Hi Keir,

They leed you in as an inetersting group teaching about other religions, myths, art, symbolisim etc.. And I would say that all this info is quite good and interesting and has helped me to appreciate other religions and to see the common thread. Teachings of Jesus and Krishna, Buddha very similar etc.., the are common "truths" that are beyond the different faces of religion. But then the more you get involved, slowly it is more and more based areond Samael as the main figure, the one that can "save" you. But you are already so deep into it that you dont see what is happening. The people really beleive it and have expereinces with him etc.. As in astral expereinces with the Masters and Samael.

I still dont understand what the beneift it is to him (Samael) or other instructors as no-one makes money from it? It just gives people a sense of being on the "right" path, that you are being helped my Master Samael, that there is a hope of salvation, as the world is doomed etc..

They start to speak more about meditating on Samael, pray to him, call him, etc... This never felt right to me though, but I still did it. Why? I dont undersatnd what the benefit is for people in the groups or the leaders to manipulate people?

The groups are very manipulative, to the point where descions you make in life favour the group more than your own personal life. You are told the ego must die, the ego is evil, the cause of suffering. The sexual energy helps you to die psycholicaly, that is by harnessing that force you can control nature, your subconscious, you can have visions, see the masters, meditate for hours etc...

And there is much more. But people really feel they are helping the world and people, and this is what I felt I was doing too. Paying karma by giving more and more to the group.

What do you think?

It seems to be the lust for power is forgotten by these people. The one human weakness they seem to deny.

It's great to hear that you have taken away a respect for other world religions. You should try learning about them on your own. They are much more beautiful and complex then the Samaelian Gnostic make them out to be. Recently I have been reading about the teachings of Buddha it is quite liberating to learn that his teachings are just perverted by Samael and his followers. Buddhism is just one example of course.

Another value lesson I have learned is that everyone that he insults, puts down or calls, may they be psychologist, occultists, theosophists, yoga practicianers has information that contradicts what he is teaching. In fact these are likely the type of teachings that he ripped of his ideas from and perverted their ideas. This is especially true of psychology which he uses a lot of the language of such as ego, conscious subconscious etc, words that did not exist in any of the religions traditions that his teachings are rooted in.

I feel great compassion and pity for those who are still stuck in different Samaelean Gnostic Schools.

one of the hardests things i have felt, it to be cut off from the group, where I thought i had friends. Once you start saying things are not right etc.. and try to talk to the "leaders" about it, you are made to feel that there is soemthing wrong with you. Since I have left, no one contacts me any more or responds to my emails. This to me is a sign that it is'nt a healthy group to be part of. They feel so self righteous.

This has all been very painful for me. To give so many years to the group, and then you're just cut off. I lost a lot, but I feel I have gained my sanity again and now I'm getting my own mind back - slowly.

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quest
Hi Keir,

They leed you in as an inetersting group teaching about other religions, myths, art, symbolisim etc.. And I would say that all this info is quite good and interesting and has helped me to appreciate other religions and to see the common thread. Teachings of Jesus and Krishna, Buddha very similar etc.., the are common "truths" that are beyond the different faces of religion. ...

No doubt learning about other religions is a good thing.

In the case of Weor he got it from the Theosophical Society who were interested in comparitive religious studies many many many decades befor him. He didnt originate it.
His achemy teachings were based from Krumm Heller's FRA. And his "awakening conciousness" teachings was from Gurdjieff. His other stuff was based in Christian fundamentalism etc.. He's just a synthesizer. He didnt originate anything. Way befor he was alive the Golden Dawn was already synthizing deifferent occult systems. Nothing new there.

(Befor anything. I wouldnt be suprise that Weor suppporters will try to drown out the posts. Its a typical tactic of theirs.)

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quest
...But then the more you get involved, slowly it is more and more based areond Samael as the main figure, the one that can "save" you. But you are already so deep into it that you dont see what is happening. The people really beleive it and have expereinces with him etc.. As in astral expereinces with the Masters and Samael.
...

This is similar to my experience as well. In my case for almost a year they dont talk about "the ego" but slowly and slowly trickle by trickle they start the indicutrination process. More and more they start to talk about Samael and indirectly imply how he can "save you". Of course one is always given the notion "one can leave anytime". Its a huge myth that cultish groups hold people against their will (majority dont). That myth needs to die off.

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notanantiGnostic
...It's great to hear that you have taken away a respect for other world religions. You should try learning about them on your own.

I totally agree.

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notanantiGnostic
...
Recently I have been reading about the teachings of Buddha it is quite liberating to learn that his teachings are just perverted by Samael and his followers. Buddhism is just one example of course.

I agree he perverted it. You will find his understanding of Buddhism is simply false (in part errors perpetuated by the Theosophical Society earlier in the century unfortunatly). Speak to real Buddhists and they have a different understanding of what Buddhism is.

how come people have expereinces with Samael and other masters in the astral world? Including myself.

They seem very real. Is he a being that just wants to be worshiped? Is he really a God or just tricky spirit?

What do you think? You must admit he's teachings are pretty radical and a lot of people say they have had expereinces. What does all this mean?

I'm still really confused abotu a lot of it.

One of the other main issues is that people are being conditioned, controled and lead into the occult, with rituals, exercises, pray etc. But the group claims to be non-religious, but it has a christian base and misleads people about this.

It creates more dogmas, but claims it has no dogma etc... I think all this is mis-leading, they should be open and up front.

At least other main stream religions are up front, eg they worship Jesus, Mohummad, Jehova, Krishna etc..

But the gnostic groups are not up front about there worship of Samael, as they know this will trun people away. Well doesnt that say something? But they say its to protect people, people need to be gently lead into the mysteries and who Samael actually is.

Samael is considered to be Messiah, the Avatar, saviour etc. The one who can judge over human beings. I always found this a bit scary. But I still have a lot in my mind that believes it.

This causes worry and stress, am I doing the right thing, am I going to be punished when I die etc..

Personally,

I think there is a lot of room for debate and open minded scientific exploration into what happens when people have astral experiences. How can we really be sure we are being objective. How do we know we are having an astral experience and not just dreaming or having a lucid experience.

So much of this is dependent on what you belief in. I am not sure you would be any more like to see Victor Gomez(who calls himself Samael) then you to see the Easter Bunny or Santa Claus.

You should do a google of the name Samael. You will see that it is actually the name of the Grim Reaper, the angle of death. Really messed up guy.

Try your best to disregard everything that they taught you. I take two things away from my experience that I can control my own mind and that there is something to astral exploration. The rest is garbage to me.

take care

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quest
one of the hardests things i have felt, it to be cut off from the group, where I thought i had friends. Once you start saying things are not right etc.. and try to talk to the "leaders" about it, you are made to feel that there is soemthing wrong with you. Since I have left, no one contacts me any more or responds to my emails. This to me is a sign that it is'nt a healthy group to be part of. They feel so self righteous.

This has all been very painful for me. To give so many years to the group, and then you're just cut off. I lost a lot, but I feel I have gained my sanity again and now I'm getting my own mind back - slowly.

It is known as "love bombing".
Theres a number of sites that mentions it.
[changingminds.org]
[www.cosmicfool.com]
[en.wikipedia.org]