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White Washing Yoga -- India Currents Magazine
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: August 08, 2017 04:19AM

Whitewashing Yoga

[www.indiacurrents.com]

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Why the best cult recruiters are people we already trust
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: September 10, 2017 12:23AM

The best recruiters are people you already trust. And the best recruiters
are not pushy - enthusiastic.

They are sincerely enthusiastic.

And this sincerity is attractive and appealing.

But sincerity does not in itself prove anything. It is
like sweet tasting substances.

We are wired to seek out the taste of sweetness.

But...sweetness can mask the taste of poison.

Those you trust who are sincerely, may without their knowledge have had
their sincerity co-opted by indoctrination experts (calling themselves
gurus, teachers, leaders, masters) to serve an agenda of deceit.

These trusted friends, coworkers, a teacher at your children's school, lovers, relatives, even in some
cases, yoga teachers or therapists -- they will be unaware that
their newfound feeling of salvation and transformation has been produced
a set of stimuli deployed by a dishonest group or guru, who are adept at manipulating the neurochemistry of trustful persons.

Those persons you trust do not feel exploited, even though
they are being exploited without being aware of it.

You are therefore unlikely to research this leader and group your
sincere, radient friend is involved with.

Even if you do learn alarming information about this group, you
may feel afraid to compromise a valued relationship by taking this
seriously. You may persuade yourself that this is obsolete
information, that it is about a different sect from the one your
friend is in.

You become an enabler for your friend by making these excuses to yourself.

You will not be aware that when you have this kind of fear, a fear that silences you, that this is a danger sign in the context of any relationship.

The most effective recruiters for a cult do not know that they and their
sincerity are being pimped by their group.

Pimped to to recruit for their guru or group via their existing relationship networks.

For the rest of the article go here:


[forum.culteducation.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2017 12:35AM by corboy.

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Re: The downside of yoga
Posted by: Alex45 ()
Date: November 13, 2017 11:11AM

History has shown the vicious cycle of anything good: it starts, it catches fire, it spreads far and wide from hype and super hype. with super hype is the evolvement of the good thing. different techniques, applications, combinations etc. People catch the hype fever, some overdo it. Some people get harmed by the wrong application or wrong combination or whatever. Then that mistaken use gets a bad rap, catches fire, spreads far and wide and a blanket of bad is then thrown over what was originally good.
Take water, for instance. It’s good for you, indispensable to life. But water can kill, too.
Therefore, don’t be carried away by everything you read, see, hear. Not all may be true. In fact many have an ounce of truth blown out of proportions. Investigate. The moral of the story is: moderation, prudence, guidance, discretion.

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Me Too - Pattabhi Jois - Chronic, Serial Sexual Predator
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: December 20, 2017 01:05AM

Karen Rain Responds to Mary Taylor’s Post About the Sexual Misconduct of Pattabhi Jois

December 11, 20174 min read

[www.decolonizingyoga.com]

Make sure to read the comments. Notice how rapidly the discussion got derailed by arguments about different definitions of scantily clad as pertains to women vs males.

One person summed it up very well.

Quote

Joanna Carichner
thank you for the post. I know you address this in the article, but it is particularly notable that all the women are referred to as "scantily clad" when they are wearing almost identical outfits to the men (except the women are more covered). Why is men in skin tight shorts and no shirt not seen as "scantily clad"?

Corboy: Damn right. And it isn't just in India. Go get on your local transit and see the blokes who are man spreading, taking up two seats, like they're doing limbering up exercises to prepare themselves for prostate surgery.

No one says anything. Eyes are averted.

No one comes up and compliments the man spreader on the size of his
junk and says "Duuuude, your package is just sooo gorgeous, let me give you some help with that."

Nope.

Now, imagine the uproar if any female did this same thing.

Double standard folks. And yes, it does stink.

Here are some thoughtful comments following the Pattabhi Jois expose.


JD - ·
U. of Florida
Thank you for posting this. I have been assaulted by two teachers in 35 years, neither in ashtanga, although that is my practice. Both men are well known predators. Happy we are addressing this without shame
Like · Reply · 30 · Dec 11, 2017 9:21am

BAS
thank you for sharing this Julie. please share their names so that we can protect one another. thank you.
Like · Reply · 6 · Dec 13, 2017 12:07pm

ET ·
Bodhananda Vedic Institute School of Ayurveda
I have heard from and read of women being assaulted. They all have said it happened by well known teachers but never say who. I would like to continue training with well known teachers but I'm concerned I may have it happen to me or that I'm paying a predator my hard earned money.
Like · Reply · 1 · Dec 13, 2017 5:00pm

Matthew Remski ·
Experimental U
I can say that as a reporter it is exceedingly difficult for women in the yoga world -- just like everywhere else -- to name names. They face one or more of a combination of disbelief, victim-shaming, cult-hazing tactics, social isolation, retraumatization, financial danger, and legal threats. The anonymized accounts in Rachel Brathen's recent piece represent a first step in reporting. To go further those women will need the support of professional journalism treatment, and, likely, legal advice. It's a long process, but it's happening.

[rachelbrathen.com]
Quote


Quote

ZN

The women's clothing is not the problem, even allowing for cultural differences. Any teacher, especially one with Jois' seniority, can tell students how to dress appropriately for their class.

If he felt the Western women were underdressed, he should have said so.

This is on him.
Like · Reply · 4 · Dec 12, 2017 7:56am

JP ·
Psychotherapist
I'm extremely grateful for Mary's acknowledgement and hope that, as in this case, it will open up the discussion moving forward. Thank you Karen and Matthew for pointing out what seems to be a deeply-rooted belief for so many, that somehow women truly are to blame... This belief is so engrained that it shows up even as we try to deny it, as you have pointed out. I have often felt in the yoga world that just to come through the door in a female body, even if I remained in a frumpy snowsuit, even if I were to say and do nothing, my mere presence as a being perceived by others to be a woman is...See More
Like · Reply · 4 · Dec 12, 2017 8:05am

Quote

LN ·
Yoga Instructor
I am so new to Ashtanga and am feeling conflicted about the light that has been shown upon our Guru. I guess my question would be, were these adjustments performed in the same way to men and they are deemed inappropriate because the receiver was a woman? If we want to be accepted and allowed behind the curtain of the deep practices, then too shouldn't we be willing to receive the adjustments/teachings in the same way that they have been taught? If the adjustments were different between men and women then... there is room for deep question in my own mind. I would like to here the feedback on consistency of adjustments between sexes.
Like · Reply · 1 · Dec 13, 2017 11:20am

Matthew Remski ·
Experimental U
I'll be publishing an more extensive article in the mainstream press here in Canada within the next little while that will show that Jois' touching of women was absolutely different in feeling and intensity from his touching of men.

The other part of your question reflects a misperception amongst some Jois students. "Adjustments" such as those given by Jois have no pre-modern history. They likely carry the assumptions of the physical interventions he knew from the Mysore Palace, which evolved in a context of corporal punishment.

I'm afraid that if you've been told that there is something "traditional" about these adjustments, you've been decieved. This claim has been a common justification amongst devoted students. It's unclear whether it was used as a conscious manipulation or not.

Don't take my word for it. Here's yoga scholar Jacqueline Hargreaves on the matter:

"To clarify the historical and cultural perspectives on the adjustments of Pattabhi Jois:

1. There is no precedent for the m?labandha adjustment (as given by Jois) in classical, medieval or pre-modern yoga. Nor is it replicated in any other lineages which extend from KM (i.e., Iyengar, Desikachar, Ramaswami, Mohan, Devi, etc.). This practice appears to have started with Jois and to suggest that there is a yogic teaching in this method is nonsensical.

2. To suggest that Western-style dress was the provocative cause of Jois’ behaviour completely diminishes the power he held in his position as guru. It also displays a limited understanding of the constant threat to women’s safety that is experienced when living and travelling in India, regardless of what one wears! It is never acceptable for an orthodox Brahmin to inappropriately touch and/or adjust a woman regardless of their age, race, caste or clothing, and such an offender would be well aware that this type of action is improper and provocative. If anything, the cultural differences would mean that these adjustments by a provincial Brahmin are even more inappropriate.
Like · Reply · Dec 13, 2017 11:50am

atthew Remski ·
Experimental U
For a different view on the "safety" of his adjustments, read through Guruji (Stern/Donahaye). You can start with the interview of Brad Ramsay. If you buy the book on Kindle, try word-searches for "pain" and "injury".

Other deceptions in the above comment include the use of the word "traditional". There is no premodern history of adjustments in hathayoga. It begins in the early 20th century through the influence of various physical culture training protocols. A further deception is that Jois was an "osteopath". He might have used the word "bonesetting" to describe cracking people's spines, but that does not imply osteopathic training.

Quote

MM ·
Infinite Light at Cronomi Records
Im also new to Ashtanga and i red here all the comments and...wow! I can only quote :

Matthew 26:41

"Watch and pray so that you will not enter into temptation. For the spirit is willing, but the body is weak."
Like · Reply · 1 · Dec 13, 2017 12:21pm

RN ·
Retired, well almost at Retirement in Thailand
Miss Rain, my thoughts exactly in regards to Mary F. Bringing up western students dress and behavior towards Jois. She brought it up twice. And then at the end she summarizes her love for him. Double messages I got from her.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/20/2017 01:19AM by corboy.

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First Yoga, then Alternative Medicine - missed opportunities
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: January 02, 2018 04:35AM

My Life in the New Age
By Porochista Khakpour

[www.vqronline.org]

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Re: The downside of yoga
Posted by: dirtbikes1 ()
Date: April 15, 2018 01:51PM

The downside of yoga for me was losing my athiest wife to a yoga "community" with a guru that practices all sorts of new age mumbo jumbo mixed with Hindu spiritual practices. You can read my story here: [forum.culteducation.com]

My concern now is keeping my child out of their yoga class which includes locking the room, no parents allowed, breathing exercises (animal noises), meditation with music and chanting, poses of course, and who knows what else. This stuff should definitely not be for kids.

So far I have been able to keep my daughter out, as she has no interest in yoga. Mainly I think because she knows this is a source of conflict with her mother and I, and also I hope I have opened her mind to not blindly believe what others believe without questioning. She is almost 10 but in some ways already smarter than her mother. She doesn't believe in magical crystals, tarot cards, or religion. She figured out at a young age that Santa clause and the tooth fairy, etc are not real. Spaghetti monsters in the sky is kind of our private joke. ;) I have and will do all I can do to keep her safe as long as I can.

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