Dear Zeuszor,

David is obviously trying to "rehabilitate" his image....he is feeling challenged by the lack of "disciples" and the "numbers" that he is now unable to draw....

.....hence has come to the conclusion that his public image needs a make over....however patently dishonest!

(I wonder exactly what we might find were we to scratch a little below the suface of that face and it's forked tongue.....)

[www.youtube.com]


He threatens legitmate observations made about him with "defamation" proceedings (Scientology Lawyers again?)

(e.g. Jon Ronson!)

He poisons the minds of those who become his "mules" against their families....

(e.g. Joe Johnson!)

He extorts those from whom he needs co-operation, with "access" to their families....

(e.g. Fred Ngogre)

He attempts to foment divorce among the married couples that have questioned him

(e.g. His son Kevin and his wife)

He "dumps" those who have spent years of their lives selling him, without a thought if they at all "cross" him.

(e.g Hose or Vick and her children)

He teaches those who fall prey to him to (secretly) DISOBEY the commandments of Christ and "worship" him.

(e.g. The (now hidden from the general public) publications of "Honest to whom" & "Killers for Christ")

"Worship" here, defined as David himself has defined it, meaning who and what you give your time to.....


.....but you know Zeuszor, I think that he is now so narcisstic that he actually half believes his onw bullshit...

....that there are NO independant principles of Justice or Integrity....there is only "loyalty" to David....


What a demented old twit!



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/30/2010 11:47PM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

There is no Dana, only Zuul!

Mal, what you wrote above is only partially accurate.

Rinehartt's lawyer in the lawsuit against the Johnsons is a Scientologist, but he is not a "Scientology lawyer." There's a difference. His name, if I am not mistaken, is Brown.

During the rectification of the Vuldrini, the traveler came as a large and moving Torg! Then, during the third reconciliation of the last of the McKetrick supplicants, they chose a new form for him: that of a giant Slor! Many Shuvs and Zuuls knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Slor that day, I can tell you!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/01/2010 12:59AM by zeuszor.

Recently I was told of something very very interesting and shall now tell of it here.

The other day, while I was in Lakeville, I met a man who was a member of the Jim Roberts group/Brethren for twenty-two years. This man has has been out for six years; this is to say that he joined the cult in 1982 and left in 2004. We get along quite well and hung out and spoke over tea, for about four hours.

He was in Berkeley, CA in approximately 1990 (around the time of the McKays' Fall of America campaign), and my new friend was traveling at the time with a man named Brother Jonathan, whose real name Jonathan SCHMIDT. Schmidt is to this day a member of the Roberts cult.

My new friend tells me that he and Brother Jonathon met an Australian man in Berkeley who was named Atilla and who was with a woman whose name he could not remember, but he thought that it was Sherri (sp?). Atilla and the woman were with a group called the Christians. He said, "Oh yeah, the Christians, those are the guys that got in trouble for burning money and went around saying, "Greed Breeds Mean Deeds."

When my new freind said these things, he really got my attention.

Long story short, (and I'll elaborate later, right now I have little time) my new friend told me of a series of meetings between Jim Roberts and Dave McKay that took place in approximately 1990 in Portland, Oregon, in a house that was on Ivy Street.

But McKay tried to decieve Roberts, who got wind of McKay's duplicity and abruptly ended the association between the Roberts cult and the McKay cult. Turns out that even Jim Roberts didn't like Dave McKay.

That's right, I now have a friend who tells me that he was present when Dave McKay and Jim Roberts met in person, about twenty years ago.

I showed the man pictures of McKay and he began to exitedly say, referring to McKay, "That's him, that's the guy! I wondered what ever happened to those people."

Then I showed him some video of McKay being whipped, to show him what became of McKay, and he was aghast.

I, through my persistence and research, have now established a definitive link between the Roberts group and the cult that eventually came to be known as the Jesus Christians.

This explains how the JCs, in their present form, are more or less a diluted Australian clone of the Roberts group, but with heavy COG/Family influences and a few Heaven's Gate-ish sci-fi overtones. McKay studied them and even met with Jim Roberts.

My friend even told me of McKay's Anita Fosterish misrepresentation of himself in meeting with Roberts, but I'll tell of that another time.

Why did none of the XJC clique ever come forward and make this knowledge available to us before now? Why don't they want us to know these things?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2010 02:58AM by zeuszor.

Quote
zeuszor



I, through my persistence and research, have now established a definitive link between the Roberts group and the cult that eventually came to be known as the Jesus Christians.

This explains how the JCs, in their present form, are more or less a diluted Australian clone of the Roberts group, but with heavy COG/Family influences and a few Heaven's Gate-ish sci-fi overtones. McKay studied them and even met with Jim Roberts.

My friend even told me of McKay's Anita Fosterish misrepresentation of himself in meeting with Roberts, but I'll tell of that another time.

Why did none of the XJC clique ever come forward and make this knowledge available to us before now? Why don't they want us to know these things?

The JC's themselves refer to some of their associations (Saints etc) in their old newsletters.

Way back on the older pages on this thread (page 40 for example) many will remember that we were discussing McKay's history of infiltration and his chameleon like qualities. This related to his sometimes successful attempts to forge links to an extensive number of other groups, either to recruit members or to don a mantle of respectability through association. A number of xjcs were involved in this discussion and were very willing to share their knowledge here but were interrupted by aggressive posts.

During that period, a number of people here became concerned enough by antagonistic rhetoric on the board to caution strongly and diplomatically against it. When the antagonism persisted, despite the cautions from posters and the moderator, many withdrew to other venues.

The use of the term 'XJC clique', as a pejorative label, is not only adding insult to injury but is totally wrong. This and the related claim that they '... don't they want us to know these things?' is way off the mark and deserves an apology.

For the record, there is no ' XJC clique', nor, for that matter an 'RR clique', despite Zeuszor's and Dave's claims to the contrary.

"Free discussion" nothing. They ought to call it the "Tea Party" forum.

I have always tried to maintain some kind of communications with the XJC clique. I felt if we all engaged in some truly "free discussion" ("free discussion" my foot) and off the record, then we would know where we were all at, and could try to ensure that nobody was stepping on anybody else's toes.

As we all know, that approach was rejected and the rest is history.

Because it's really not over there. I was always getting emails and PMs asking me to edit or remove certain posts that I'd made. Sometimes the moderator would edit or remove my posts himself, same as what David might do at welikejesus. So the "discussion" is not really "free," it's very deliberately orchestrated and controlled. That's all that I resented when I was involved there, somebody always telling me what to say and how to say it. Then I questioned, "Wait a minute, isn't that what cults do?" So I got banned from XJCs a couple of months ago, and I do not know what ever happened to that idiot Glenn. I got pissed of at the mod over there, got impudent and argumentative myself, and then before I know it I'm banned too.

It's not really a free discussion. They let Glenn do it for so long because it made the JCs look stupid, but really I was always being told what I was and was not allowed to say, always being asked to edit my words, sometimes having it done for me. welikejesus is exactly the same way. That's all I'm trying to express.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2010 09:49PM by zeuszor.

Look, I regret having alienated myself from the XJC admin. We used to be pretty close, actually, but had a falling out over how I thought that he was running things, and over how I approached him about it. He cut me off a few months ago and I miss him in my life. So I admit to being impudent toward him and should not have took advantage of the mistake that he made in order to ban Glenn, as I'd been pressing him to do all along. That was wrong of me, and I am sorry for it.

But still I stand by my right to express myself however I wish, and strongly resist anybody telling me what I am and am not allowed write. I suppose when faced with someone who is doing so, I tend to reactively write something that is even more over the top that what I'd said or written in the first place, in order to show that I will not be controlled. None of the XJCs wanted me there in the first place.

Still, I stand by my opinion that it's not really a "free discussion" over there, and that it's really much more orchestrated than it's made out to be.

Their forum is a tea party. This one is more like a bar.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2010 10:47PM by zeuszor.

We are heading in an off-topic direction again.

Part of what I object to is you confronting me on a thread that is supposed to be about the Jesus Christians. By doing so, you have aligned actually yourself with the cultists. If you think that I am out of balance or behaving in an unhealthy way, then you should have found another venue to tell me so.

Dear Zeuszor,

I'd like to hear more of the Jim Roberts/Bretherern sect....it's not a group that I think I'm familiar with....

I supose you'd say that Neville was really Davids' first ever "permanent" recruit with Ross and I being the second and third respecitvely in late 1980....I'm not sure if David was in contact with the "Jim Roberts/Bretherern" at that stage...

His early material was clearly recyled Berg......(of course David may well have been influenced (i.e stole what he could for the purposes of his own cult) by Roberts later...just as he's pilfered ideas to recyle as his own over the course of his life....)

I apologize Zeuszor....do you mind either posting a link or further details here.



I presume that it has also been my "aggressive" posts have so deterred Muppet.....the association of my company naturally irreparably "tainting" the (public image of) Godly purity of those noble souls, whose saintly non-violence behoves all and sundry to emulate them.....

Altough I cannot see precisely why my own presumably "antaganostic rhetoric" should so besmirches the contribution of others, who clearly post independantly....

More importantly, to date, I've not seen that the NON-agressive posts and NON atagonistic rhetoric "elsewhere" has achieved a whit more than I.....or Zeusor....or other "undesirables"


That is....I have seen NO modicification in the behaviour of David McKay,

Nor have I seen any individuals of the JC's REVOKE
pyschologically so damaged that they are trapped long term,
REVOKE their membership of the JC's
in response to the "loving" and "non threatening postings" elsewhere...

(I have (very) briefly seen a few instances of recently departed members, temporarily post on such sites...)

As this site FRANKLY warns the a wider audience of the general public, about the prostitution of the Chirstian scriptures that McKay uses to manipulate the idealism of others into daily servitude for himself....(and that's not a very "nice" observation to make about someone, is it?), I personally much prefer it,

and until, the "warm fuzzies" have a verifiably higher success rate that the "cold pricklies"...

Unless any inaccuracies in my "agressive posts" can be identified...(my style of posting, being an irrelevancy)

I'd also much prefer my "aggressive posts" not to be sullied by the pretentious piety of others...


Those wish to eventually spend further time in the company of David McKay (i.e. by going to hell with their self righteousness)....can of course continue to tell themselves, that the conversation on this forum is "beneath" them!

JESUS CHRISTIANS NEWSLETTER, #123, MAY, 2010

We Jesus Christians have gone from distributing more than 10,000 books and DVDs a week less than a year ago, to doing very little distributing this month, as our interests have turned to other projects... some of them quite exciting.

RETREAT HIDEAWAY

In Australia, Dave, Cherry, Paul, Ulrike, Ross, and Barry have been busily scouting out and preparing a secret retreat, where members of the community can get together for fun, fellowship, and a lot of work during the upcoming international reunion. One of the main projects being planned is a huge video production program, during which we hope to put together footage for two feature films as well as a short documentary on life in Kenya.

In preparation for that same project, cameras have been busily filming interviews and other material in Kenya, the United Kingdom, and the U.S.A.

CAVE DWELLING

One U.S. team ventured into the wilderness of Utah to spend a few days with "No Currency Man", our good friend Suelo, who lives in a cave there, and who has recently been experiencing a flood of interest from the media as well as visits from others of like mind. People with similar interest have joined him in starting a volunteer farm close to the cave. Suelo has been living without money for ten years now.

Jesse and Jayme spent a night in the now famous cave, and did a number of interviews for the "Mark of the Beast" video, both with Suelo himself and with some of the volunteers there.

Suelo's blogspot: [zerocurrency.blogspot.com]

NEW MONEYLESS BOOK

Mark Boyle, who is a friend of Suelo's and who made a significant contribution to our "Mark of the Beast" video, has a new book coming out in a few weeks time. Mark's book, "The Moneyless Man" explores his first year living without money and the aims of the Freeconomy Movement that is quickly gaining momentum around the world. To find out more, check out Mark's recent blog at: [www.justfortheloveofit.org].

FREE WORKERS

On the way back to Los Angeles, the guys interviewed a couple who had lost their home in the current economic downturn. Instead of letting the crisis destroy their spirit, they decided to take the loss as liberation from attachment to material possessions. They have downsized to a motorhome and are travelling around offering their services for free. They hope to insipre other people to learn to use their time to help others. Their website is: [www.zenarmy.org]

VISITING FAMILIES AND FRIENDS

There have been a lot of visits both to and from families and friends over the month. Karl went with Bob and Alf to visit his family in Kenya. Karl's father expressed appreciation for the growth Karl has made since becoming a volunteer, and he wished us all continued success.

There were several trips to Nairobi during the month, where we were able to meet up with some former volunteers from Finland, as well as spending time with Casey, who is continuing to make progress with his adopt-a-patient program at the hospital there. The program aims to link up visitors with patients who rarely if ever get visits.

Karl, Alf, and Bob visited Antony, a fellow volunteer who is spearheading a lot of volunteer programs in his local area. We also had a visit from Collins, who is in the process of developing a volunteer program close to the forest, where he lives.

Over in the United Kingdom, we had a couple from Dorchester stay with us for a few days, and two sisters from Germany spend two and a half weeks with us in Newquay. A friendly Welshman traveled all the way from Swansea to Bath to meet up with us. Roland and Sue had dinner with Kirstie and her husband, and we were invited to dinner with contacts in Lands End and London. We also spent a sunny afternoon with Dave, a former volunteer from Takatifu Gardens (and a 'Werewolf' expert) who has been playing the song "Money Made Man Mad" all over France. The song has become especially popular at the ski resort where Dave works in the Alps.

GREAT PROVISIONS

As the weather started to warm up in England, God provided the team there with a bin full of semi-frozen ice-cream. After a nice holiday break at Newquay, which is famous for its beaches and surfing, they came across enough discarded veggie oil to fuel their three vehicles on the journey back to London.

RUN, RUN, RUN!

Alf, Bob, Joe, Karl, and Obed have taken to Friday afternoon runs to the forest and back in Kenya. Apart from the fitness benefits, it has also offered an opportunity to view the beautiful countryside along the way.

In England, morning runs along Fistral Beach became part of the daily routine while everyone was staying in Newquay.

Our aged and crippled members in Australia have been venturing into a little more exercise lately, with Barry and Dave both doing a few laps. Ulrike, who has been out for some time due to an ankle injury, is now regularly doing six laps each week, in hopes of re-joining the regular two-mile phantom run competitions in a couple of weeks. Ross is the only member of the six-person team who has soldiered on without injuries over the past few months.

COINCIDENCES?

George, a surf life saver in England, got one of our DVD's in Somerset, took it home and watched it straight away. He then went to a town in North West Cornwall, which just happened to be the same town that Simon and Sue were distributing in that day. Then a few days later George met Roland distributing in Newquay, further down the coast. The team had some good fellowship with him, including an outing to raid bins. George eagerly showed the DVD to friends, as well as sharing bin-raided goodies with fellow Newquay surf life savers.

A SHEEP NAMED BOB

One Kenyan teacher (Rosemary) won a sheep for her participation in our reading program at Lugala Primary School, which ended this month. By switching our emphasis over to intensive use of the flashcards, we found that there was a 50% increase in the improvement rate at this school over what we have seen in previous schools. Rosemary has dubbed the sheep 'Bob' in recognition of Bob's leadership of the program there.

OTHER KENYAN PROJECTS

Rob has installed a new solar hot water system on the hall side of the compound, and Christine has made further progress with the disposable sanitary pad project. All the rooms (including the floors) have now been (finally!) painted, with the hall and the kitchen done last.

SAN DIEGO OUTREACH

The Los Angeles team finally managed to escape the various business needs that have kept them in Greater Los Angeles for more than a year, to make a brief outreach down south to San Diego (including a venture across the border). They were joined on the trip by a young woman named April, who came to experience a taste of our lifestyle.

NEW ARTICLES

There is a new article about government, and how to deal with problems that come from consensus decision-making, called "When Consensus Prevents Us". You can read it here:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH BOBBY KELLY

An exclusive interview with Bobby Kelly, who we had been accused of kidnapping ten years ago, is now up on our web page. Listen to Bobby give an account of what happened from his own perspective and learn about what he went through even after the media hype had blown over. You can access that video directly here: [jesus-teachings.com]

JOE'S STORY

Joe has finished writing and uploading a detailed account of what happened when he decided to become a Jesus Christian. This facinating story includes details about the horrendous attack on Reinhard's life, the controversial whipping trial, and Joe's family's response to it all. Read this account here: [jesus-teachings.com]

THE FORUM

Some new issues discussed this month:

Slavery and the right to revolt:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Universities and debt:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Could we survive without money?
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

The article that started the 'killers for Christ' lie:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

A new approach to birthdays:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

What makes a party 'a party':
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Consequences:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

What to do while waiting for Jesus:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Michael, the Archangel:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Mental Health:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Believers who are not JCs:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Advice on Bin Raiding:
[www.jesus-teachings.com]

Quote
Malcolm Wesley WREST
Dear Zeuszor,

I'd like to hear more of the Jim Roberts/Bretherern sect....it's not a group that I think I'm familiar with....

I supose you'd say that Neville was really Davids' first ever "permanent" recruit with Ross and I being the second and third respecitvely in late 1980....I'm not sure if David was in contact with the "Jim Roberts/Bretherern" at that stage...

His early material was clearly recyled Berg......(of course David may well have been influenced (i.e stole what he could for the purposes of his own cult) by Roberts later...just as he's pilfered ideas to recyle as his own over the course of his life....)

I apologize Zeuszor....do you mind either posting a link or further details here.

Mal, right now I am working on something else and will have to get to your question later today. Just wanted to jump in and post the newsletter ASAP.