Dear Guruphobic, I didnt post your material on Guruphiliac, either.

Am sorry you're going through this.

hey, here are a few thoughts about all this internet posting, you may or may not agree with, which is great.

What is it all about? Journaling? no, its about communicating.
But isn't it about trying to get the word out, and get some education into the public about the dangerous effects of these programs?

That's what I think its all about. So some of my posts have been cross-posted and linked, and I actually think that's fine, its a good thing. Would it be best if they were attributed and linked properly? of course, but we can't control that. So if anything there is not near ENOUGH linking and excerpt cross-posting going on about this subject in general. Nowhere near enough.

It is going to help the public much more if folks even just make 2 new links or excerpt cross-posts each day, to blogs, other chat-forums, anywhere. Hey, if 10 new links were made each day by a handful of people, word gets out. (groups like BK organize that stuff like crazy)

As a matter of fact, all the cross-posting and linking will help HUNDREDS of people for YEARS to come. Even thousands of people. For years people will read it. Cross-posting excerpts for analysis is legal and moral. Its totally fine, and its very important.
I say the MORE cross-posting and linking, the better. this is not navel-gazing...its serious stuff, and it helps people.
Its about doing good things to help many people!

linking and excerpt cross-posting is great.
If a person makes maybe 3 links and excerpts, etc, each day, within a month its all over Google.
We need MORE links, MORE excerpts..

For example, to Factnet, to other skeptical forums...

BIG NAME BLOGS. If some big name blogs cover it, that's good. already there are a few links out there.

Google Blog Search, search for Byron Katie blogs here, and make some comments!!
[www.google.com]

Search Google and Google blogs, for Byron Katie and various keywords, and help people.
[www.google.com]

So I would say, the way to help more people, is more linking, more posting, more excerpts and cross-posting, etc. Over time it can really help people. They can sit at home and think about things.
For example, search for PSI SEMINARS. [www.google.com]

or for - Byron Katie cult - which is how someone might type it in.

the person who doesn't know about all the LGAT and mind control can learn all about it!
This is why most LGATS and culty groups hate the internet.
Now they are trying to control it by having their own people make a zillion post and links.

So to help real people, learn from other people, go out and link all over the place.
It can help people, it can even posibly save a life going down the drain to one of these groups.
Education,Awareness and Knowledge is their enemy.
Ignorance is their friend.

So post, link, excerpt, and who knows, maybe some real folks will be helped out a bit.

this is adding to this thread of exploring the cloudy origins of Byron Katie and The Work.
[forum.culteducation.com]

Note: do metasearches with various search engines, as someone has scrubbed various articles about Byron Katie out of the Google index.

NAMES:

(this article gives a new family name)
[www.culteducation.com]
Her sons carry the family name: ROBINSON
(maybe Byron Katie used that name for a while too when she was married?)

Maybe: Byron Kathleen Robinson, or variants?

BYRON KATIE LIST OF NAMES:
Current name: Byron Kathleen Mitchell
Divorced: Byron Kathleen Rolle
Born: Byron Kathleen Reid

Some Google results for: Byron Katie Rolle, Katie Rolle,
There are also results just running the middle and last names together.

There are a few references about:
Byron Katie Rolle, Founder of The Center For The Work in Barstow, CA.

Possible INFLUENCES for The Work:

Katie says she founded in 1986 - The Work.
What else was founded in 1985? - The Forum. (Werner Erhard from EST).

Same name? "The WorK" a "Fourth Way School, "founded by Alexander Francis Horn and Sharon Gans-Horn.
[www.culteducation.com]


Byron Katie, The Work, RELIGIOUS ORIGIN MYTH:

-She said she went to: Hope House, a Los Angeles residential treatment center (now closed).
-Pat Scales, who says she was a therapist at Hope House. "Scales says that she had never seen anything like it in a therapy setting. "There was definitely a personality shift," she says. "I was on a spiritual path at the time. I recognized that something rather extraordinary had happened to her. She wasn't the same crazy person that she had been the day before."
That is a very strange statement for a therapist to make? Who is Pat Scales? Who does she work for now? Is she just part of the "story"?

- Her husband Stephen Mitchell seems more than highly dubious, he says this ridiculous statement: ""I don't know of an instance of this happening to another human being," he says. "It's like if you took psychosis or amnesia as a negative and printed it as a positive photograph."

- her kids, at least a couple of them, are highly into The Work, so their "stories" frankly don't carry much weight, without objective evidence, there are conflicts of interests involved, after all.
They say: "It was like they dropped off a completely different person--the most innocent, sweetest child you've ever seen," Burroughs says. "There just aren't programs that produce a different person." Katie's son Ross Robinson adds, "She seemed like an alien to me."
(there ARE LGAT type programs that make people seems like "aliens", and they were very big in 1986)

The article states:
"trying to confirm the more incredible elements of her story is like looking for the footprints where Jesus walked on water. Why have some of the key people and places in her story been lost to history? "

It seems the only way to get the real story details, would be for a private detective to work with a serious journalist to dig up the true story. Maybe if someone is working on a book, or feature article.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2008 05:05PM by The Anticult.

Here is some new information about a recent Byron Katie blog posting that says..
Quote:
"...the biopsy showed that I have cancer on my nose, phase 2 basal carcinoma. He wants to start me on radiation for four weeks as soon as possible. I start Turnaround House, my heart’s desire, tomorrow, and am wondering how the days will look as I intend to be there daily with the exception of two weekends..."

Byron Katie(phase 2 basal carcinoma) Skin Cancer-Basal Cell Carcinoma
[forum.culteducation.com]

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corboy
Dear Guruphobic, I didnt post your material on Guruphiliac, either.

Am sorry you're going through this.

i didn't post anything on Guruphiliac either,
Shad

Quote
SarahL
If you haven't already done so, run a search here on this site, some good threads on them both.
I've looked over some info on Tolle and stay clear of him and anyone like him. Loaded confusing language is used (a.k.a. mumbo jumbo), focus is encouraged on his eyes and appearance, all too much like most every other charlatan.

quite frankly, i think in that photo of Tolle (that he has on his site - with the Tilley Hat) he looks quite demented. I would not talk to him if you paid me a million dollars!

regards,
Shad

i just checked out a couple of Katie's utube seminars, what a load of crap, first of all, she just keeps repeating the same phrase over and over, then when she asks a person a question she interrups the person mid-sentence. Sorry, but i just don't have the patience for this. i watched for about 3 minutes and that was enough for me.

Shad

a little bit more information about Basal Cell Carcinoma (BCC),
and Byron Katie's shocking news about cancer, radiation, and brush with death.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Byron Katie wrote about...cancer...radiation...death and dying...

Shocking and scary words that can strike fear, anxiety and sadness in anyone who has gone through serious cancer and death in the family...


But in terms of general information, there does not appear to be cause for worry or talk of death or dying in virtually all cases of Basal Cell Carcinoma.

Basal Cell Carcinoma: (BCC)
A very common, non-melanoma skin cancer that almost 1/3 of women will get, very high cure rates of 95-99%, with less than 1/10of 1% chance of metastisizing, treated by surgery, or in some cases X-ray Radiotherapy treatments.

There are no warnings about mortality or death, on the contrary they state most cases are easily treated and cured.

________________________________________________________
[www.patient.co.uk]
-Most cases of non-melanoma skin cancer are easily treated and cured.
-Almost all BCCs can be treated and cured, mostly with a simple operation or other simple technique. They rarely spread.
-Non-melanoma skin cancers include basal cell carcinoma (BCC)
_________________________________________________________
Basal Cell Carcinoma Emedicine.
[www.emedicine.com]

-Basal cell carcinoma (BCC) is very common, slow growing, and rarely metastasizes

-cure rates are as high as 95%-99%.
-less than 1/10 of 1% of them metastisize.
-"Mortality/Morbidity: Although BCC is a malignant neoplasm, it rarely metastasizes. The incidence of metastatic BCC is estimated at less than 0.1%"

- up to 28% of women are going to get it at some point.
-"In the US: Each year in the United States, 900,000 people are diagnosed with BCC (550,000 male, 350,000 female). The estimated lifetime risk of BCC in the white population is 33-39% for men and 23-28% for women."

-Treatment: is surgical in almost all cases. There are some cases where "Ionizing radiation: Superficial
X-ray is usually administered as 10 treatments of 4 gray (Gy)".
-That is referred to as X-ray treatment.

I posted about this on another Byron Katie-related thread, but since Anticult has referred to it in this thread, I'm posting it here too.

It's a new entry on Byron Katie's blog, posted late last night: Shocking News From Byron Katie.

I discovered it this morning and found it kinda suspicious, given that the woman and her organization have come under such scrutiny lately.

This is the text of the blog entry:

Quote

A Phone Call

My daughter called me to let me know how her day went yesterday. I love listening to her report her journey into the mind.

Roxann is so very into The Work, her joy, her life, and at some point she asked me what I was up to and for no reason, out of my mouth, I said, “Oh, guess what? I have cancer!” I was thrilled, of course, to report my day.

There was silence, and then the line was disconnected.

She called back and said, “Mom, that is not something you say to your daughter as though it were an everyday event.” And of course it was.

The doctor had just called and said that he wanted me to come into his office as soon as possible to talk, that the biopsy showed that I have cancer on my nose, phase 2 basal carcinoma. He wants to start me on radiation for four weeks as soon as possible. I start Turnaround House, my heart’s desire, tomorrow, and am wondering how the days will look as I intend to be there daily with the exception of two weekends. Anyway, my husband and my sons cannot be upset, my daughter cannot be upset, they really don’t know what they are supposed to feel and until they do, they don’t. For me, I don’t bother. I love life and that is my job. When Stephen was talking to the doctor, my thought was, “Ha ha, ha, ha, I have cancer and you don’t!” This thought and thoughts like this continue to override anything untrue to my way of understanding and keep me laughing and loving what is mind. I continue to wonder why people (mind) continue to believe that what never lived can die. It really is quite wonderful to be mind free of physical self-image. Denial is believing that you, as you understand you to be, ever are what or who you are, have been, or ever will or can be.

I invite you all to inquiry, to your own marvelous death of the body (before it dies) as you understand it to be and to be born of who and what you are not to your mind and then to understand what you are in that, as that unknowable known. I hope that you have followed what I have just written, as so many of you who love The Work for so many months or years have been able to do. Your own answers to the questions and examples of turnarounds have kept us as one, undivided in peace and beyond, for so many months, even years. I live in you and I die in you, what else is possible? Nothing. I love living in you if you love it, and I can tell you that you live in me and only that, you are my life. I love not belonging to me and you do and belonging to you when I do. What identification have you given me? I live as that. Do you love me yet? I welcome you to love beyond the self.

Contrary to first impression, that paragraph above by Byron Katie is NOT insane, or crazy at all, its very well constructed.

Those types of language patterns are very similar to ones used in Ericksonian Hypnosis, and covert NLP persuasion.
Its a type of Waking Hypnosis, that uses indirect and embedded commands, double-binds, illogical stories, metaphors, to occupy the conscious mind, to allow direct communication with the Unconscious. Its all very well studied.

Clearly, Byron Katie is doing her own version of that, to created programmed confusion in the waking state, then to state to "pace and lead" and draw the subjects where she wants to take them.
For those who have studied that stuff, the paragraph below would tell it all.

Email that paragraph to some covert Ericksonian hypnosis experts, and have them analyze it. They would find it unique, yet see the clear techniques, mixed in with the weird stuff.
In hypnosis, weird is very useful.

I could go through the entire thing, but here's one line she built to..
"I live in you and I die in you".

She is literally trying to get into the deepest part of your psyche, and FUSE WITH IT, using that hypnotic command, its very common stuff. She can get into the deepest part of your mind and "soul".

"Do you love me yet?" That is a presupposition and leading question, an outright ugly abuse of hypnotic language, to make you LOVE HER.

Anyone can go through the entire thing and pick it out, its not hard when written, much more difficult when spoken. Its just very basic UNCONSCIOUS PERSUASION using HYPNOTIC LANGUAGE patterns, quetions and commands .
Her simple goal?

TO MAKE YOU LOVE HER MORE THAN LIFE ITSELF.

Its hypnotic guru manipulation and abuse of love, very clear, and very common in that field of cultic Guruship.

[www.google.com]

Quote
jj52

Quote
vlinden

I invite you all to inquiry, to your own marvelous death of the body (before it dies) as you understand it to be and to be born of who and what you are not to your mind and then to understand what you are in that, as that unknowable known. I hope that you have followed what I have just written, as so many of you who love The Work for so many months or years have been able to do. Your own answers to the questions and examples of turnarounds have kept us as one, undivided in peace and beyond, for so many months, even years. I live in you and I die in you, what else is possible? Nothing. I love living in you if you love it, and I can tell you that you live in me and only that, you are my life. I love not belonging to me and you do and belonging to you when I do. What identification have you given me? I live as that. Do you love me yet? I welcome you to love beyond the self.

This has to be one of the most insane paragraphs I've ever read. It's absolutely incomprehensible. Does she speak like this as well? Do people follow her? Do they think they should understand her and just feel badly about themselves when they don't?

Wow.

Yeah, she speaks like that a lot... for hours on end during The School. And, strange this is... it starts to make sense after awhile. Unfortunately, I still understand what's she's talking about. I just don't believe it. At all.

-jj