could this be a cult?
Posted by:
lilsis
()
Date: February 24, 2004 05:33AM
Please help me understand this. Any honest input is appreciated!
My brother, who was a very successful member of the medical community, recently lost everything due to a drug addiction. He is now in a rehab center. His counselor at the rehab center got him involved in her "church". The conselor told my brother, who is at probably the most vulnerable time in his life righ now, that God "speaks to her" and that he can be "healed" only if he goes to her church. My brother is married and has 2 beautiful, severely disabled children. The counselor told my brother that his children are actually forms of Satan. She told him they must be "healed" at a ceremony in her church. His wife drove with her children to a church service at the request of my brother. She stayed for 15 minutes and left. She said there were bean bag chairs all over the floor because of people passing out when they are "healed." My brother claims to have passed out himself at one of these services, due to the healing powers of the clergy. His drug rehab counselor told him she was sent to earth from God to heal people.
His wife told him that she would not tolerate her family being a member of that church. My brother said he would stop going, but then he changed his mind after talking again with the drug counselor. His wife even told him that they could find a church to attend after he was out of rehab, but right now was not the time to make such a huge decision. My brother is convinced that he is doing the right thing.
My first question is, could this be a cult? Second question is, and this may be unrelated to this forum, does the rehab center, which claims no ties with ANY religious group, have a responsibility in this? Doesn't seem right that a counselor can go after people like this at such a vulnerable time.
Your insights are appreciated!
Thanks.
My brother, who was a very successful member of the medical community, recently lost everything due to a drug addiction. He is now in a rehab center. His counselor at the rehab center got him involved in her "church". The conselor told my brother, who is at probably the most vulnerable time in his life righ now, that God "speaks to her" and that he can be "healed" only if he goes to her church. My brother is married and has 2 beautiful, severely disabled children. The counselor told my brother that his children are actually forms of Satan. She told him they must be "healed" at a ceremony in her church. His wife drove with her children to a church service at the request of my brother. She stayed for 15 minutes and left. She said there were bean bag chairs all over the floor because of people passing out when they are "healed." My brother claims to have passed out himself at one of these services, due to the healing powers of the clergy. His drug rehab counselor told him she was sent to earth from God to heal people.
His wife told him that she would not tolerate her family being a member of that church. My brother said he would stop going, but then he changed his mind after talking again with the drug counselor. His wife even told him that they could find a church to attend after he was out of rehab, but right now was not the time to make such a huge decision. My brother is convinced that he is doing the right thing.
My first question is, could this be a cult? Second question is, and this may be unrelated to this forum, does the rehab center, which claims no ties with ANY religious group, have a responsibility in this? Doesn't seem right that a counselor can go after people like this at such a vulnerable time.
Your insights are appreciated!
Thanks.
could this be a cult?
Posted by:
Concerned Oz
()
Date: February 24, 2004 11:21AM
Dear lilsis,
I feel for you in your concern for your brother. When you are touched by something that appears to be un-natural or irrational it can become unnerving.
The "church" sounds like a penticostal church that preaches what is called the "prosperity gospel" This form of christian bible interpretation believes that God wants all people to be happy and that there should be no suffering as Christ suffered once only 2000 years ago for the redemption of all humanitys sin.
They believe that if there is suffering then it is not of God, its of Satan. So, if a person is suffering from a disability, then there is something that is not "right" between that person and God. ie: repentance and your failth in God will heal you. Therefore, if the disability persists, your faith is not strong enough or there is some demonic influence within you. This form of christianity is highly judgemental on those with disabilities or who are suffering.
As regards to the the woman hearing voices of God & your brother passing out, (refered to as resting in the Spirit):
1. The power of suggestion - the woman may be delusional & your brother may have been caught up in the frenzie that is created in these church meetings and "passed out by way of sugestion;
2. It is not unheard of that there maybe demonic involvement & the woman is being deceived by an "unclean spirit".
It is believed in Christianity, that the power of The Holy Spirit heals and this power of healing manifests through one believer to another. However, it is also believed that unclean or demonic spirits can mimic the power of the Holy Spirit.
My opinion from what you have written is that this "church" or at least the counselor woman is deceiving.
Ask you brother if he feels at peace?
In my country it is illegal for health workers to promote religious believes to clients / patients. At the very least it would be against the policy of the medical centre.
Oz
I feel for you in your concern for your brother. When you are touched by something that appears to be un-natural or irrational it can become unnerving.
The "church" sounds like a penticostal church that preaches what is called the "prosperity gospel" This form of christian bible interpretation believes that God wants all people to be happy and that there should be no suffering as Christ suffered once only 2000 years ago for the redemption of all humanitys sin.
They believe that if there is suffering then it is not of God, its of Satan. So, if a person is suffering from a disability, then there is something that is not "right" between that person and God. ie: repentance and your failth in God will heal you. Therefore, if the disability persists, your faith is not strong enough or there is some demonic influence within you. This form of christianity is highly judgemental on those with disabilities or who are suffering.
As regards to the the woman hearing voices of God & your brother passing out, (refered to as resting in the Spirit):
1. The power of suggestion - the woman may be delusional & your brother may have been caught up in the frenzie that is created in these church meetings and "passed out by way of sugestion;
2. It is not unheard of that there maybe demonic involvement & the woman is being deceived by an "unclean spirit".
It is believed in Christianity, that the power of The Holy Spirit heals and this power of healing manifests through one believer to another. However, it is also believed that unclean or demonic spirits can mimic the power of the Holy Spirit.
My opinion from what you have written is that this "church" or at least the counselor woman is deceiving.
Ask you brother if he feels at peace?
In my country it is illegal for health workers to promote religious believes to clients / patients. At the very least it would be against the policy of the medical centre.
Oz
could this be a cult?
Posted by:
liz
()
Date: February 27, 2004 08:25AM
and scary
do you know the name of this rehab center ?
what are this counselors credentials ?
is it appropriate (legal ) for her to be advising a church
when your brother is there for drug addicition ?
what kind of a place is this ?
I would be livid and try to get him out ASAP
ASAP ASAP ASAP ASAP ASAP
get the name of the counselor and report this insane behavior
Liz
do you know the name of this rehab center ?
what are this counselors credentials ?
is it appropriate (legal ) for her to be advising a church
when your brother is there for drug addicition ?
what kind of a place is this ?
I would be livid and try to get him out ASAP
ASAP ASAP ASAP ASAP ASAP
get the name of the counselor and report this insane behavior
Liz
could this be a cult?
Posted by:
Iblis
()
Date: March 06, 2004 03:33AM
The idea that because Jesus suffered around 32 ad and thus we will not is the most moronic idea i ever heard. Jesus did not come here to remove suffering from life, but to show us that all the suffering we feel he felt.
It is through suffering in life that we grow. If nothing ever goes wrong we are never challenged to learn, mature, and grow. In other words if we do not suffer we stagnate and that which stagenates dies!
To blame suffering on a devil is well ignorant. To say someone that is disabled is less connected to God or somehow cursed is an ancient prejudice. Why do christians act like if you're not perfect, or if life is not absolutely perfect then it's the devils fault. What about personal responcibility for ones choices? The problems we face in life just like the times of joy we experience are the direct result of the choices we make.
As for the is this a cult question. Any group, religion, or person that demands you think the way they say is a cult. They are one that is trying to control other people through fear, pain or desperation. People must be encouraged to think for themself. To find the true essence of God as it relates to them. No two people see life or God in exactly the same way. So to say there is only one picture of God or path to God is a narrow minded perspective based on prejudice and control.
Absolute control over another person is neither possible, desirable, or loving. Instead it destories what it sets out to protect.
Iblis
It is through suffering in life that we grow. If nothing ever goes wrong we are never challenged to learn, mature, and grow. In other words if we do not suffer we stagnate and that which stagenates dies!
To blame suffering on a devil is well ignorant. To say someone that is disabled is less connected to God or somehow cursed is an ancient prejudice. Why do christians act like if you're not perfect, or if life is not absolutely perfect then it's the devils fault. What about personal responcibility for ones choices? The problems we face in life just like the times of joy we experience are the direct result of the choices we make.
As for the is this a cult question. Any group, religion, or person that demands you think the way they say is a cult. They are one that is trying to control other people through fear, pain or desperation. People must be encouraged to think for themself. To find the true essence of God as it relates to them. No two people see life or God in exactly the same way. So to say there is only one picture of God or path to God is a narrow minded perspective based on prejudice and control.
Absolute control over another person is neither possible, desirable, or loving. Instead it destories what it sets out to protect.
Iblis
could this be a cult?
Posted by:
Claire
()
Date: March 19, 2004 08:24AM
I think the behavior of the counselor was inappropriate and should be reported. A religious community of support can be very helpful for someone fighting addiction. They can provide support, prayer, practical help, feedback. This doesn't sound like a healthy group, it may be Oneness Pentecostal or another extreme group. To believe sickness is of the devil is one thing; to believe his children are manifestations of the devil is another.
I believe we should pray for healing, but God does not always act in the way we would like - he is not our servant, we are his. God knows what is best for us, and will cause all things to work together for good.
I believe we should pray for healing, but God does not always act in the way we would like - he is not our servant, we are his. God knows what is best for us, and will cause all things to work together for good.
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