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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: zizlz ()
Date: January 30, 2020 04:28PM

True, there are no perfect teachers. But there are teachers that don't use manipulative techniques to make and keep you dependent on them, fortunately.

Quote
garuna
Since 2015 I have met or talked to more than ten people who have been under the influence of Shunyamurti and have left him. They all describe the same manipulation tactics : being flattered in the beginning, making them feel understood but then subtle ways to scare about leaving him, to demand total and unconditional devotion to him, to cut ties with everything else, to lose all self-autonomy and trust in self. He is using : fear, guilt and shame.

Edited to add: We shouldn't demand perfection from teachers, but we should demand integrity. Normal ethical standards apply to spiritual teachers too, and to students as well. I'm watching an interesting panel discussion about this at the moment: [batgap.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/30/2020 04:50PM by zizlz.

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: facet ()
Date: January 31, 2020 11:20PM

Hello sffs,

Thank you so much for posting and sharing the information.

The subject is something I have previously understood in my own journey. I recognise that we’re all humans, and the paradox in the perfection / imperfection thing. This does not mean that I am willing to bypass integrity though, everyone is responsible for themselves and I have got no free tickets for it, not for anyone.

zizlz has already written what I was ready to say after reading your post.

Nevertheless, it’s great to hear that Shunyamurti’s work and teachings (if shunyamurti would call them his own? I’m not so sure on that) are working for you and holding you in a space of gratitude.

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: facet ()
Date: February 01, 2020 01:32AM

Well, an update on this generally, during last weekend I was searching the forum about something else and came across some information others have already posted about the practice of hypnotism.

This link, posted about something called Nested Loops gave me a brain click because of the “great” story teller I associated with Shunyamurti. Y’know, story telling and listening is great childlike fun, except if your being duped for reasons beyond that.

Interestingly, nested loops is also a named process part of python computer programming. Ffft. It is also a component of NLP.

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: February 01, 2020 02:16AM

Here on CEI message board we've discussed the nested loops trance technique.

To get the straight dope, go to Search.

Select all dates. Put The Anticult in the author slot

Put nested loops in the words slot and select exact phrase.

Anricults contributions elicited lots of troll disruption.

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: sffs ()
Date: February 01, 2020 02:40AM

Hello facet

Thank you also for your reply and input.

I agree totally with you and ziziz too about the importance of upholding integrity - especially with respect to spiritual teachers and their students.

Integrity is certainly an essential quality that is absolutely necessary to ensure further and deeper growth for all.

It is great that you began this thread here facet. May the posts continue to be helpful and beneficial to very many others .

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: facet ()
Date: February 01, 2020 03:13AM

corboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here on CEI message board we've discussed the
> nested loops trance technique.
>
> To get the straight dope, go to Search.
>
> Select all dates. Put The Anticult in the author
> slot
>
> Put nested loops in the words slot and select
> exact phrase.
>
> Anricults contributions elicited lots of troll
> disruption.

Thanks corboy, I’m on it.. from memory I think this is the same poster or thread poster as I’d found the link in.

You’re welcome sffs, it is mutual on your contribution too :-).

I would like to add that any of us could put ourselves up on a pedestal and look down to see an adoring, perfection seeing fan base. It isn’t always the case. I’m aware that it does indeed happen, though it does not happen with everyone. Some are observers.

I’m happy to see that integrity is agreed with, I feel it an important social factor for all of us to maintain, essential in a field or role such a Shunyamurti’s.

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: facet ()
Date: February 04, 2020 09:59PM

I have learned so much more from this, thank you for the nod. It has been rough going though I rather know than not know. I knew a few years ago that nlp was used to manipulate for ill purpose though not the actual workings (I never looked into it that deeply) and certainly not hypnosis.

I had to google what “flaming” was, and flaming posts so that’s a learning curve too. I see what you mean about the anger.

In my own questioning on the Shunyamurti topic this week, if the end of the world is really upon us as Shunyamurti regularly broadcast, then what is the need for charging for the services at such a high end cost? Does Robert himself pay into keeping the ashram and associated going by doing another job it is it all dependent on paying visitors and the new subscription for content?

None of this is transparent. I sure miss the days when everyone was genuine in my mind haha, it’s no wonder we’re told not to question because none of these people make actual sense when you do. One thing I noticed, important thing I learned: I had to stop questioning the teaching, and start questioning the teacher.

Big distinction. This is where the while down not ask questions’ thing is hidden, you may be able to ask them which will seem genuine upfront, but they will be filtered into questions about the teaching - permitted, and questions about the teacher - not so permitted.

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Re: Shunyamurti aka Robert Shubow of Sat Yoga Institute
Posted by: facet ()
Date: February 07, 2020 06:00AM

That last bit in the previous post is meant to read “do not ask questions”.

I recalled an upload from a while back, three years where Amrit Desai visited the Ashram. On a re-listen, Amrit states some of the endeavours and trainings that shunyamurti has undertaken in order to be where he is today ashram wise. One of those stated is “business”, which speaks volumes to me now.

At around 53 mins in, Shunyamurti shares with Amrit his belief that the world will do a reset and we will all have to start again in growing our own foods, etc, his language appears to point to that being in our current lifetimes.

https://youtu.be/gZiegHyKtac

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