and for the general public, who are not aware of what has gone on behind the scenes, the only way to clarify the positions is in public.

So if Steven Hassan responded to the critical review of his book by a professional, point by point, then at least the public would have some information to review.
For example:

- are “Cults are on the rise” statistically?
- was there any peer-review for the book?
- what % of the interventions succeed, and which % fail to work?
- which ideas in the book are not properly cited?
- why was NLP not cited, if in fact its being used?
- what about phobias and hypnosis?
- have there been any studies of Strategic interaction Approach (SIA)?


Those are all valid intellectual research questions, and hopefully they will be clarified, in public, in writing, so the general public who does not know "inside baseball" stuff, can make an educated determination.

Quote
rrmoderator
MonicaPignotti:

Some years ago after receiving serious complaints from families and individuals about Steve Hassan's behavior and fees I approached him first for a response before taking any further action.

He never responded.

Subsequently a disclaimer was then posted at the Ross Institute Web site regarding Steve Hassan, which explained that his fees were reportedly $5,000.00 per day and/or $500.00 per hour. Also, that complaints had been received and that the Ross Institute did not recommend him. Links to Hassan's Web site and his book(s) were then deleted. This was done due to the fact that news articles had been archived within the Ross Institute database that quoted Mr. Hassan and/or cited his work and Web site. The disclaimer link appeared only in those articles, so that readers would not suppose that because the Ross Institute had archived the article Hassan was somehow endorsed or supported by the Ross Institute.

Subsequently I received a letter from Steve Hassan's attorney asking that the disclaimer be taken down.

Nothing was done.

I was then contacted by Steve Hassan's wife, who implored me to take down the disclaimer.

I refused, but told her if he would make a statement clarifying his fees that might help. It was then suggested that this could be done via fax.

No such statement was ever received.

Hassan then posted a fee schedule within a public statement made about the disclaimer at his Web site. Hassan did not deny that he had charged $5,000.00 per day and/or $500.00 per hour, but said his current fee schedule was $2,500.00 per day and $250.00 per hour. Mr. Hassan tacitly acknowledged that people had mortgaged their homes to pay him, but rather flippantly added that no one he knew of had lost their house over such a debt. After he posted that statement the disclaimer at the Ross Institute Web site was taken down, but the links to Hassan's Web site and book(s) were never restored. Some time later Steve Hassan removed that public statement from his Web site and there is no detailed fee schedule now publicly available regarding his professional fees.

Interesting. I knew about some of this, but hadn't realized that he had gotten his attorney involved. Interesting that attempts appear to have been made to silence you from expressing your opinion that you cannot recommend him and why.

Hassan admitted to me around 1999 that he did at one time charge $5000 a day, $500 per hour during part of the 1990s but then lowered it to $2500 and $250. Fairly recently, although Hassan does not post his fee schedule on his website, someone who seemed fairly friendly towards him and had been considering hiring him, posted what they claimed to be a copy of his fee schedule on an ex-JW messageboard. According to this, his fee schedule was what you stated, $2500 a day and $250 an hour, but there may be some extra fees tacked on for weekends and holidays (up to $3000 per day) and for travel, which must be business class (quite an expense, these days) and he bills an hourly rate for travel, according to what was posted.

[www.jehovahs-witness.net]

The honest, transparent, professional thing for Steve Hassan to do would be to post his complete fee schedule on his website, but he does not appear to be willing to do so.

Quote
The Anticult
and for the general public, who are not aware of what has gone on behind the scenes, the only way to clarify the positions is in public.

So if Steven Hassan responded to the critical review of his book by a professional, point by point, then at least the public would have some information to review.
For example:

- are “Cults are on the rise” statistically?
- was there any peer-review for the book?
- what % of the interventions succeed, and which % fail to work?
- which ideas in the book are not properly cited?
- why was NLP not cited, if in fact its being used?
- what about phobias and hypnosis?
- have there been any studies of Strategic interaction Approach (SIA)?


Those are all valid intellectual research questions, and hopefully they will be clarified, in public, in writing, so the general public who does not know "inside baseball" stuff, can make an educated determination.

These are good questions. In terms of percent success for interventions (the person leaving the cult) I would also want to know, out of all the families who hire him for services, what percentage actually get to the point of doing an intervention and what percentage drop out before that point? Those families are usually not counted in reported success rates, but this is important, just as drop out rates are important and expected to be reported in any intervention study. It is also an important consideration because some people may be spending thousands of dollars in prep work fees, but never get to the point of doing an intervention and their situation remains the same. I have heard Hassan claim he has a 90% success rate (the person leaves the cult) but that is 90% of the families that actually get to the point of doing the intervention. The ones who dropped out before that point are not counted in the 10% failure rate and the percentage of those people might be quite high, based on what I personally witnessed.

As for peer review, we know it was not peer reviewed in the sense that professionals and credible scholars define the term because the book was self published. Peer review means more than just getting feedback from peers of one's choice. Peer review means a review by people of the Editor/publisher's choosing, usually done blind to authorship and publication in a reputable peer reviewed journal or published by an academic publisher. Although it is quite likely he did present the book to peers of his choosing for feedback (and the endorsements some gave it) Steve's book, being self published cannot be said to be peer reviewed. I emphasize this because I have noticed recently that some people are trying to claim "peer review" by altering the meaning of the term.

MonicaPignotti:

You make an important point.

Steve Hassan seems to make a significant amount of money doing preparation work and then no intervention takes place.

It's an interesting business model, but in my opinion unethical.

I received a complaint from someone prominent in the field of cultic studies that a family had been charged tens of thousands of dollars by Steve Hassan only to be "prepped" by him, without ever setting a date for an intervention. He never even met with their cult-involved child.

IMO -- Preparation for an intervention should take place immediately before the intervention. That is, the intervention specialist meets with those concerned (family, spouse, friends) that are taking part in the intervention one or two days before the intervention is scheduled to begin. At that time all the particulars and concerns are discussed and questions asked. Then the day after preparation concludes the intervention itself begins. This is practical and effective for two primary reasons. (1) the preparation is fresh in everyone's memory when the intervention begins. (2) It is cost effective regarding, travel and time charged. I don't see how billing for preparation without a fixed intervention time scheduled immediately following is effective, other than as a means to inflate a bill.

Much of what Steve Hassan calls "preparation" appears to include basic education concerning destructive cults, their dynamics, structure and persuassion techniques. This can be done without expensive billings to hold the cost down by suggesting books, articles and helpful video documentary materials. Again, charging hefty hourly fees for such consultation may be a meaningful business model, but it is not cost effective. Moreover, it also doesn't necessarily afford those concerned a better education in any meaningful sense. Basic cult education can be done relatively effectively through the materials previously mentioned and then questions regarding specifics can be convered in a preparation process immediately before the intervention. One day (6-8 hours of meeting time) is usually sufficient.

You also make an important point regarding success rates.

A success rate should be based upon all clients that pay a retainer and very specifically otherwise explained. For examply, Hassan might admit that only a portion of people that pay him to help resolve a cult situation ever realize an intervention. And then determine that percentage first. Then go on to explain what percentage of the people he actually engages with through his intervention process ultimately as a direct result determine to leave the group before or at the immediate conclusion of the intervention.

I once asked him about this very specifically, i.e. what exact percentage of the cult-involved people he sat down with for an interventionthis decided before or at the end of that intervention time that they would leave the group in question, which was the focus of the intervention effort. Hassan responded, "I don't see that as a measurement of success". He then went on to say, "Whenever there is a dialog and exchange of information I consider it a success".

It seems to me that Steve Hassan has come up with a very effective methodology to make money, i.e. his "Strategic Intervention Approach" (SIA). But Hassan's methodology doesn't seem to be predicated upon any significant success as measured by objective results. And most probably not the objective results hoped for by those that pay him for an intervention, e.g. getting someone out of a bad cult situation.

Here's a link to an article in Boston Magazine regarding a failed intervention Hassan did a few years ago. Please note that it admits to a sum Hassan charged that was very high (I heard later from Dahn member close to the case that it was around $30,000, plus an all expenses paid trip to Hawaii). Of note also is Hassan's attempts to meet with the object of the failed intervention in a coffee house after the intervention. In my opinion, Hassan was manipulating this individual to try and make the intervention "succesful." Additionally of note, not only did Hassan not get the person out of the cult, but the cult member's father (who paid for the intervention and expenses) ended up joining the cult himself. See:

[www.bostonmagazine.com]

I have, as well, received numerous complaints about Hassan over the past 15 years. Most of these complaints involve the high fees Hassan charges, but many have been about Hassan's manner in general. Many have said that he is extremely rude, won't talk without a credit card on file, and requires testimonals and/or write ups for cases he has completed (for him to put on his website ostensibly). I have come across many of Hassan's forms due to discovery in legal cases I have worked on after Hassan has either been in the case as an interventionist or a counselor doing phone counseling. In a couple of cases, Hassan has conducted telephone counseling with someone in the Denver area, rather than referring this person to me when I am right here and charge much lower fees. In a recent legal case I was involved in, the person had been in telephonic counseling wih Hassan and s/he told me that Hassan is now wanting a BITE analysis on cases he works on, which is done by researchers in his office. This is outrageous and not client centered at all. As said previously, Hassan thinks he can do or say anything he wants and he is insulated from criticism. That's what he thinks. He is woefully out of practice with anyone providing dissent for his methods, his claims, and his manner in how he treats people, includiing clients and other professionals.

Additionally for the record, I know Bob and Judy Pardon and their recovery center called MeadowHaven. It is true that they get work and referrals from Hassan.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/21/2012 11:54PM by Cathleen Mann, PhD.

The first time I ever met Steve Hassan, I told him that for somebody like me, meeting him was like meeting Neil Armstrong. I admit that I was a bit awestruck; here I was, shaking hands and chatting with a real pioneer. Bob and Jusy introduced us. He chuckled and told me not to put him on some kind of pedestal, lest he become swollen-headed (as he smiled and gestured with his hands as if his head were expanding). He gave me his business card and told me to give him a call once I got back to Boston. I did so.

Something that I shall never forget was the day in the summer of 2010 (about a year after I graduated from Meadow Haven) when I went out to Steve's office in Boston and had a visit with him there. This was a couple of weeks after the conclusion of the ICSA conference. I had brought a thermos of tea with me and poured him a cup as we sat in his library. The first thing he said to me that day, as he looked me in the eye was "So, how can I help you with your career? Bob has spoken very highly of you." He was speaking of Bob Pardon.

This floored me, as I had in the previous couple of years only begun to get used to the idea of living to be fifty, much less having a career. I didn't know how to answer at first, as I was a little speechless. I did not come to this man asking for a job, but while meeting with the man, he offered me one instead.

Yes, the first time I sat with Steve he asked me straight out, "How can I help you with your career?" He offered me a job that day and I have worked as a research assistant with Steve and Freedom of Mind ever since. We've had lunch, and I've been over to his house. Steve is my boss and my friend. He knows about what zeuszor has done online and I've told him of it at length.

For the record: I know Steve Hassan to be a highly compassionate, sensitive and ethical man, and a man of great integrity. Steve Hassan has helped me in an enormous fashion, both personally and professionally. If I believed that what some here are writing about him is true, then I’d have nothing to do with him. Yet you (Pignotti, Mann, and Ross) are making him out as if he is some narcissist or psychopath himself.

So I do not put the man on a pedestal, and we are all but human. For my part, I am very sensitive about NOT being part of some kind of "anti-cult cult", and stay conscious to NOT think of Steve as my guru or anything of that nature. That's asinine. Nobody is exploiting me, much less Steve. I DO NOT take everything he says or writes as “gospel”. I have been there before when I was briefly a part of the Trinity Foundation, and have no intention of going down that road again.

Look: I respect Steve, I trust Steve, and I like Steve. He is my employer and in that respect he is my "boss", but he is NOT my "leader" (in a culty sense). I constantly (or try to, anyway) maintain an awareness that nobody is perfect , and that everybody has “feet of clay.” I do not know much about what happened between Steve and certain former colleagues in the past and frankly I do not want to.

And I have not yet read his new book, so (as I wrote to begin with) I cannot comment on it. I have not even read Combatting or Releasing in some time, for that matter. But I’ll study it out in the next couple of weeks and may throw my two cents’ worth of impressions into the hat then.

Nobody put me up to writing this, and I am not being paid to write this. I am writing in defense of a man who has genuinely helped me in more ways than one, a person who I know as my boss and my friend. Thank you.

If that is an actual fee schedule...even without all of the additions.

$2500 a day x 5 = $12,500 week.
x 4 = $50,000 month.
x 12 = $600,000 year.
Now of course who knows how many days a month the person might work.

Most "cults" these days PRIMARY purpose is financial exploitation, that is, robbing the victim and their family blind...
Should exit counsellors be millionaires too?

I guess people have to think about that.

But organized cults TARGET people with MONEY and FAMILY money, and then exploit them financially.
(they are usually a separate categoy from those who are targeted for cultic unpaid labor, or sexual exploitation).
So the organized cults work very hard to find vulnerable people with money and family money, and then extract all that money from them. That is how they make their millions and hundreds of millions.

Should cult exit counsellors be taking a juicy piece of steak from the family-money gravy-train before its tapped out? Something to think about.

Quote
MonicaPignotti
... posted what they claimed to be a copy of his fee schedule on an ex-JW messageboard. According to this, his fee schedule was what you stated, $2500 a day and $250 an hour, but there may be some extra fees tacked on for weekends and holidays (up to $3000 per day) and for travel, which must be business class (quite an expense, these days) and he bills an hourly rate for travel, according to what was posted.

[www.jehovahs-witness.net]

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/22/2012 12:55AM by The Anticult.

Cathleen Mann, PhD:

The article you link is dated 2007, so this would be well after Steve Hassan self-published his book "Releasing the Bonds", which touted "SIA", his strategic intervention approach.

The article reads, "Over the next few days, Ari watched videos about a number of cults, heard Hassan explain his cult-identification model, and took calls from former Dahn members who detailed their problems with the organization and its leader."

This actually reflects a fairly old fashioned cult deprogramming approach used for many years, as reflected by Hassan's apparent reliance upon videos.

It's understandable that Mr. Hassan has failures, every cult interventionist does, but what strikes me as especially interesting is his failure to convince the father that hired him after days of preparation that the group Dahun is a "cult".

The father told the press, "I can say that not only is Dahn not a cult, but it’s a great organization.” And summarizing Hassan's efforts he says, “I believe he thought he was helping our son, but he was dead wrong about Dahn."

I have been retained to do hundreds of interventions over the years. Many have been successful and some have failed. But I don't recall anyone that retained me coming to the conclusion at the end of that process that the group which drew their concern was "not a cult".

This article doesn't offer much of a testimonial to either Steve Hassan's SIA process or his ability as an effective communicator. It appears that not only was this intervention a failure, but the preparational educational process failed as well.

Another interesting tidbit is the mention that Steve Hassan reportedly claimed that "he has even received a nod in the film Holy Smoke, in which Harvey Keitel plays a rough-and-tumble American deprogrammer flown to Australia to pry a young woman (portrayed by Kate Winslet) from the grips of a guru. Hassan thinks that Keitel’s cowboy boots, featured prominently in one close-up, are an oblique reference to his own footwear of choice, worn to support a weak ankle."

This is an example of Steve Hassan attempting to embellish his importance by fabrication.

I was hired by Miramax/Disney as Harvey Keitel's technical consultant for the film "Holy Smoke". No one ever even alluded to any reference regarding Mr. Hassan. Mr. Keitel did watch various films I suggested to better understand deprogramming and its historical context. He apparently watched the film "Ticket to Heaven" (1981), which features a deprogrammer wearing cowboy boots. I suspect Steve Hassan's penchant for coyboy boots may have been his way of attempting to emulate that same movie character rather than "a weak ankle". The film "Ticket to Heaven" is quite well known by former cultists and cult deprogrammers.

See [www.youtube.com]

You can watch the movie online and see the deprogrammer with cowboy boots on YouTube.

Steve Hassan concocts some pretty silly stories, but they do fit a repeated pattern of self-promotion and rather narcissistic self-importance.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/22/2012 04:29AM by rrmoderator.

On page 242 of Hassan's book, he states the following:

"In the face of revelations that the FBI did use firebombs on the Branch Davidian compound [referring to the Waco event where the FBN had a standoff with Koresh and his followers], even President of the United States Bill Clinton commented that he did not see why people were getting so upset "because a buch of religious fanatics commited suicide." [quotes in original test].

I am afraid that very little has been learned since the tratgedy at Waco. ...My efforts during the siege fell on deaf ears. Congressman Joe Kennedy's office sent letters to F.B.I. Director Sessions and Special Agent Jamar in charge of the coperation, aking that they speak to me. Massachuetts Attorney General's Scott Harshbarer's office faxed a letter, written by me, to Attorney General Reno warning of the dangers of the situation, and offering concrete alternatives weeks before the final deadly assault. A copy of my book Combatting Cult Mind Control was reportdly given to Webster Hubbell by Eleanor Acheson more than a week before the final assault. On television shows and in a lecture at Harvard in 1994, I detailed what could have been done to resolve the standoff. Six yers later, I have yet to receive even a telephone call from anyone in the government asking me for my perspective..." (Hassan, 2012).

In 2006, I attended an APA regional conference in La Jolla, California. The keynote address was by former Attorney General Janet Reno. In the question and answer period followng her speech, I asked a few peppered questions about her handling of the Waco tragedy. After the speech, I talked with General Reno some more privately. I asked her point blanck if she had ever heard of Steve Hassan or knew about any of his books or attempts to interject himself in the Waco tragedy. She told me that she had never heard of him and that she had another cult consultant that they had relied on. She also mentioned that Joe Kennedy's office had never contacted her about anything related to the Waco events.