Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: January 27, 2012 02:40AM
??One way to disable the horror disgust response:
[forum.culteducation.com]
Lemme tell us what might happen if, literally we lost the moon.
The rhythm of life, of circadian light/dark cycles, the ocean tides, would all be gone.
We do NOT want to 'lose the moon' for our planet would be messed up.
In some cases, one must lose revulsion in order to function more effectively in certain specialized professions.
A key rite of passage for student physicians, nurses, dentists, paramedics/EMTs and physical therapists is anatomy class, in which one must face, perhaps for the first time in ones life, a dead persons body.
And then, step by careful step, dissect that body.
One must lose all or most of a very deep disgust/revulsion response and change one's reaction patterns, but one is doing this as part of a known and traditional training process to become a health care professional, a boundaried professional, who is extraordinarily accountable to law, professional codes of ethics.
One only disarms potent disgust reflexes in very special, boundaried contexts and under the scrutiny of mentors who are professionals and accountable to codes of law and ethics.
And another area where disgust is modified away from social norms is another highly boundaried area--training in the armed forces.
However, one knows beforehand one is entering the Army, Navy, Airforce. One can get information about it from research and from those who have served.
And there are tight rules and guidelines surrounding these domains of service. And those who have been in combat get re-wired yet further and if you are lucky some may be willing to tell you a little about the price paid when normal civilian taboos of disgust are too greatly warped out of alignment by combat. (a different level from boot training. Training for the Special Forces is much more extreme even than boot camp)
For a very informative book, get and read Trained to Kill by Nadelson
[www.bookfinder.com]
Many of the combat veterans interviewed by the author reported that they were unable to make sense of life in peacetime--their minds and bodies had been re-wired. Intimatcy with wives and girlfriends was difficult for some impossible for others years after combat. They had been trained to feel disgust for anything deemed 'feminine' 'soft' . Worst thing to do to a military trainee was to call him a C*** or P**Y or C******r.
And potential for abuse has been recognized, not once but again and again.
Trying to change basic disgust/revulsion patterns is a serious and risky business.
Its drastic enough in the armed forces where at least one can research before hand what its like and decide whether one wants to go through this.
But if a Human Potential entrepreneur (no clinical license) has ways to re-wire ones disgust reactions and will not tell you that, you can walk into a seminar or workshop and be exposed to something primally powerful.
Something you'd have perhaps chosen to avoid, had you been told clearly beforehand what it was--re-engineering your own disgust/revulsion reaction patterns--an important part of defining who you are and an important source of your boundaries and morality.
What you permit and what you do not permit.
Basic stuff. Dont let just anyone tamper with your car, your computer or your disgust patterns.
[forum.culteducation.com]
Lemme tell us what might happen if, literally we lost the moon.
The rhythm of life, of circadian light/dark cycles, the ocean tides, would all be gone.
We do NOT want to 'lose the moon' for our planet would be messed up.
In some cases, one must lose revulsion in order to function more effectively in certain specialized professions.
A key rite of passage for student physicians, nurses, dentists, paramedics/EMTs and physical therapists is anatomy class, in which one must face, perhaps for the first time in ones life, a dead persons body.
And then, step by careful step, dissect that body.
One must lose all or most of a very deep disgust/revulsion response and change one's reaction patterns, but one is doing this as part of a known and traditional training process to become a health care professional, a boundaried professional, who is extraordinarily accountable to law, professional codes of ethics.
One only disarms potent disgust reflexes in very special, boundaried contexts and under the scrutiny of mentors who are professionals and accountable to codes of law and ethics.
And another area where disgust is modified away from social norms is another highly boundaried area--training in the armed forces.
However, one knows beforehand one is entering the Army, Navy, Airforce. One can get information about it from research and from those who have served.
And there are tight rules and guidelines surrounding these domains of service. And those who have been in combat get re-wired yet further and if you are lucky some may be willing to tell you a little about the price paid when normal civilian taboos of disgust are too greatly warped out of alignment by combat. (a different level from boot training. Training for the Special Forces is much more extreme even than boot camp)
For a very informative book, get and read Trained to Kill by Nadelson
[www.bookfinder.com]
Many of the combat veterans interviewed by the author reported that they were unable to make sense of life in peacetime--their minds and bodies had been re-wired. Intimatcy with wives and girlfriends was difficult for some impossible for others years after combat. They had been trained to feel disgust for anything deemed 'feminine' 'soft' . Worst thing to do to a military trainee was to call him a C*** or P**Y or C******r.
And potential for abuse has been recognized, not once but again and again.
Trying to change basic disgust/revulsion patterns is a serious and risky business.
Its drastic enough in the armed forces where at least one can research before hand what its like and decide whether one wants to go through this.
But if a Human Potential entrepreneur (no clinical license) has ways to re-wire ones disgust reactions and will not tell you that, you can walk into a seminar or workshop and be exposed to something primally powerful.
Something you'd have perhaps chosen to avoid, had you been told clearly beforehand what it was--re-engineering your own disgust/revulsion reaction patterns--an important part of defining who you are and an important source of your boundaries and morality.
What you permit and what you do not permit.
Basic stuff. Dont let just anyone tamper with your car, your computer or your disgust patterns.
Adding a Byron Katie Blog Article to this archive
Posted by:
luckychrm
()
Date: January 30, 2012 02:46AM
Here is an article from September 2011 at Study – Grow – Know, a Christianity based blog authored by Th.D. Fred DeRuvo: [studygrowknowblog.com]
DeRuvo's analysis of the nonsensical nature of Byron Katie's self-promulgating quotation archive is likely 101 for most readers here at Rick Ross, but it always feels to me like a port in a storm to come across published criticism of Byron Katie and The Work.
I particularly appreciated these comments,
"Katie has a Facebook page and there, she highlights many of her statements that are designed to help people get past the problematic areas of their life. What is more than fascinating is how many people will click the “like” button and even leave their own comments extolling the value of Katie’s “deep” sentiments..."
DeRuvo's analysis of the nonsensical nature of Byron Katie's self-promulgating quotation archive is likely 101 for most readers here at Rick Ross, but it always feels to me like a port in a storm to come across published criticism of Byron Katie and The Work.
I particularly appreciated these comments,
"Katie has a Facebook page and there, she highlights many of her statements that are designed to help people get past the problematic areas of their life. What is more than fascinating is how many people will click the “like” button and even leave their own comments extolling the value of Katie’s “deep” sentiments..."
Janakiblog is gone private
Posted by:
Meateater
()
Date: February 27, 2012 11:29PM
For the last few days I made my way through this thread as a visitor. I am up to page 244. Just too much input and too often stuff that is not bk related. I skipped pages between around 130 to around 190.
I am interested in reading the whole Janaki text, but when I click on the links to her blog I am told that the blog is private. If I understand correctly there are two versions of this text. One which is kind of a final version (nicer versus bk) and a raw(?) version (not so nice versus bk). I would be interested in reading both of them side by side. How and where do I find those two versions?
Thanks in advance
I am interested in reading the whole Janaki text, but when I click on the links to her blog I am told that the blog is private. If I understand correctly there are two versions of this text. One which is kind of a final version (nicer versus bk) and a raw(?) version (not so nice versus bk). I would be interested in reading both of them side by side. How and where do I find those two versions?
Thanks in advance
Re: Janakiblog is gone private
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: February 28, 2012 05:33PM
Yes, this is a huge thread with lots of good research, mixed with off-topic stuff, and some flaming, etc!
But lots of good material in the thread.
That text might be available offline on request from the author?
also, try searching for the keywords in Google.
[www.theflawofattraction.com]
[docs.google.com]
But lots of good material in the thread.
That text might be available offline on request from the author?
also, try searching for the keywords in Google.
[www.theflawofattraction.com]
[docs.google.com]
Byron Katie, unpaid labor at for-profit seminars, labor violations?
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: February 29, 2012 01:17AM
Byron Katie is a multimillionaire, and BKI makes millions a month, certainly. They are a private for-profit corporation, owned and operated by Byron Katie and her husband, and it appears a few others.
Below are the job descriptions for the Byron Katie "school staff".
Again, these "Staff" are unpaid labor.
Notice that each of these "jobs" are paid jobs in any field.
Why does Byron Katie use unpaid labor?
Because all LGAT seminars learned years ago they could persuade people to work for free, and LABOR is the major cost of running any business. So to cut labor costs to ZERO means more profits.
Many sects do this, from Ching Hai [forum.culteducation.com] to Landmark and Soka Gakkai.
Many sects and groups have gotten into serious trouble for labor violations, for breaking minumum wage laws, and other labor regulations.
In the olden days, working for no pay was called slavery.
But beyond this, those who do this unpaid labor, also have to pay their own accomdations and travel.
these LGAT seminars like Byron Katie School produce millions in profit for the LGAT Guru like Byron Katie. They could hire staff, and pay people a decent wage, even though they are working 16 hours a day.
But why hire people to work, when you can persuade them to work for free?
Think of all the money you would save if you did not have to pay your Staff in your company!!
Is it legal to called unpaid workers "Staff" when working for a for-profit Corp?
There are labor laws and minimum wages for a reason.
Is it legal to work someone from Thurs morn until VERY LATE Sunday night, for no pay, no overtime pay?
Ask Byron Katie's daughter, or husband to work for no pay, and see what they say.
Why does Byron Katie get to make hundreds of thousands in profit at her Seminar, and no one else gets paid?
Who wants to work for free doing unpaid labor for a private for-profit Corp owned by a multimillionaire?
-----------job descriptions for the Byron Katie "school staff"------------------------------------
Job Descriptions
Each of the jobs below requires bringing a gentle and quiet mindfulness to the task at hand, and a willingness to ask for support when you need it and to unquestioningly support others when you are asked. Promptness, flexibility and good humor are a must.
Beauty and Order Coordinator (and Team)
An eye for cleanliness, design, and organization.You must be able to delegate the setup and breakdown of the Workroom. Physical stamina required.
Bookstore Assistant
Staffing, setup and breakdown of bookstore. You must check out orders, have knowledge of the books/materials, and be able to lift boxes of books.
Copy Coordinator
Organization, filing, and clerical tasks. You must be able to operate printer/duplicator, be deadline-oriented, and be able to take direction.
Course Administrator Assistant
High comfort level with computer (PC). You must be accomplished in Excel, PowerPoint, and Word, very detail-oriented, able to take direction and keep deadlines, able to be at School from early Thursday morning until late Sunday evening. You must be proficient in grammar and spelling and be able to move efficiently through a wide variety of administrative and organizational tasks.
Curriculum Assistant
Computer experience in data entry, Word (primarily) and PowerPoint. You must be good with copiers. Attention to detail is essential, as is organizing, working with and supporting the work of others, and meeting deadlines.
First Aid Support
Inventory, stocking, ordering. You must be able to handle minor first aid requests and call 911 in case of emergency.
Flower Arranger
Love for arranging and freshening flowers daily to maintain beauty.
Food Coordinator and Food Service Staff
Interpersonal skills, organizing, hosting, patience and flexibility with changes. You must be able to coordinate with the hotel chef and participants who have allergies and/or special dietary needs, and be available for food staff.
Handout Coordinator
Organization, filing, clerical, managing of information, clarity, calmness. You must be able to meet deadlines, stay in the Workroom during sessions, welcome last-minute changes, and arrange for efficient timing of handouts.
Media (slide and video) Show Coordinator
Media-editing experience required. You must be able to take photo / video media and quickly create a video slide show with music and timing. Final Cut Pro experience preferred.
Microphone Runner
You must be able to focus on series of participants raising their hands. This job requires focused attention, physical endurance, patience, plus coordination and speed to move quickly, quietly, and efficiently. Experience with sound equipment is a plus, but not required.
Morning Walk Team
You must be able to enjoy leading a group, walking for 30 minutes, maintaining silence and gettiing up early, and you must have a good sense of direction.
Outings Coordinator
Communicating with, directing and planning with a team, with clarity and patience. You must be comfortable handling special projects, have excellent time management, be good and flexible at making computer lists, organizing, driving truck/van, running errands, mapping, and routing.
Outings Team
You must be good at making computer lists, organizing, driving truck/van, running errands,mapping, routing, taking direction, thinking on your feet, and working with a coordinator and team.
Photographer
Solid photography experience is preferred. You will need to bring and use a good-quality digital SLR camera and zoom lens for low light conditions (2.8f preferred). Two memory cards and a Mac computer to load and sort pictures are a plus. You must be good at multitasking, photo selection and sorting, and meeting deadlines. You must be able to take great pictures while staying out of sight of the participants.
On the form please indicate your experience with photography and creating slideshows, and what kind of equipment you would be able to bring and use.
PowerPoint Operator
Computer experience, good PowerPoint skills, proficient grammar, spelling, and punctuation (this is important), and great focus. You must be able to listen to Katie's instructions and translate them into a PowerPoint slide almost immediately.
Runner/Portable Supply Staff
You must be able to bring and drive a car. You must be able to run errands, be good with maps, organize teams, do special projects, support all staff as needed, and have a solid knowledge of the area.
Scribe
Computer experience, 20-30 wpm. You must be able to selectively transcribe selectively what is said, type and pay attention enough to rate how good the sessions and pieces are, and understand a new piece of software.
Sound Assistant
Knowledge of sound equipment. You must be able to focus and quietly take direction from the Sound Coordinator. You must be comfortable with an iPod and iTunes.
Staff Contact
Strong interpersonal skills, attention to detail and instructions. You must be present and available in the Workroom, have a willingness to be on-call, have experience with and be comfortable with facilitating The Work.
Storeroom Coordinator
You must be able to focus in a busy work environment, know how to be organized and stay ahead of deadlines, know how to work independently, make quick decisions, be able to direct others with clarity and patience. You must be comfortable with basic accounting, inventory, coordination, and timely ordering of supplies within a budget.
Storeroom Assistant
You must have a willingness to be available, listen and take direction, know how to be organized and stay ahead of deadlines, be able to take inventory, be able to focus and pay attention to detail.
Technical Support Staff
Computer, data entry, and some software and hardware experience. You must be able to troubleshoot software and hardware problems.
Video Assistant
Mac computer and/or video experience. You must enjoy high-tech gear, be organized, love to learn new things, be quiet, quick, and comfortable on Mac. You must be able to backup, organize video and photography files and position media in a video editing program (Final Cut Pro) for the Media Show Coordinator and editors. You must be able to organize notes from the Videographer or Katie regarding media for the product. You must be able to generally support the Videographer.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/29/2012 01:26AM by The Anticult.
Below are the job descriptions for the Byron Katie "school staff".
Again, these "Staff" are unpaid labor.
Notice that each of these "jobs" are paid jobs in any field.
Why does Byron Katie use unpaid labor?
Because all LGAT seminars learned years ago they could persuade people to work for free, and LABOR is the major cost of running any business. So to cut labor costs to ZERO means more profits.
Many sects do this, from Ching Hai [forum.culteducation.com] to Landmark and Soka Gakkai.
Many sects and groups have gotten into serious trouble for labor violations, for breaking minumum wage laws, and other labor regulations.
In the olden days, working for no pay was called slavery.
But beyond this, those who do this unpaid labor, also have to pay their own accomdations and travel.
these LGAT seminars like Byron Katie School produce millions in profit for the LGAT Guru like Byron Katie. They could hire staff, and pay people a decent wage, even though they are working 16 hours a day.
But why hire people to work, when you can persuade them to work for free?
Think of all the money you would save if you did not have to pay your Staff in your company!!
Is it legal to called unpaid workers "Staff" when working for a for-profit Corp?
There are labor laws and minimum wages for a reason.
Is it legal to work someone from Thurs morn until VERY LATE Sunday night, for no pay, no overtime pay?
Ask Byron Katie's daughter, or husband to work for no pay, and see what they say.
Why does Byron Katie get to make hundreds of thousands in profit at her Seminar, and no one else gets paid?
Who wants to work for free doing unpaid labor for a private for-profit Corp owned by a multimillionaire?
-----------job descriptions for the Byron Katie "school staff"------------------------------------
Job Descriptions
Each of the jobs below requires bringing a gentle and quiet mindfulness to the task at hand, and a willingness to ask for support when you need it and to unquestioningly support others when you are asked. Promptness, flexibility and good humor are a must.
Beauty and Order Coordinator (and Team)
An eye for cleanliness, design, and organization.You must be able to delegate the setup and breakdown of the Workroom. Physical stamina required.
Bookstore Assistant
Staffing, setup and breakdown of bookstore. You must check out orders, have knowledge of the books/materials, and be able to lift boxes of books.
Copy Coordinator
Organization, filing, and clerical tasks. You must be able to operate printer/duplicator, be deadline-oriented, and be able to take direction.
Course Administrator Assistant
High comfort level with computer (PC). You must be accomplished in Excel, PowerPoint, and Word, very detail-oriented, able to take direction and keep deadlines, able to be at School from early Thursday morning until late Sunday evening. You must be proficient in grammar and spelling and be able to move efficiently through a wide variety of administrative and organizational tasks.
Curriculum Assistant
Computer experience in data entry, Word (primarily) and PowerPoint. You must be good with copiers. Attention to detail is essential, as is organizing, working with and supporting the work of others, and meeting deadlines.
First Aid Support
Inventory, stocking, ordering. You must be able to handle minor first aid requests and call 911 in case of emergency.
Flower Arranger
Love for arranging and freshening flowers daily to maintain beauty.
Food Coordinator and Food Service Staff
Interpersonal skills, organizing, hosting, patience and flexibility with changes. You must be able to coordinate with the hotel chef and participants who have allergies and/or special dietary needs, and be available for food staff.
Handout Coordinator
Organization, filing, clerical, managing of information, clarity, calmness. You must be able to meet deadlines, stay in the Workroom during sessions, welcome last-minute changes, and arrange for efficient timing of handouts.
Media (slide and video) Show Coordinator
Media-editing experience required. You must be able to take photo / video media and quickly create a video slide show with music and timing. Final Cut Pro experience preferred.
Microphone Runner
You must be able to focus on series of participants raising their hands. This job requires focused attention, physical endurance, patience, plus coordination and speed to move quickly, quietly, and efficiently. Experience with sound equipment is a plus, but not required.
Morning Walk Team
You must be able to enjoy leading a group, walking for 30 minutes, maintaining silence and gettiing up early, and you must have a good sense of direction.
Outings Coordinator
Communicating with, directing and planning with a team, with clarity and patience. You must be comfortable handling special projects, have excellent time management, be good and flexible at making computer lists, organizing, driving truck/van, running errands, mapping, and routing.
Outings Team
You must be good at making computer lists, organizing, driving truck/van, running errands,mapping, routing, taking direction, thinking on your feet, and working with a coordinator and team.
Photographer
Solid photography experience is preferred. You will need to bring and use a good-quality digital SLR camera and zoom lens for low light conditions (2.8f preferred). Two memory cards and a Mac computer to load and sort pictures are a plus. You must be good at multitasking, photo selection and sorting, and meeting deadlines. You must be able to take great pictures while staying out of sight of the participants.
On the form please indicate your experience with photography and creating slideshows, and what kind of equipment you would be able to bring and use.
PowerPoint Operator
Computer experience, good PowerPoint skills, proficient grammar, spelling, and punctuation (this is important), and great focus. You must be able to listen to Katie's instructions and translate them into a PowerPoint slide almost immediately.
Runner/Portable Supply Staff
You must be able to bring and drive a car. You must be able to run errands, be good with maps, organize teams, do special projects, support all staff as needed, and have a solid knowledge of the area.
Scribe
Computer experience, 20-30 wpm. You must be able to selectively transcribe selectively what is said, type and pay attention enough to rate how good the sessions and pieces are, and understand a new piece of software.
Sound Assistant
Knowledge of sound equipment. You must be able to focus and quietly take direction from the Sound Coordinator. You must be comfortable with an iPod and iTunes.
Staff Contact
Strong interpersonal skills, attention to detail and instructions. You must be present and available in the Workroom, have a willingness to be on-call, have experience with and be comfortable with facilitating The Work.
Storeroom Coordinator
You must be able to focus in a busy work environment, know how to be organized and stay ahead of deadlines, know how to work independently, make quick decisions, be able to direct others with clarity and patience. You must be comfortable with basic accounting, inventory, coordination, and timely ordering of supplies within a budget.
Storeroom Assistant
You must have a willingness to be available, listen and take direction, know how to be organized and stay ahead of deadlines, be able to take inventory, be able to focus and pay attention to detail.
Technical Support Staff
Computer, data entry, and some software and hardware experience. You must be able to troubleshoot software and hardware problems.
Video Assistant
Mac computer and/or video experience. You must enjoy high-tech gear, be organized, love to learn new things, be quiet, quick, and comfortable on Mac. You must be able to backup, organize video and photography files and position media in a video editing program (Final Cut Pro) for the Media Show Coordinator and editors. You must be able to organize notes from the Videographer or Katie regarding media for the product. You must be able to generally support the Videographer.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/29/2012 01:26AM by The Anticult.
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: February 29, 2012 03:00AM
Byron Katie a tycoon in the .05% pretending she is the 99%
Its the pretending that is sinful.
And if you dont pay them and get them to work as volunteers there are additional advantages
No need to follow state safety regulations
No need for health insurance
No need to hire somone to oversee payroll and to report earnings to the IRS or Social Security
Unpaid labor is yet another form of WEALTH
Its the pretending that is sinful.
And if you dont pay them and get them to work as volunteers there are additional advantages
No need to follow state safety regulations
No need for health insurance
No need to hire somone to oversee payroll and to report earnings to the IRS or Social Security
Unpaid labor is yet another form of WEALTH
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) Byron Katie seminar DEATH CLAUSE.
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: February 29, 2012 06:35PM
www.thework.com/school-staff-jobpref.php
Its not enough to work for free for Byron Katie, you are told to bring and use your own private property in the BKI private business, and use your cell phones, iPhones, macs, MacBooks, cars, etc.
What about the minimum wage labor laws?
What about using other people's equipment in a private business?
But never mind that, as seen in the BKI release, they try to get you to literally sign your LIFE away to BKI in the Byron Katie School seminar DEATH CLAUSE. [forum.culteducation.com]
Its not enough to work for free for Byron Katie, you are told to bring and use your own private property in the BKI private business, and use your cell phones, iPhones, macs, MacBooks, cars, etc.
What about the minimum wage labor laws?
What about using other people's equipment in a private business?
But never mind that, as seen in the BKI release, they try to get you to literally sign your LIFE away to BKI in the Byron Katie School seminar DEATH CLAUSE. [forum.culteducation.com]
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: February 29, 2012 11:56PM
Soldiers, sailors and Air Force personnel swear away their lives when they take the oath.
But..at least in the civilized countries, the military provides health care for its personnel, both in service and in retirement, and offers support for families and in event of death, a widower's or widow's pension.
One fills out an insurance application.
There is also a Uniform Code of Military Justice.
These are not perfect, but they are there.
Where's the equivalent of that in these New Age businesses, eh?
But..at least in the civilized countries, the military provides health care for its personnel, both in service and in retirement, and offers support for families and in event of death, a widower's or widow's pension.
One fills out an insurance application.
There is also a Uniform Code of Military Justice.
These are not perfect, but they are there.
Where's the equivalent of that in these New Age businesses, eh?
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: May 08, 2012 11:05PM
This is a page full of classic older posts on this topic. In case anyone is new to the front page and is visiting, here is a bit to read.
Goodie bags, red roses.
[forum.culteducation.com]
Goodie bags, red roses.
[forum.culteducation.com]
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