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Re: Rajneesh Osho - Not a Cute Hippie Guru - Cruel and Controlling
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: June 05, 2018 07:52AM

I did research at Rajneeshpuram, and here is what I learned
April 30, 2018 6.38am EDT

[forum.culteducation.com]

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Re: Rajneesh Osho - Not a Cute Hippie Guru - Cruel and Controlling
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: July 10, 2018 07:39AM

Rajneesh/Osho has a very large following in Spain

The ‘wild’ Osho cult seen through Spanish eyes
Disciples of the controversial Indian guru Osho defend his memory after the hit Netflix series ‘Wild Wild Country’ explores the dark side of the movement

CRISTIAN SEGURA
Barcelona 22 JUN 2018 - 02:38 EDT

[elpais.com]

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Rajneesh instructions on how to use mala - a trance script?
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: October 08, 2018 09:07AM

What follows is Corboy's speculation.

It would a valuable contribution if someone expert in analyzing trance induction could examine some of Rajneesh/Osho's lectures, and give a report.

Here is my amateur attempt to do so.

--------------------------------------------------------------

[newrepublic.com]

Quote

“Before I left for Pune [Poona, India], I was a very capable, articulate, professional woman,” claims Roselyn Smith, a forty-one-year-old social worker who was known as Ma Prem Sugatha when she followed the Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh. “When I got back I was in a totally hypnotic state. I was absolutely helpless.”
From Osho News Instructions on how to use the mala. To Corboy this sounds like
a great recipe for zoning out.

It looks like a guided meditation, lots of repetitions.

Quote

The Mala is a Device for Meditation

Protection Quotes — 21 August 2015

You ask me, “Why this mala? Why this picture?”

I will say, “Use it in this way, and this will happen,” and my answer is as scientific as possible.

Religion never claims to be rational, the only claim is of being irrational.

(Corboy: this is merely an opionion. It is not fact - unless you are already
a disciple of Rajneesh.)

Osho and mala

[www.oshonews.com]

Quote

Use the mala in this way: meditate on the picture, then the picture will not be there.

It happens so.

Then the absent picture becomes a door.

Through that door communicate with me.

It happens so.

After doing meditation, take this mala off and feel, and then put this mala on and feel, and you will see the difference.

Without this mala you will feel totally unprotected, totally in the reins of a force which can be harmful. With this mala on you will feel protected, you will be more confident, settled. Nothing can disturb from the outside.

It happens so

you will do the experiment and know. Why it happens cannot even be answered scientifically. And religiously there is no question to answer. Religion never claims, that is why so many rituals of religion become irrelevant.

As time passes by, a very meaningful ritual will become meaningless, because keys are lost and no one can say why this ritual exists. Then it becomes just a dead ritual. You cannot do anything with it. You can perform it, but the key is lost. For example, you can go on wearing the mala, and if you do not know that the picture in it is meant for some inner communication, then it will be just a dead weight. Then the key is lost. The mala may be with you, but the key is lost. Then one day or another you will have to throw away the mala because it is useless.

The mala is a device for meditation. It is a key. But this will come only through experience. I can only help you toward the experience. And unless it happens, you will not know. But it can happen, it is so easy, it is not difficult at all. When I am alive, it is so easy. When I am not there, it will be very difficult.

All these statues that have existed on this earth were used as such devices, but now they are meaningless. Buddha declared that his statue should not be made. But the work that was done by statues still will have to be done. Although the statue is meaningless, the real thing is the work that can be done through it.

Those who follow Mahavira can communicate with Mahavira through his statue even today. So what should Buddha’s disciples do? That is why the Bodhi tree became so important; it was used instead of Buddha’s statue. For five hundred years after Buddha there was no statue. In the Buddhist temples only a picture of the Bodhi tree and two symbolic footprints were kept, but this was sufficient. That still continues. The tree that exists in Bodhgaya is in continuity with the original tree. So still today those who know the key can communicate with Buddha through the Bodhi tree at Bodhgaya. It is not just meaningless that monks from all over the world come to Bodhgaya. But they must know the key, otherwise they will just go and the whole thing will be just a ritual.

So these are keys – particular mantras chanted in a particular way, pronounced in a particular way, emphasized in a particular way with such-and-such frequencies. A wavelength should be created, the waves should be created. Then the Bodhi tree is not just a Bodhi tree; it becomes a passage, it opens a door. Then twenty-five centuries are no more, the time gap is not there. You come face to face with Buddha. But keys are always lost. So this much can be said: use the locket, and you will know much. All that I have said will be known, and more that I have not said will be known also.

Osho, I am the Gate, Ch 3, Q 2 (excerpt)

Corboy: Lets look at the repetitions of certain words.

This talk is filled with repetitions.

What I find interesting is that Rajneesh repeats the word "door" three times. He says 'door' twice -
at the beginning of the talk and says 'door' for the third and last time at the very end of the talk.

We use a door to enter and exit a situation.

It is possible that Rajneesh leads the subjects into trance, the doorway, with the first mention of door. Perhaps he leads the subjects out of the trance, or partly out of it, when he mentions 'door' for the second and last time - toward the end of this talk.

Rajneesh begins:

Quote

Quote

Use the mala in this way: meditate on the picture, then the picture will not be there.

It happens so.

Then the absent picture becomes a door*. (door is repeated only a second time at the end of this talk.
Through that door* communicate with me.

It happens so.

After doing meditation, take this mala off and feel, and then put this mala on and feel, and you will see the difference.

Without this mala you will feel totally unprotected, totally in the reins of a force which can be harmful.

(Fear induction - Corboy)

With this mala on you will feel protected, you will be more confident, settled. Nothing can disturb from the outside.


It happens so;

you will do the experiment and know.

Why it happens cannot even be answered scientifically. And religiously there is no question to answer. Religion never claims, that is why so many rituals of religion become irrelevant.

Confusion induction - detaching people from former ties to religion and familiar rituals (Corboy hunch here)

As time passes by, a very meaningful ritual will become meaningless, because keys are lost1 and no one can say why this ritual exists. Then it becomes just a dead ritual. You cannot do anything with it. You can perform it, but the key is lost2.

For example, you can go on wearing the mala, and if you do not know that the picture in it is meant for some inner communication, then it will be just a dead weight. Then the key is lost3. The mala may be with you, but the key is lost4. Then one day or another you will have to throw away the mala because it is useless.

(Before this, Rajneesh gave the suggestion that the mala makes you feel protected, confident, settled. He also said "Without this mala you will feel totally unprotected, totally in the reins of a force which can be harmful. To say as he does here ' you will have to throw away the mala' 'the mala is useless'--this plants FEAR.

The mala is a device for meditation. It is a key.5 But this will come only through experience. I can only help you toward the experience.

(Rajneesh says the word 'key' for a sixth time and seventh time and an eight time-- and a ninth time. He does this further along in his talk
after he's stunned listeners with data overload.

And...when Rajneesh uses the word 'key' for the ninth and last time, he does something special, very special.)

(At the very moment Rajneesh speaks words to banish the fear he has elicited, he links himself to the mala. Fear followed by relief and gratitude -- that is a powerful combination.)

Corboy: After confusing the listener and detaching associations with past religions and familiar rituals, Rajneesh is making himself the only source of
focus and stability and tying this to the picture of him in the disciples mala.)

And unless it happens, you will not know. But it can happen, it is so easy, it is not difficult at all. When I am alive, it is so easy. When I am not there, it will be very difficult.

(More fear induction - while Rajneesh is alive comfort from the mala is easy, when he is gone, it will be more difficult. This ensures fear is part of the recipe for the attachment bond R instills in subjects.- Corboy's guess.)

All these statues that have existed on this earth were used as such devices, but now they are meaningless.

??(Corboy

Is this to detach subjects from meaningful associations they have formed with statues? This is very important. Statues hold ties to national and religious identity - the Statue of Liberty, Nelson's Statue in Trafalgar Square, statues of Jesus, Mary, saints, statues of Hindu, and Buddhist figures)

Buddha declared that his statue should not be made. But the work that was done by statues still will have to be done. Although the statue is meaningless, the real thing is the work that can be done through it.

Those who follow Mahavira can communicate with Mahavira through his statue even today. So what should Buddha’s disciples do?

(Rajneesh tied himself to Zorba the Buddha, conflating a popular book, a popular movie, and annexing buddhism for his own purposes. Here Rajneesh is linking himself to the buddhist heritage. Perhaps he is also exploiting the Tree of Life archetype, linking it to the Bodhi Tree - and to himself. As for Mahavira, Mahavira was an important figure in Jainism. Rajneesh was born into a Jain family. He talked about Mahavira a lot.

[www.google.com]

So in the following paragraph see how Rajneesh links the mala to the names he drops in his lectures. --C)

In this paragraph he bombs listeners with information - names, years, details, blah, blah. Raj is doing a data dump . This stuns the listeners' analytical minds, exactly the way a computer processing time slows down if its RAM is overwhelmed by too large a file.Or when we eat too much at a holiday meal and get bellyaches. Rajneesh is giving listeners cognitive indigestion)

That is why the Bodhi tree became so important; it was used instead of Buddha’s statue. For five hundred years after Buddha there was no statue. In the Buddhist temples only a picture of the Bodhi tree and two symbolic footprints were kept, but this was sufficient. That still continues. The tree that exists in Bodhgaya is in continuity with the original tree. So still today those who know the key6 can communicate with Buddha through the Bodhi tree at Bodhgaya. It is not just meaningless that monks from all over the world come to Bodhgaya. But they must know the key7, otherwise they will just go and the whole thing will be just a ritual.

So these are keys8 – particular* mantras chanted in a particular way1, pronounced in a particular way2, emphasized in a particular way3 with such-and-such frequencies.

A wavelength should be created, the waves should be created.

Then the Bodhi tree is not just a Bodhi tree; it becomes a passage, it opens a door*.

(Rajneesh is tying the beginning of this talk to the end of this talk. He used the word 'door' at the beginning of this lecture. He's closing the loop, tying the package up, neatly. Imagine this entire lecture given in Rajneesh's hissing voice -- many different sources refer to this.

[www.google.com])

Then twenty-five centuries are no more, the time gap is not there.

(Corboy Confusion of time, past present collapse - this is deep confusion, folks. And Rajneesh is linking it to that mala with his picture on the pendant)

You come face to face with Buddha.

But keys9( are always lost.

So this much can be said: use the locket, and you will know much.

All that I have said will be known, and more that I have not said will be known also.

(Friends, the ninth and last time Rajneesh refers to keys, he then refers not to the mala but to the locket -- the pendant on the mala that has Rajneesh's picture.

Now Rajneesh brings it all home with a punch. After suddenly
instilling anxiety with 'keys are always lost'
Raj for the first time gives the solution to the puzzle.

All through the talk, Raj refers to keys and doors.

But, something is missing.

A key opens a lock. But in this script, Raj has never mentioned lock.

But now he introduces the one word missing from the chain of cause and effect

Key-->Door

But Raj does it with a twist.

So this much can be said: use the locket, and you will know much.

Key-->Lock-->Door

Key-->Rajneesh/Beloved/Locket-->Door

All that I have said will be known, and more that I have not said will be known also.

He makes the mala, his picture, and the locket the ultimate solution in his
subjects' minds.

Keys close and open locks. Locks are used to close and secure stuff we treasure and consider important. Locks also hold captive. Locks make prisons.

And in the English language, "locket" has special meaning - a locket is where we keep a picture of someone we specially love and treasure.

Rajneesh was a highly educated man, a teacher at university level, before he entered the guru business. He knew English better than most of us do.

Al this is Corboy's hunch. I wish The Anticult were here.

TAC analyzed some of Byron Katie's material. TAC could have been very helpful in examining Rajneesh/Osho's output.

[www.google.com]
--------

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Re: Bhagwan Rajneesh Orgies
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: October 08, 2018 09:13AM

.The little dude was a helluva wordsmith.

For fun, here are a few of the repetitions in Rajneesh's instructions on how to use the mala.

Look at the many times he refers to 'key' or 'keys'.

The word 'key' has a wide range of definitions.

[www.google.com]

We speak of a riddle or puzzle has having a 'key', a solution.

Quote

Quote by Ralph Waldo Emerson : “All is a riddle, and the key to a ...
[www.goodreads.com]
“All is a riddle, and the key to a riddle...is another riddle.” ? Ralph Waldo Emerson. Read more quotes from Ralph Waldo Emerson. Share this quote: Facebook ...
Before you answer, the key to this riddle is right in front of you ...
[www.reddit.com]...

Dec 6, 2017 - 5 posts - ?2 authors
Sometimes you need a shift in perspective to put you in the right direction, and what you are left with will leave you with your answer. What is a.
The Sphinx's riddle is the key! : westworld 3 posts May 7, 2018
Decrypting the Key (Riddle) : codes 4 posts Oct 25, 2016
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We speak of something important as 'key'.

What do we do with keys?

Keys open and close doors. We need them to start and shut off automobiles.

But in this talk it is about keys and doors.

How do we feel if we cannot find our keys?

Scared. We can't get into our own homes or hotel rooms. We cant get into our
cars.

Without our keys our lives halt. We are trapped.

This is primitive, primal imagery, folks.

Then the absent picture becomes a door*.

Through that door* communicate with me.


It happens so.
It happens so;

keys are lost1
the key is lost2.

Then the key is lost3.
the key is lost4.

(Raj mentions lost keys FOUR TIMES.

Next, some relief comes in)

It is a key.5.

the key6 can communicate with Buddha .

But they must know the key7, otherwise they will just go and the whole thing will be just a ritual.

So these are keys8 – particular* mantras chanted in a particular way1, pronounced in a particular way2, emphasized in a particular way3 with such-and-such frequencies.

Then the Bodhi tree is not just a Bodhi tree; it becomes a passage, it opens a door*.

But keys9( are always lost.

Now Rajneesh brings it all home with a punch. After suddenly
instilling anxiety with 'keys are always lost'
Raj for the first time gives the solution to the puzzle.

All through the talk, Raj refers to keys and doors.

But, something is missing.

A key opens a lock. But in this script, Raj has never mentioned lock.

But now he introduces the one word missing from the chain of cause and effect

Key-->Door.

But Raj does it with a twist.

So this much can be said: use the locket, and you will know much.

Key-->Lock-->Door

Key-->Rajneesh/Beloved/Locket-->Door

All that I have said will be known, and more that I have not said will be known also.

He makes the mala, his picture, and the locket the ultimate solution in his
subjects' minds.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/08/2018 09:13AM by corboy.

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Re: Bhagwan Rajneesh Orgies
Posted by: Sahara71 ()
Date: October 09, 2018 07:18AM

Misstyk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Was there some kind of group
> hypnosis going on? I can understand, in the case
> of young, naive, and idealistic people coming from
> an abusive background, falling in with something
> like that, but there were middle-aged
> professionals there, even a psychologist! And
> somehow (he's not sure how, apparently) the
> psychologist was moved to give away his home?
> Where did he think he would go after his stay at
> the Rajneesh community? Was he caught up in some
> kind of group enthusiasm, a rush of donating
> frenzy?
>
> Some of it could be explained by the type of
> devotion that's encouraged, but that doesn't
> explain the newcomers, and highly educated and
> accomplished ones at that, who turn out to be so
> easily manipulated and gullible.


Misstyk,

Anyone can be suseptable to trance induction or hypnosis. It doesn't make any difference how intelligent or educated you are. I have been doing a lot of research on this, because it actually happened to me! I wouldn't have believed it was possible either, until I came under the influence.

As Corboy shared here in one of his posts- a professional social worker described Rajneesh as one of the best hypnotises he had ever seen. "The way he uses language, the tone of his voice, the sequence of ideas..." Rajneesh was a highly intelligent guy, very educated... I believe Rajneesh was a professor of philosophy before he became a cult leader. His ideas and the things he spoke of would appeal to other educated, intelligent people, because of the vocabulary he used.

Did you know that many people who join cults have above average intelligence? I think this is because they are the type of people who are questioning life and looking for something meaningful. I know I was looking for meaning when I because involved.

The clinical social worker I mentioned above said that the art of hypnosis was "the art of being vague, while pretending to be profound." That's exactly how I experienced it.

While I was under the influence, the words of the cult leader seemed extremely profound to me. If I listen to them now, they don't mean anything much, they are very repetitive and vague. It's just all mildly confusing stuff... it's useless, really. It has no real meaning. But some of the words are very loaded, very powerful, very suggestive... It somehow seemed meaningful, even though it wasn't.

I will have to listen to Rajneesh and write my impressions for you.

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Re: Bhagwan Rajneesh Orgies
Posted by: Sahara71 ()
Date: October 09, 2018 11:04AM

I just watched a Rajneesh talk on YouTube. It's very hypnotic stuff... Hard to understand, but definitely hypnotic.

At first, it seems Rajneesh speaks so slowly that you feel impatient with him. It's an unusual experience hearing someone speak so incredibly slowly. We are not used to this slow pace in our everyday lives.

He doesn't blink often and he has starey eyes. When he does blink, he blinks very slowly. His voice is always the same monotone- there is very little variation in tone, which has the effect of making you have to concentrate carefully on what he is saying, or else you could miss a word.

There are very long pauses in his speech and he draws out the ends of his words... Making a kind of 'shhhhhh' sound often, or even 'ssssss', like a snake!

It's weird stuff.

Rajneesh rabbles one topic to the next, without explaining what the purpose of the talk is. He doesn't give any clues that he is about to change topics or explain something else... It's really, really difficult to follow what he is talking about!

Most people would say "back to what I was trying to explain" or else "but I am digressing here" or something similar. Rajneesh never gives us the normal conversational clues that you would expect, he just transitions seamlessly from one topic to the next.

It's like a story, within a story, within a story. Pretty soon you lose track of where you are, which is the whole aim of it, I suppose. You kind of zone out.

Then Rajneesh explains that he is your 'friend', but not your master or your 'leader'. He waits until you are in a very relaxed state and open to suggestion before he starts telling you what he is to you, personally, like he knows you or something.

I only watched about 7 minutes of this stuff and I began to feel very, very sleepy. At that point, I turned it off and got up and did something else. I think it's definitely hypnosis or trance induction, not that I am an expert!

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Re: Bhagwan Rajneesh Orgies
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: October 09, 2018 08:50PM

Sahara71 wrote:

Quote

It's like a story, within a story, within a story. Pretty soon you lose track of where you are, which is the whole aim of it, I suppose. You kind of zone out.

Friend, what you said here describes a specific technique used in trance induction - nested loops.

Years ago on the CEI message board, The Anticult, an expert in trance induction, described this technique.

[forum.culteducation.com]

and

[forum.culteducation.com]

and

[forum.culteducation.com]

[forum.culteducation.com]

How to tell if you're tranced out: (read the whole page to get context)

Quote

The Anticult wrote:

one other thing before it slips away..

Janaki has a wonderful detailed recollection of how her conversion to Byron Katie happened. What's wonderful is that Janaki does not appear to know what "hypnosis" is, but her description could be in a textbook!

Put it this way, if you are getting "tunnel vision", and things are moving in "slow motion"...that's a clue!
:-)
Yes, there are people who know how to induce "trance" like this on people in minutes, or seconds.

[forum.culteducation.com]

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Re: Bhagwan Rajneesh Orgies
Posted by: Sahara71 ()
Date: October 11, 2018 04:02AM

Thanks Corboy,

I really need to do a lot more reading on hypnosis.

I read the link at the bottom of your post, all about Byron Katie. It is so fascinating. Unfortunately, the link to the woman's blog that The Anticult posted no longer works, as that blog is now "privacy protected" or whatever. I wonder why?

Anyway, it seems like, from what The Anticult posted, that this woman was very deliberately targeted by Byron Katie in order to manipulate her and use her to do BK's bidding. It's so sad, that someone could be so ruthless as to use another person in that way.

I really would have liked to read that blog, as I could have probably drawn some parallels with my own life and how I was unknowingly drawn in with hypnosis techniques, what might have happened to me, etc.

I actually have a one of BK's books on my shelf! I thought it was not a helpful book, it was very repetitive and just kind of tried to convince people that their problems didn't really exist, which is pretty pointless.

As for Rajneesh, I guessed that there was something up with his stories, within stories, within stories. I have even found an explaination for this in his own words somewhere... Rajneesh explains that his talks are really meditations and that you don't actually need to understand them on a rational level!

Pretty clever, calling hypnosis by the name "meditation"! Mooji actually does the same thing...he calls some of his YouTube hypnosis "guided meditation". I think the ploy is to suggest that it's going to be a relaxing experience for the viewer, because you need to relax in order to be hypnotised.

Very cunning.

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Re: Bhagwan Rajneesh Orgies
Posted by: Horowitz ()
Date: November 23, 2018 10:27AM

Osho worked also with the kundalini energy to active the muladhara chakra getting a spiritual trance. The dancing and yelling was the beginning of the practice and after that sex. Similar old techniques used Khlysts sect (Rasputin) ....

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