I am new to this board. My first posting 20 minutes ago did not appear and hence am reposting:

I stumbled upon your site a few days ago. I need some advice about something that seems to defy logic. One of the families we know got deeply involved in what appears to be a cult led by a young man. He led them on some meditations which had an explosive effect on the lady. She claims to have experienced bliss, total peace and joy within and love towards everyone. She also experienced some miraculous healing of her back pain. Progressvely though, the “guru’ has begun to intrude in their private life a lot, right down to advising her on day to day matters and matters pertaining to her and her family’s future. The lady was otherwise not a religious person, but now is totally transformed in both her character and beliefs. She believes that he is the Hindu God, Hanuman, and that she had been asked to serve his cause. So far they have not been fleeced for money but there is absolutely no peace in the family. I will informing my friend about this tread and would appreciate any input on how he should proceed. There are other people who are following this guru in the United States and in India. He has been a 'guru' for about an year from what I understand. BTW there is no information about the “guru” in culteducation.com website.

‘Progressvely though, the “guru’ has begun to intrude in their private life a lot, right down to advising her on day to day matters and matters pertaining to her and her family’s future.’

What you have described is classic for a cult. A genuine spiritual teacher does NOT try to take over people’s lives in the manner you have described, but will do everything possible to put people in touch with their own unique talents and get them to function as responsible adults.

Genuine Hindu gurus have many, many years of training. And they do not recruit non-Hindus! A lot of people go to India get ‘half baked’ with just a bit of training, then come back to the US and set up as gurus. Indians call people like this 'export gurus'--meaning they are never taken seriously in India, but can only gain a following in the gullible West after they 'export' themselves.

Over here, we dont know how to tell the difference between a genuine guru and a wannabe.

We don’t go to a heart surgeon unless he or she has completed medical school and has had many years of post graduate training; a soul surgeon needs just as much training—not just a few months or a couple of years.

It is possible for certain people to trigger bliss and surges of energy by laying on of hands. In traditional Chinese medicine and the martial arts, this subtle energy is called ‘chi’ and in Hinduism it is called ‘shaktipat’ or ‘kundalini.’

The ability to trigger surges of subtle energy is a neutral skill. A crook can learn to do it. An ordinary person can learn to do it and a saint can learn to do it. All too often most persons assume it is evidence of holiness. It is not.

It is possible that your friend was slightly depressed or looking for some kind of escape or relief when she crossed paths with this man—and he knew how to exploit this yearning in her. The yearnings we do not know we have are the ways con artists can most powerfully hook us.

Be there for your friend. Keep the porch light on. Try not to say ‘I told you so.’

If you can find out this person’s name, you do searches on both google and the google groups.

This article describes how one can become addicted to subtle energy.


Addiction to Shaktipat

[www.google.com]

Greetings,

One thing you need to understand is that although Rick Ross's database is most likely the biggest and most comprehensive cult database in the world, it would be impossible to name every cult in the world. First of all, you said this fellow who is supposed to be an Avatar of Hanuman has "only been a guru for one year". This is a relatively new movement, then. Also, there are cults that have been around since the 1970's that aren't in the database simply because they are very low profile, and nobody has received any information about them (Science of Identity Foundation for example).

This is where you come in. Gather up all their websites. If you know any ex-members, get one to write a testimonial. Have they been in the newspaper? Find us the clipping.

Thank you corboy and dervish for the useful information. I am still amazed at the whole business of energy and its manipulation. The fact is that the lady who was in considerable pain had the pain removed. She experienced bliss and needs this person to continue this state. Also she is able to feel 'divine vibrations' and near bliss state in the presence of dieties in hindu temples, churches etc., and when she listens to religious music. The family's life has been turned upside down. Corboy was right in that the lady suffered from depression due to some financial situations, loss etc., She has tried not to do her meditation for a while and has become almost crazy in her zeal to win her family over to following the guru, and to restart her meditation. The whole thing is so bizzare and unbelievable. Some of the questions facing the husband are: How does one convince her that this is not the right course. Even if she agrees how does one go about reversing this condition (divine vibrations etc,) even if this is possible. What is chakra opening? This is one of the process that was done to the family.
Thanks again

If she was in pain, and now is feeling no pain, this is probably due to Self-suggestion. Hypnosis, and relaxation, self-suggestion, etc, are one of the best ways of dealing with chronic pain. Also, she could have had psychosomatic pain.
She COULD also be experiencing "mania", or something of that nature.
From my point of view, these "gurus" do not have any healing power, i see no scientific evidence for that. BUT, people do have enormous psychosomatic power over their own bodies, within biological limits of course.
This business about "chakras" etc, from my point of view is "just" imagination. But imagination and belief is very powerful.

But many people BELIEVE 100% in these things. I have friends who do so-called "energy work" for a living!
I see it as "just" being auto-self-suggestion.

Coz

Quote

Originally posted by alphaalpha
I am still amazed at the whole business of energy and its manipulation. The fact is that the lady who was in considerable pain had the pain removed.

She experienced bliss and needs this person to continue this state. Also she is able to feel 'divine vibrations' and near bliss state in the presence of dieties in hindu temples, churches etc., and when she listens to religious music.

Cosmophilospher, thanks for your response. After finding this forum I have found that concepts like Shakthipath, bliss etc., indeed seems to be true. I have also been going to a yoga program ishafoundation.org where I have seen these kinds of ecstatic outbursts. We were always told not to ask and not to discuss what people are feeling and I somehow believed the guru's words. I know of at least one person who is having problems in his family life because of these kinds of surge of powers etc., Regarding healing I do not know what to say except that people seem to swear by concepts like reiki etc., BTW I would appreciate if someone could let me know if ishafoundation also qualifies to be a cult. I know of a number of people who are into this (including myself) and we could at least not spread the word like we have been doing.
I would like to know on a practical side how one could reverse her condition and how to bring her back to normalcy. Thanks.

[www.lebanonwire.com]

Here is an article about Sadguru Jaggi Vasudev of Isha Foundation.

Personally, I'm not sure what to make of them. I know very little about Shaivism, so I don't know what is their norm (I know a lot more about Vaishnavism, which is my creed). The fact that they charge a hefty fee for participating in their program and constantly peddle their wares during the programs really put me off, but so does Dalai Lama, and everybody seems to like him a great deal. Take your classes, but always be cautious. Have faith in Lord Shiva, as you wish, but do not allow your objectivity to be consumed.

Thank you Dervish for the link about Sadhguru. And for your advice regarding not losing ones objectivity. Unfortunately most of these gurus want you to give up your logic and trust them implicitly. Wish I had realized this 3 years ago when I took this program and the more advanced program. Seems like it is only the Shaivite way that has more incidents of energies, kundalini etc., I have not heard much about these things in the Vaishnavite path.

Any suggestion about reversal of the effects that these so called energies? It defies logic and quite amazing that people could be in a state of bliss, experience healings etc., while at the same time have a suspect guru who can cause this effect. There has got to be a scientific explanation for this, I hope. Thanks.

Devish, thank you for the link about Ishafoundation. I had replied to this even last night put for some reason my post is not there. In the U.S ishafoundation's courses last 5 evenings and 2 days and costs two hundred something dollars. I found the breathing exercises to be beneficial but the curious noises etc., to be frightening at first. Slowly they train you to ignore this aspect of it and not talk about it. For my part I will be careful about whom and how I recommend this program in future.

I wish I had heard your comment about taking classes but not giving up one's objectivity earlier. Anybody have any information about how this lady's condition could be reversed to normalcy and this apparent addiction to these enegies cured? Is this harmful in any way to continue on this kind of meditation and energizing by this 'guru' (By the way the guru I am referring to is not the one with Isha Foundation). I have learnt that with someone else this 'guru' was transformed to their favorite god form during meditation. How on earth are all these possible!

Unfortunately most of these gurus want you to give up your logic and trust them implicitly.

If they want you to give up all sensibility at the expense of Shaivite dharma or Vaishnava dharma, or if they put your safety at risk, then they are meant to be rejected. Just because somebody calls themself a guru, and they have all these Indian followers in India, and a nice ashram, don't think this is some sort of golden seal of approval. It's easy to get followers in India. It's so poor over there, all you need to do is get a few people together and promise them a nice ashram and 3 square meals a day.

It's also easy to get western followers. Chinmoy was a clerk at the UN until he saw he could make much more money guru'ing, there are a lot of people who come from India and take advantage of western fascination with meditation and chanting, and their uninformed nature about gurus.

On the other hand, I believe there are some sincere gurus in India who give you a true path, but they are few and far between. Best to be careful, read a lot, and be very well informed. Have a very good BS detector online in your mind at all times!

Kundalini can be dangerous at times. I've heard when done improperly, it can be dangerous. Many websites out there have information of Kundalini gone bad. Be careful. I know of no "cure" or treatment for Kundalini gone bad. Vaishnavism is about bhakti, not so much about elaborate meditation, but we have our fair share of snake oil salesmen. Be on the lookout!

Also your posts wont appear immediately after you press "send". The moderator approves posts one by one when he's online.