Re: Byron Katie (the Work) NLP, Hypnotherapy, Paul Hessinger
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: March 03, 2009 07:43PM
The connection of Byron Katie with covert NLP style Ericksonian hypnotherapy, (as done by her close associate Stever Robbins) has been mentioned a number of times. But its important to remember that BK does much more than these methods, and she has customized them in her own way. A guess might be that at most 30% of what she does is along these lines, with most of the other stuff ranging from social influence techniques, LGAT methods, and a huge grab-bag of psychotherapeutic techniques picked up over the years, as well as dozens of sales techniques. People are being bombarded with more that 50 techniques all at once when they walk into a seminar. It would be possible to list dozens of techniques being used all at once. They do this, as this makes sure it works on as many people as possible, as everyone is unique, and to get the maximum impact, that can last for years.
But its a good idea to do some research into some of the more basic NLP style hypnotherapists out there.
There are many different kinds.
For example, some self-identify themselves as doing NLP style hypnosis, like this guy.
Paul Hessinger, Certified Master Neuro-Linguistic Practitioner/Hypnotherapist
FREE monthly hypnosis/NLP events - NLP Cafe San Francisco
[sfbay.craigslist.org]
WWW.PAULNLP.COM
Now, people need to be extremely careful with guys like this. It literally would take books to explain what these folks are doing, in terms of persuasion. But you can NEVER, and I mean EVER take any type of NLP-hypnotherapist at face value. NEVER. They are not just some dude in a Hawaiian shirt talking to you. (you can be guaranteed, that Hawaiian shirt Paul Hessinger wears is used as a Visual Anchor, and makes you want to ....r-e-l-a-x...that's right....like you now are on a warm tropical island....etc) Standard stuff, but people don't even notice something that obvious.
The only thing positive one could say about this guy, is at least he self-identifies as doing hypnotherapy and NLP, although his explanation of it is very dubious.
The language on his website is very carefully chosen, as well as the design.
For example, people do not know that a "free event" is anything but free. These guys know how to get up and talk, and it sounds pretty tepid, but almost all people have no idea of the kinds or persuasion that is being done to them, just by using language. The "content" of their speaking, is almost irrelevant, depending on their skill level.
Again, it takes book to explain this stuff, but it can be very powerful.
And sadly, its being used just to make money. If they find someone who is highly suggestible, and a bit naive, then next thing you know, 10's of thousands of dollars are gone into 'coaching' sessions.
But guess what?
Guys like this are the most obvious.
You could call them Version 2.0
There are Version 3.0 people, who do all the same techniques of NLP hypno-persuasion, but don't self-identify as such. They sell themselves as selling Sales or Coaching, or whatever. They just modify the language and their marketing image. When they speak, it just sounds like a typical business person.
There are also more advanced Version 4.0 people, who might present themselves as a spiritual New Age Energy Healer, or just a generic psychological seminar leader selling almost anything, when in fact they have all the same training as this guy, but have concealed it completely. Those folks can do very well, as no one knows what is going on. This would have been Byron Katie up to maybe 10 years ago, as you can see in the suppressed out-of-print books from that time.
But the New Byron Katie might be a version 5.0.
She is doing very advanced methods, and doing them very well, and its almost totally concealed, and ambiguous. (this is why her past books were suppressed, as they conflict in certain areas with the newer approach)
On top of that, she markets her Story that she is some type of mystical Savant, and acts like she has no idea of what she is doing.
So she taps into people's spiritual and religious impulses, as well as psychological areas, depression, anxiety, sexual and relationships, health, money, and anything else.
On top of that she carefully engineers people into basically "worshipping" her, when verbally she may say the opposite. She likes to play those opposites, not only in marketing.
These folks learned that if people know you are doing persuasion, or hypnotherapy, they will resist to a much greater degree. But if they have no idea you are doing that, there is almost no resistance.
On top of that, she engineers passivity and acceptance into her subjects, right from the start.
So its not easy to see at first glance, and requires some homework, like studying more obvious people who do similar things.
But there are going to be more Byron Katie 5.0 coming along, that is for sure. Its a brilliant insight. Because there is no licenses, then there is no responsibility.
The audience has no idea of the persuasion methods, so there is little resistance.
And its all done under a veil of plausible deniability. If a journalist, if there are any left, ever does some research, then its easy to deny everything and anything, as its all designed with a double-meaning, and is also done in the manner of a Spiritual Savant.
Regular folks are not aware that people who do this type of persuasion hypnotherapy, spend months and years writing, and refining their inductions, which are their STORIES. All of Byron Katie's stories are a type of induction. And notice, she tells people to drop their stories, so she plays that opposite again.
Thankfully, even if people can't see the specifics and the techniques in her Magick, people generally know when their chain is being jerked.
Why are Byron Katie "fans" so fanatical? Why are their websites full of every word she says?
Why are they "in love" with her, and copying her language patterns?
Its all designed.
A guy like Werner Erhard was more like a 3.0, he still tried to present himself as being "smart" and knowing what he is talking about.
But the new method, is like Byron Katie, and some other current Mysterians, is far more powerful and subtle.
Version 1.0 people were the ones with shaved heads banging drums in the airport.
Version 5.0 wear pantsuits, and play Savant, and pretend they have no idea of what they are doing, when in fact they run their companies like any other CEO behind the scenes.
Those who have worked closely with the Anti-Guru at many events, would start to see this eventually. But it really is a brilliant performance.
There will be many more new age Version 5.0 Savant Guru's to come, that is for sure.
But its a good idea to do some research into some of the more basic NLP style hypnotherapists out there.
There are many different kinds.
For example, some self-identify themselves as doing NLP style hypnosis, like this guy.
Paul Hessinger, Certified Master Neuro-Linguistic Practitioner/Hypnotherapist
FREE monthly hypnosis/NLP events - NLP Cafe San Francisco
[sfbay.craigslist.org]
WWW.PAULNLP.COM
Now, people need to be extremely careful with guys like this. It literally would take books to explain what these folks are doing, in terms of persuasion. But you can NEVER, and I mean EVER take any type of NLP-hypnotherapist at face value. NEVER. They are not just some dude in a Hawaiian shirt talking to you. (you can be guaranteed, that Hawaiian shirt Paul Hessinger wears is used as a Visual Anchor, and makes you want to ....r-e-l-a-x...that's right....like you now are on a warm tropical island....etc) Standard stuff, but people don't even notice something that obvious.
The only thing positive one could say about this guy, is at least he self-identifies as doing hypnotherapy and NLP, although his explanation of it is very dubious.
The language on his website is very carefully chosen, as well as the design.
For example, people do not know that a "free event" is anything but free. These guys know how to get up and talk, and it sounds pretty tepid, but almost all people have no idea of the kinds or persuasion that is being done to them, just by using language. The "content" of their speaking, is almost irrelevant, depending on their skill level.
Again, it takes book to explain this stuff, but it can be very powerful.
And sadly, its being used just to make money. If they find someone who is highly suggestible, and a bit naive, then next thing you know, 10's of thousands of dollars are gone into 'coaching' sessions.
But guess what?
Guys like this are the most obvious.
You could call them Version 2.0
There are Version 3.0 people, who do all the same techniques of NLP hypno-persuasion, but don't self-identify as such. They sell themselves as selling Sales or Coaching, or whatever. They just modify the language and their marketing image. When they speak, it just sounds like a typical business person.
There are also more advanced Version 4.0 people, who might present themselves as a spiritual New Age Energy Healer, or just a generic psychological seminar leader selling almost anything, when in fact they have all the same training as this guy, but have concealed it completely. Those folks can do very well, as no one knows what is going on. This would have been Byron Katie up to maybe 10 years ago, as you can see in the suppressed out-of-print books from that time.
But the New Byron Katie might be a version 5.0.
She is doing very advanced methods, and doing them very well, and its almost totally concealed, and ambiguous. (this is why her past books were suppressed, as they conflict in certain areas with the newer approach)
On top of that, she markets her Story that she is some type of mystical Savant, and acts like she has no idea of what she is doing.
So she taps into people's spiritual and religious impulses, as well as psychological areas, depression, anxiety, sexual and relationships, health, money, and anything else.
On top of that she carefully engineers people into basically "worshipping" her, when verbally she may say the opposite. She likes to play those opposites, not only in marketing.
These folks learned that if people know you are doing persuasion, or hypnotherapy, they will resist to a much greater degree. But if they have no idea you are doing that, there is almost no resistance.
On top of that, she engineers passivity and acceptance into her subjects, right from the start.
So its not easy to see at first glance, and requires some homework, like studying more obvious people who do similar things.
But there are going to be more Byron Katie 5.0 coming along, that is for sure. Its a brilliant insight. Because there is no licenses, then there is no responsibility.
The audience has no idea of the persuasion methods, so there is little resistance.
And its all done under a veil of plausible deniability. If a journalist, if there are any left, ever does some research, then its easy to deny everything and anything, as its all designed with a double-meaning, and is also done in the manner of a Spiritual Savant.
Regular folks are not aware that people who do this type of persuasion hypnotherapy, spend months and years writing, and refining their inductions, which are their STORIES. All of Byron Katie's stories are a type of induction. And notice, she tells people to drop their stories, so she plays that opposite again.
Thankfully, even if people can't see the specifics and the techniques in her Magick, people generally know when their chain is being jerked.
Why are Byron Katie "fans" so fanatical? Why are their websites full of every word she says?
Why are they "in love" with her, and copying her language patterns?
Its all designed.
A guy like Werner Erhard was more like a 3.0, he still tried to present himself as being "smart" and knowing what he is talking about.
But the new method, is like Byron Katie, and some other current Mysterians, is far more powerful and subtle.
Version 1.0 people were the ones with shaved heads banging drums in the airport.
Version 5.0 wear pantsuits, and play Savant, and pretend they have no idea of what they are doing, when in fact they run their companies like any other CEO behind the scenes.
Those who have worked closely with the Anti-Guru at many events, would start to see this eventually. But it really is a brilliant performance.
There will be many more new age Version 5.0 Savant Guru's to come, that is for sure.
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
geokozmos
()
Date: March 10, 2009 02:58AM
I think Byron Katie is simply a good psychologiy teacher. Look at the website of Albert ellis. he is pragamtic psycholgoist. One of his students, Paul Hauck is ratehr popular you can find his books too. Katie is popularizing "orgamatist psychology" where the main idea is that uit is up to you to form opinions that are less stressful (na stressfuls ituation. It helped me a lot. I used to rant (inside) that my wife is to strict and criticizing me too much...sometimes too loudly...After reading these books (the main ideas can be found on the net free) I re-framed my wife's "attacks": I need to have someone who point out certain undisciplined behaviors /that stem from my cahotic youth/ and it is great that she is adamant in puruing her side of the truth ..sometimes forcefully with temperament. Since then I have less stress around her and she became less harsh too...I think italso that it shd be left to people - we shd be left alone on what and to whom we we want to pour our money to. Any simple pop group make sbigger moiney than a psychoguru. Sure she had to pay her rents. But it is okay to envy her and be angry at her...:-)
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
rrmoderator
()
Date: March 10, 2009 05:19AM
geokozmos:
Please explain on what basis Byron Katie is a "psychology teacher"/
Please specifically cite the education credentials, which qualify her to teach psychology?
How is she accredited?
And how is Ms. Katie comparable to a "psychologist"?
Is she board certified?
Does she have professional credentials that qualify her as a psychologist?
Would an insurance company recognize Ms. Katie professionally for the purpose of payment?
Please explain on what basis Byron Katie is a "psychology teacher"/
Please specifically cite the education credentials, which qualify her to teach psychology?
How is she accredited?
And how is Ms. Katie comparable to a "psychologist"?
Is she board certified?
Does she have professional credentials that qualify her as a psychologist?
Would an insurance company recognize Ms. Katie professionally for the purpose of payment?
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
freedom fighter
()
Date: March 10, 2009 11:43AM
Any one person can be put up as a God in the eyes of the public. Generally you take it or leave it when reading a book. There's more written here about and against Byron Katie than what is in between the covers of her book. Where are the threats? Has anyone been threatened? Cohersed? I guess I'm way out of touch with the in crowd at RR. Adios.
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) - intensive brainwashing
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: March 10, 2009 12:36PM
geokozmos:
What you have said about "psychology" is factually wrong. Read the Byron Katie disclaimers she MAKES you sign before you attend a seminar of hers. She MAKES you sign a form saying she is NOT doing any type of therapy or psychological treatment. That is reality. She has nothing to do with any type of "psychology", that is a fact, not an opinion.
Byron Katie has nothing to do with Dr. Albert Ellis. Gimme a break. He was utterly opposed to everything Byron Katie does. He was for rational living.
Also, about money. What you say there too is factually false. Byron Katie can easily make 1 million dollars in just over a week seminar. She is raking in millions a month, when its all added up.
freedom fighter:
The "books" of Byron Katie are simply a lure on the end of a hook, to suck people into the Byron Katie seminar system, which can extend for 4-6 years. The casual reader has no idea of what Byron Katie is doing to people's minds, very severe psychological abuse of vulnerable people is going on in those seminars.
There is another thread about Jim Jones of The People's Temple, who was also very popular with the progressive crowd in the 1970's, before things went really insane.
Do you realize that Byron Katie is using some of the exact same mass persuasion techniques that Jim Jones used in his early years?
Convincing people to see her as more than human? sleep deprivation, free labor, spreading the message, etc.
At the Byron Katie seminar, she tells people to ONLY read her material during the seminar, nothing else, no conversations with family, nothing. Jim Jones used that method as well.
That is a form of intensive brainwashing.
And its not all about Byron Katie, the same lessons can be applied to these other new wage Gurus and false prophets running amok.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2009 12:41PM by The Anticult.
What you have said about "psychology" is factually wrong. Read the Byron Katie disclaimers she MAKES you sign before you attend a seminar of hers. She MAKES you sign a form saying she is NOT doing any type of therapy or psychological treatment. That is reality. She has nothing to do with any type of "psychology", that is a fact, not an opinion.
Byron Katie has nothing to do with Dr. Albert Ellis. Gimme a break. He was utterly opposed to everything Byron Katie does. He was for rational living.
Also, about money. What you say there too is factually false. Byron Katie can easily make 1 million dollars in just over a week seminar. She is raking in millions a month, when its all added up.
freedom fighter:
The "books" of Byron Katie are simply a lure on the end of a hook, to suck people into the Byron Katie seminar system, which can extend for 4-6 years. The casual reader has no idea of what Byron Katie is doing to people's minds, very severe psychological abuse of vulnerable people is going on in those seminars.
There is another thread about Jim Jones of The People's Temple, who was also very popular with the progressive crowd in the 1970's, before things went really insane.
Do you realize that Byron Katie is using some of the exact same mass persuasion techniques that Jim Jones used in his early years?
Convincing people to see her as more than human? sleep deprivation, free labor, spreading the message, etc.
At the Byron Katie seminar, she tells people to ONLY read her material during the seminar, nothing else, no conversations with family, nothing. Jim Jones used that method as well.
That is a form of intensive brainwashing.
And its not all about Byron Katie, the same lessons can be applied to these other new wage Gurus and false prophets running amok.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2009 12:41PM by The Anticult.
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
Meadow
()
Date: March 10, 2009 09:16PM
Re.: For more on Katie's 'glittering' eyes, people can read the 'Valentine's story' by her husband, Stephen Mitchell (...) (by: solea13, Date Added: 05/30/2008)
A footnote, for completists, to Stephen Mitchell’s Valentine’s Story :
What isn't mentioned in his ‘glittering eyes story’ in which Byron Katie takes Stephen’s hand to hold it, is that he was actually married to Vicki Chang, the acupuncturist, herbalist, and healer. An inadvertent omission perhaps.
A footnote, for completists, to Stephen Mitchell’s Valentine’s Story :
What isn't mentioned in his ‘glittering eyes story’ in which Byron Katie takes Stephen’s hand to hold it, is that he was actually married to Vicki Chang, the acupuncturist, herbalist, and healer. An inadvertent omission perhaps.
Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by:
freedom fighter
()
Date: March 11, 2009 02:01AM
The Anticult,
Thanks for the info. regarding Byron Katie. I haven't done my research on her. Wow - never realized the extent of her seminars and such.
FF
Thanks for the info. regarding Byron Katie. I haven't done my research on her. Wow - never realized the extent of her seminars and such.
FF
Byron Katie, Stephen Mitchell’s Valentine’s Story, adulterous?
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: March 11, 2009 10:39AM
Thx for the info.
It would be interesting to find out the exact dates of Stephen Mitchell’s Byron Katie hypno-EYES story, and to see if the romantic Valentine's Day Story was adulterous in spirit.
...but he just made-up and wrote-out the entire thing anyway, its the exact same sales-pitch that Neale Donald Walsch gave about Katie before he got busted for plagiarism. Mitchell probably wrote it for Walsch in the first place! Its advertising.
Carol Skolnick also did the exact same "love at first site" Katie Story.
That is a pre-frame, to get intimacy-starved people to gaze into professional photographs of Byron Katie's EYES and manufacture a BK Projection in their imaginations. If they can build it up enough, then she can trigger a powerful Love-Bomb experience for the person at her seminar, with a glance and a touch.
Sai Baba also gets people to stare at photo's of him. They have life-size posters of him in an orange jumpsuit and Big-Hair, that people stare at...and Sai Baba tells you he will "visit you in your dreams". It works.
[www.saibabaofindia.com]
Same technique, using visual photographic aids to build intimacy with strangers.
The image become a devotional object, even an emotionally erotic one.
Now they use YouTube too.
But staring into the eyes of a professional photo works best, as the person mind creates the projection, they project their needs and fanatasies onto the blank slate.
[trudyraymakers.files.wordpress.com]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2009 10:51AM by The Anticult.
It would be interesting to find out the exact dates of Stephen Mitchell’s Byron Katie hypno-EYES story, and to see if the romantic Valentine's Day Story was adulterous in spirit.
...but he just made-up and wrote-out the entire thing anyway, its the exact same sales-pitch that Neale Donald Walsch gave about Katie before he got busted for plagiarism. Mitchell probably wrote it for Walsch in the first place! Its advertising.
Carol Skolnick also did the exact same "love at first site" Katie Story.
That is a pre-frame, to get intimacy-starved people to gaze into professional photographs of Byron Katie's EYES and manufacture a BK Projection in their imaginations. If they can build it up enough, then she can trigger a powerful Love-Bomb experience for the person at her seminar, with a glance and a touch.
Sai Baba also gets people to stare at photo's of him. They have life-size posters of him in an orange jumpsuit and Big-Hair, that people stare at...and Sai Baba tells you he will "visit you in your dreams". It works.
[www.saibabaofindia.com]
Same technique, using visual photographic aids to build intimacy with strangers.
The image become a devotional object, even an emotionally erotic one.
Now they use YouTube too.
But staring into the eyes of a professional photo works best, as the person mind creates the projection, they project their needs and fanatasies onto the blank slate.
[trudyraymakers.files.wordpress.com]
Quote
Meadow
Re.: For more on Katie's 'glittering' eyes, people can read the 'Valentine's story' by her husband, Stephen Mitchell (...) (by: solea13, Date Added: 05/30/2008)
A footnote, for completists, to Stephen Mitchell’s Valentine’s Story :
What isn't mentioned in his ‘glittering eyes story’ in which Byron Katie takes Stephen’s hand to hold it, is that he was actually married to Vicki Chang, the acupuncturist, herbalist, and healer. An inadvertent omission perhaps.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2009 10:51AM by The Anticult.
Re: Byron Katie, Stephen Mitchell’s Valentine’s Story, hypno-EYES
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: March 12, 2009 02:04AM
anyone can search Google images for Byron Katie, and analyze the professional PR photos she has out there. You will see the exact same pattern's in these photos.
- soul-piercing intimate eye-stare into the camera, head-cocked to the side, and hand to the face.
Earlier, it was pointed out that in her YouTube video's you can see how Byron Katie uses the "head-cock" to the side, as a type of visual anchor. What that means is she is talking away, and right when she wants to give a powerful Suggestion, she will pause, cock her head to the side, give the Suggestion, and then move on. Check it out.
That is a very very common technique everyone learns.
That stuff is very effective, it can be done with a head-cock like that, or with Voice-Tonality, or a hand-movement, or a touch, etc. That is how Milton Erickson communicated with the unconscious, by using a specific voice-tone, or head-direction each time.
Same with a hand-movement, or specific touch, movement, or even a word. Its like a "hook" to hang the suggestions on. Some do it by tapping a pen, etc.
So those photos combine those 3 things, soul-piercing eyes, head-cock, and hand to the face.
Brilliantly, those are similar techniques used in other photographs, so it doesn't stand out much.
But just watch her in the videos, you will see that head-cock, before a Suggestion.
These photos have been Photoshopped by her media people. Notice also the background in the professional photos is always out of focus, to draw the visual line to her face with the EYES in the center of the frame.
very effective.
And even then her husband has to tell people to go and state into her eyes...its like a hypnotist from a bad movie...."look into my eyes...come into my parlor...said the spider to the fly".
Its even done with a sense of irony to it.
BK photos...
(these were shot in a photography studio, with careful eye-lighting...they get the "eye sparkle" by using those white cards to bounce light into the eyes...the "sparkle" is just reflected soft-light reflecting off the eyes. It ain't magic. If you stare into someone's eyes, you can even see yourself reflected!)
[jrushton.files.wordpress.com]
[opentohope.com]
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2009 02:14AM by The Anticult.
- soul-piercing intimate eye-stare into the camera, head-cocked to the side, and hand to the face.
Earlier, it was pointed out that in her YouTube video's you can see how Byron Katie uses the "head-cock" to the side, as a type of visual anchor. What that means is she is talking away, and right when she wants to give a powerful Suggestion, she will pause, cock her head to the side, give the Suggestion, and then move on. Check it out.
That is a very very common technique everyone learns.
That stuff is very effective, it can be done with a head-cock like that, or with Voice-Tonality, or a hand-movement, or a touch, etc. That is how Milton Erickson communicated with the unconscious, by using a specific voice-tone, or head-direction each time.
Same with a hand-movement, or specific touch, movement, or even a word. Its like a "hook" to hang the suggestions on. Some do it by tapping a pen, etc.
So those photos combine those 3 things, soul-piercing eyes, head-cock, and hand to the face.
Brilliantly, those are similar techniques used in other photographs, so it doesn't stand out much.
But just watch her in the videos, you will see that head-cock, before a Suggestion.
These photos have been Photoshopped by her media people. Notice also the background in the professional photos is always out of focus, to draw the visual line to her face with the EYES in the center of the frame.
very effective.
And even then her husband has to tell people to go and state into her eyes...its like a hypnotist from a bad movie...."look into my eyes...come into my parlor...said the spider to the fly".
Its even done with a sense of irony to it.
BK photos...
(these were shot in a photography studio, with careful eye-lighting...they get the "eye sparkle" by using those white cards to bounce light into the eyes...the "sparkle" is just reflected soft-light reflecting off the eyes. It ain't magic. If you stare into someone's eyes, you can even see yourself reflected!)
[jrushton.files.wordpress.com]
[opentohope.com]
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2009 02:14AM by The Anticult.
Re: Byron Katie video
Posted by:
helpme2times
()
Date: March 12, 2009 04:43AM
It's been a long time since I've watched BK on video. I decided just now that enough time has gone by that I can handle watching her again. (Not that I will make a habit of it.) I found the following video really interesting to watch because BK is being interviewed and she juts her neck out quite a bit, is practically in the interviewer's face.
[[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBFk2TuLFXA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBFk2TuLFXA[/url]]
[[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBFk2TuLFXA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBFk2TuLFXA[/url]]
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