among the crowd giving sweets to the adoring crowd. When he came to me, I remained simply present without any projection positive or negative. As he handed me a sweet, he looked at me and flinched in recoil; I was not one of those looking at him with any kind of wide-eyed adoration or attitude.

Outside the Satsang hall his crew was selling tickets to his birthday party later that evening. On the same evening I was invited to a birthday party of the six year old son of an Indian friend and there was no way that I wanted to buy an expensive ticket to a “birthday party” of this guru, but an inner urging prompted me to buy a ticket.

I attended the delightful and simple birthday party for the young boy down by the lake in a simple hut with a few Indian friends. On my way back to the room I was staying in I passed by the venue where the guru was holding his birthday bash and entered to find a section of the compound cordoned off.

I came up to a small gate where I presented my ticket to two beaming female devotees who wanted to stamp my wrist with the dayglo inks that are routine procedure at big rave music events. I told the “gopis” that I would only attend for 15 minutes maximum so would not let them ink my arm.

As I passed through the barrier I noticed a number of stalls selling expensive vegetarian food, the guru’s books, CD’s, photos, beads and paraphernalia.
My attention was drawn by the blast of music slightly further away and I turned to see the guru at the very centre of fifty or so people. He was dancing with his hands upraised while the group around him in a tight circle pressing to get close to him as they chanted his name over and over.

It was then that my question as to why this whole guru scene was off became answered. While he was providing something to this gathering and sharing the message Papaji had shown him, it was all about him and his need to be at the centre. While there was an undoubtedly charismatic nature to this man, it reminded me of the glow that had surrounded a man I had run into in a small street in London many years ago- his name was Paul McCartney.

I was also instantly reminded of U.G. Krishnamurti’s comment about the gurus who pick your pocket and sell you back your own wallet.

When we make a man an infallible god, egoic inflation and claims of abuse are almost bound to follow.

Caveat Emptor.