Mooji asks "what is the definition of a cult?"

Start here:

[www.icsahome.com]


"Cult (totalist type): A group or movement exhibiting a great or excessive devotion or dedication to some person, idea, or thing and employing unethically manipulative techniques of persuasion and control (e.g., isolation from former friends and family, debilitation, use of special methods to heighten suggestibility and subservience, powerful group pressures, information management, suspension of individuality or critical judgment, promotion of total dependency on the group and fear of leaving it…), designed to advance the goals of the group’s leaders, to the actual or possible detriment of members, their families, or the community. (West & Langone, 1986, pp. 119–120)"

I just want to clarify something. Someone here wrote something about Moo having found some of his core followers when they were "biting the dirt".

What is meant by "biting the dirt?".

Is this a figure of speech or a factual do scription

I think "biting the dirt" probably means that they were down on their luck? Can someone clarify this?

But actually, most people who follow a cult are either middle class or upper middle class. They usually have above average intelligence, too.

They are people who are in 'transition' periods in their life and are looking for answers. Cults can be appealing, because they appear to provide a safe, cosy environment where everyone is happy and everyone has a common purpose.

It's only a outward appearance, though. Cults are really about distorted power relations, where typically one person exploits other people for money, free labour, sex and worship. Once inside a cult, it can be difficult to see the warped power relations, because it's hard to stand outside your own experience and be objective.

It probably feels all wrong, but how can it be? Because everyone around you appears happy. If you are not happy then, you must need to try harder. Hence, a repetitive cycle of going ever deeper into the cult is set up.

Psychological traps are the hardest to escape from. Just look at how women in abusive relationships manage to justify staying for years and years. It's a psychological thing. It becomes your very identity, unfortunately.

You don't see yourself as existing outside the cult. It seems impossible,

Although skilled or in some other way attractive people may get in for free, on the whole it's people with money that get through the gates.

[ed.ted.com]

Friends, lets have a look at two items, one written by Horowitz and the first post written by xivoparig in August.

We need to find out more if selecting followers from hardship conditions ('biting the dust') is a uncommon,atypical or a trend.

In English, 'to bite the dust' is to take an especially hard fall, even to die in some cases.

[www.dictionary.com]

Quote

Idioms
bite the dust ,
to be killed, especially in battle; die.
to suffer defeat; be unsuccessful; fail:
Another manufacturer has bitten the dust.

MacMillans dictionary

[www.macmillandictionary.com]


What has to happen for someone to land in this condition? It has to be frightening. Gratitude towards one's rescuer will be intense.

Horowitz wrote this:

[forum.culteducation.com]

Quote

Date: November 05, 2018 07:30PM

Happytown,

It will be interesting and difficult to make a Mooji- Krishnabai research project with psychological profile of Krishnabai. I think she seems to be in a mental trance mixed up with love and devotion to Mooji. It should not be forgotten that Mooji found her and the other core members “along a street biting the dust” and Mooji gave them new Indian name and new life in Monte Sahaja, because their life before was very miserable…

What xivoparig wrote, back in August.

Here is Corboy's question. Does it sound as though xivoparig, in London, was 'biting the dust' at the time she encountered Moo's group?

[forum.culteducation.com]

Quote

Date: August 10, 2018 02:26AM

(Deleted for brevity, URL for complete text given above)...This happened over a year ago over the span of 2-3 months or so. I don't want to post much more than that as his may be reading.

I was having a rough time with money and having a home and I ended up at a Mooji talk in London. At this point in your life, anything free is a blessing. I wasn't the only one in this situation, there were a few of us that were given food, shelter and in exchange for an 'open mind'. I was thankful for this - much better than the streets and you don't mind filling the time with hearing someone speak. We went along to hear him talk to the masses and it was quite inspirational and this went on for a while with us 'following him'... well there is nothing like a free lunch.

I started seeing some females who I met in similar situations as me who would have 'private talks' with Mooji and come out of rooms looking detached and something bubbling below. I had a friend, let's call her 'Sarah'. Whenever I asked Sarah what happened, she would put on a fake smile and spout that life is beautiful we have to believe. This wasn't the real them and it bugged me that something wasn't right. Mooji never really invited me privately in but his crew spoke to me a lot about 'giving myself' to them whatever that meant, submitting for the higher good and belief. It was wishy washy to pinpoint what I was supposed to believe but the sheer force of belief coming from the crew made me didn't want to question this for fear of being thrown out on the streets. I felt like I had to contribute something but I didn't know. Work? Giving out leaflets? Not sure.

So far, there was a positive focus and sense of wellbeing but for what price?

This happened one day a while into my stint with them. I had to sleep when I could being with so many others so I found a quiet corner behind some bags in a venue.

I curled up and was trying to drift off amongst the people coming in and out setting up. I couldn't fall asleep so I was lying there trying to relax. I finally sat up and I could see mooji and one of his crew members who I always saw float around mooji and not say much (I didn't even recall hearing his voice) talking to each other. They had their backs to me and i felt a bit strange as nobody else was around and they couldn't see me. I heard them talking about 'Sarah'. Mooji was asking top crew guy if 'sarah' was ready to give herself. ' The crew guy was saying how 'i've been working on her, she'll be *sleeping* with you within the week'.
I was shocked at the frankness of this abuse and it made sense from sarah's detached personality. She was being forcd to prostitute herself to mooji!
Mooji was asking about some others and what they are 'contributing' and the crew guy was talking about them giving money (some followers had money and were not sleeping on the street).

I sat back down behind the bags and lied down quietly as I could sweating if they found me, they would not only kick me out but silence me.

I had to leave and I knew I wouldn't have long with Sarah. I was ready to go and I had to plan my exit so I chose my moment to speak to her about what I heard. She called me a liar and how I didn't believe enough. She was on the verge of tears and her words didn't match how she felt with this conflicting information I was telling her. She was too far gone. I left straight away and I never found out what happened to her. If you're reading sarah or if you ARE a 'sarah' then I urge you to trust your instincts and not fall into the mooji trap. He's preying on the weak with having to believe in something. Don't give him money, don't give him your body. He is using a positive persona and behind this is a twisted evil man. I'm now doing ok, I have a job, a home. There is a way out of this cult.

Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 11/07/2018 10:08PM by corboy.

Corboy asked a few questions about this.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Quote

Date: August 11, 2018 05:32AM

If you ever feel safe in mentioning any of this, it might be
good to mention if 'free lunch' followers are given an adequate diet, get enough sleep, whether free lunch followers can easily talk with friends and family, whether they are free to come and go.

xivoparig replied:

[forum.culteducation.com]

Quote

Date: August 11, 2018 11:06AM

Well I had to sleep where I could which is what led me to find out this! We were kept 'busy. What I can remember is some people didn't have any real names. They had new names, identities and personas and leave the material world to find true happiness. In a nutshell this did mean cutting yourself off from people. There was a sense of freedom and movement ..but it wasn't real freedom. It is hard to explain as there is a trance like state everyone was in. I wasn't fully integrated but I was being beckoned into the group more and more as time went on. If I was there for longer I'm not sure how cut off I would be and how deep it got. I was one of the group that was very new and kept my guard up more than others so mooji's followers didn't talk to me as much as they talked to others who after formed a strange bond that shunned us new blood out. From general chit chat those very close to mooji people didn't want to talk about their 'old lives' or personas because it 'wasn't important' when I approached them. They seemed like they had nobody but the golden path of this trickster mooji. Maybe they were too far brainwashed. There were different levels of people. Those who were deep into it were closes to mooji and they had no life before meeting him and the new blood were all being reeled in and slowly transformed. It was a false sense of trust. It's terrifying to think about.

Later on, we advised xivoparig to be careful in choosing confidantes, and exclude any potential confidante who might believe in gurus.

xivoparig wrote:

Quote

https://forum.culteducation.com/read.php?12,135827,141597#msg-141597

Thank you corboy. That is good good advice for everyone.
I am trusting no-one. Not even you. I do not want to be interviewed and I recognize the danger in speaking about what happened. The whole Mooji cult works on followers deflecting and entrapment. The constant repetitiveness of tasks, chants that make the cult a part of your daily life. I saw this starting to happen to me. I saw lots of potential people in this position, giving their money and bodies away to this cult. This is the first place that came up on search so I posted. I want Mooji exposed and I am hoping this gets publicized and the press jumps on him. I know that if Sarah or others search the internet this post will come up and they can read and reflect on themselves how to get out before they are in too deep. My message to Mooji and any other cult that IS your life is don't be blinded and lead on with 'belief'.

Now, isnt it interesting that after xivoparig provided this information that trolls showed up - and have continued to arrive, eh?

HI Everybody, thank you for the help and informations made so far.

Frankly the thread seemed to have exploded as comments keep coming.

Applejuice, sorry, but why discredit me? I saw what I saw. And still see.
Moo can get ugly off camera and he likes young women. That. simple.


Also, I just remembered another thing about moo's early time.
Moo and one prominent follower where both wanting to F^(&^** the same woman.
So in the end Moo simply kicked the guy out. Since reading these long threads memories come back to me from those first days at Sahaja. That was one of them.

Also it is true that there are former osho members active within the inner circle.
I 'm not sure if they wire tap people, but as i have said, the mentality is such that they spy on everyone and report to the moo.

Then yes I have witnessed public shaming many times.

Also I was there in the meeting about the x-girl friend etc etc. it was ugly and can verify about a 100 people and cameras.

Then: the safety issue is also true. Big red flags here. Moo follows no laws on the land and the whole thing is basically illegal, but because of the usual ass licking via the Mayor this is allowed for now. (The fire that broke out was due to Mooo pushing (too FAR) of a project that led to many fumes in the wood working area and all it took was a relay switch that sparked it.) The fact that is was not windy that day saved mooo from a massive catastrophe.

Happy white-washing to those who do not wish to see the truth, which is not always pretty.
C.L.

Found a news article describing the fire at Monte Sahaja.

Does anyone know how many people live at Monte Sahaja and if the news article is correct in mentioning children are there as well?

Quote

The fire started, cerca the 15,40 hours, a community of carpentry led by spiritual leader Mooji, Jamaican descent, home to more than hundred and fifty people, men, women and children, having initially sprawled to the bush

Monte Sahaja is located in Odemira county near the town of sao Martino Amoreiras.

Are there any emergency response protocols in place at Monte Sahaja, any contact information requested for each resident?

Lidador Noticias

[www.lidadornoticias.pt]

Quote

Odemira: Fire leads to evacuation of hundreds of people and community of half.
Nov 17, 2017

A fire broke out in a carpentry a lot of community in São Martinho das Amoreiras, It led evacuation hundred and fifty people. There are no victims to register.

A fire broke out in a workshop located on the Mount of Pastries, parish of St. Martin Amoreiras, county of Odemira, It led to a foreign community rooted in space, were evacuated.

There are no victims to mourn among the residents of Monte Sahaja, as it is called by the community, with people from different countries.

The fire started, cerca the 15,40 hours, a community of carpentry led by spiritual leader Mooji, Jamaican descent, home to more than hundred and fifty people, men, women and children, having initially sprawled to the bush.

Quickly the fire progressed and eventually burn arbutus and enter a dense forest of eucalyptus trees that were also devoured, that had to be tackled by a heavy helicopter Kamov, parked in Loulé. The houses where the followers of the leader Mooji live, They were not met

The fire was controlled at approximately given as 18,00 hours and was contained by 55 operating the Fire Odemira Volunteers, Vila Nova de Milfontes, Ourique, Castro Verde, Almodovar, Aljustrel, Ferreira do Alentejo, Mértola and Beja, Afocelca e GNR, supported by 20 vehicles and a backhoe of St. Martin Parish Council Amoreiras.

Teixeira Correia

(journalist)

As described by Constantin, the safety issue perhaps might make this worth reporting to the embassies representing nations Moo followers belong to.

And to the emergency response department of the Portuguese government?

The Portuguese countryside has been high fire risk for at least the past two years.

2018

[www.google.com]

2017

[www.google.com]

2016

[www.google.com]

Information about the fire at Monte Sahaja is archived on reddit.

Quote


[www.reddit.com]

"A large fire broke out unexpectedly in Monte Sahaja at approximately 3pm today. Most residents had to evacuate the land but no one was hurt. Many stayed behind to assist the fire teams. The fire seemed to have started in the work station room where most structures and furniture are built for the community. It is not yet confirmed how the fire started. The fire was so fierce that all of the work stations were burnt to the ground. Fire fighters, known as Bombeiros, came from various stations in the Alentejo region to help put out the fire. They arrived on the land with fire engines and helicopter. Together with Monte Sahaja’s own fire team they fought the flames until the fire came under control. The mayor of Sao Martinho das Amoreiras, Nuno Duarte, ensured that Sahaja residents were cared for by providing shelter, blankets and food at the local community hall in the village. Many villagers came forward to offer shelter, food and love to the sangha. The residents of Monte Sahaja thank the Bombeiros for their prompt response and selfless service. We also thank the mayor, the police, Sandra from Zmar, Mario the former mayor and the local community for their care and support. When Moojibaba was approached for a response he said, “We are indebted to God’s grace continuously. Things could have been much worse as we have seen in this season’s series of wildfires here in Portugal. This could have resulted in a huge tragedy. Grace kept the wind from blowing. We are in gratitude.” We will keep you informed as more information becomes available."

Yes there are children at the ashram some times.

And then Samadhi,
I knew her myself and we were friends.
I miss her joy and smiles around here.
She broke contact after she vanished.

And the way it happened reflected badly on him and sahaja and this is why there is so much secrecy around it. What ever might put moo in ditch is always pushed aside.

Then on a side note: Mooo own master was vehemently against ashrams and organizations. So it is a bit odd that foney-tony (as papaji called him) should chooses to do exactly the things he own master was against. And then lets himself be celebrated as the god in person. Completely vain and remember this is not a hypnosis!

C

Sounds similar to the reddit post that was deleted.

StartingOver has no source - he is the source

Re: Mooji a cult?
Posted by: StartingOver ()
Date: April 01, 2018 11:25AM

I was a long time supporter of mooji and spent quite a bit of time at Sahaja. As someone who was very close to Mooji and the Sangha I can tell you that sahaja is actaully wiretapped to record and monitor phone calls and conversations on the land. Mooji has spies there and uses them to give him info on those visiting which he uses to pretend that he knows what they are thinking. His old security who spent years with him is terrified of him. I recently has a conversation with him and really felt bad for the guy. It seems Mooji really screwed up this guys life.There is definitely a cult around him. I left him with my dignity barely in tact but I am very greatful I was able to escape as many are still there and not so fortunate. I really feel bad for alot of the people I know there as they think he is some God. Little do they know he is tricking them and using there vulnerabilty as a means of entrance into their minds. something has to be done to stop him. There is a documentary on Netfilx about the osho scandal, oddly enough spme of those people who were with Osho are now with Mooji. Really fucking scary.



Horowitz Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> StartingOver,
> have you copied a nickname of the person, the
> date, and group at Reddit, where was is written?
> We could send a private message or email to know
> her/his nickname/name, it maybe important, it may
> be still an open account of this person at
> Reddit...?. It has to be confirmed, it's too
> big...unbelievable..
> I have checked your three postings here in the
> last 7 months..?



Posted by: StartingOver ()
Date: November 07, 2018 12:05AM

Hey I found this on reddit, it has been removed but I copied it beforehand...



I am writing this open letter as a means to communicate with those who are currently living in Monte Sahaja with Mooji. I have spent over 5 years with Mooji. In those 5 years I was responsible for recruiting those who seemed to be susceptible to brain washing techniques. There is an inner circle that are all highly trained and well experienced on how to successful break down the mind of the followers causing them to be in a constant state of confusion and dependancy. Many of us have worked with other groups that were formed out of India, like the Osho group for example. There are proven techniques that we used which seems to be effective 90% of the time. The advaita teachings allowed us to easily install thought reform techniques. I know that alot of you may believe that this some sort of joke, and especially you at Sahaja who have already been subverted so allow me to give you certain inside details to ensure my validity. Tony(Mooji) is currently dating Krishnabai from Sweden, whom we targeted from the very beginning. Krishnabai was considered to be very important to our work because she displayed a very stong willingness to submit. It was important that new comers see others willfully giving up their lives for Tony. This creates an illusion that allows them to drop their guards easier. We knew that everyone who came to us had a sense of distrust so our job was to turn that and redirect those feelings into total submission. Krishnabai showed a very strong willingness from the very beginning. To outsiders it appears that she is always happy and full of life, and we knew that others would want what they think she has, but in reality she is amongst the most fooled. She is in worst shape than most there. She is what we call a "useful idiot", a shill. Others like Omkara and Shankari are also amongst the worst conditions. These young ladies have given up everything for Sahaja, a false dream. When others see their dedictaion they easily conform. In the west there is a growing sense of not belonging so we created the atmosphere of belonging and acceptance, a sense of urgency and importance. Our process worked in different phases which have gone through various testing. From the moment a new person comes in we find out if they are a good recruit or not by how easy it was to get them to conform. If we felt that they were good enough we began our process by love bombing them, and then we start to make them feel that they are not doing enough or are not serious enough. We took them through a process of psychological breakdown. The intention behind all of this was to extract money, power, control, and sex. We also used a number of ways to communicate to Tony details about followers to make it appear that he had the ability to read others. We did this by installing hidden cameras, recording devices, and and personal spies. Tony would use this info and indirectly use it on the intended target which would cause them to believe in him even deeper. Im sure many reading this are wondering why I chose to come out now about all of this. Well, I have been diagnosed with cancer and I am in the final stages, I have very little time left. I had been an atheist most of my life but the closer I get to death the more I feel that there may be indeed a God. I have asked for forgiveness from God and vowed to share this information. I sincerely apologize to all those I have hurt. I was living my life without a heart. Tony and the others are also atheist and living without a heart. If you are at Sahaja and reading this I ask you to really use critical thinking and look around you. I know it maybe hard with all the deconditioning that has happened, but really try to look deeply. I wish you all the best moving forward and I hope that you are all able to repair your lives.

[Moderator note: Seems like gingerbeer is working for Mooji and monitoring the Web for his guru doesn't it?]



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2018 03:54AM by rrmoderator.