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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Date: April 09, 2012 12:55PM

Thank you for the Update!

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: Truth_Seeker_78 ()
Date: September 24, 2012 03:03AM

I now have a YouTube video channel up where prospective members can hear for themselves the cult-inspired teaching straight from Vinson and the elders mouths.
Additionally, there is a new emphasis on money with one of the elders now declaring that there are "wages due" to Mike Vinson.

The video channel is here: [www.youtube.com]

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: BRIAN032352 ()
Date: January 05, 2013 07:51PM

Hello! I have just become involved with IWWB online since early November 2012.

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: RobinKorevaar ()
Date: January 08, 2013 06:31PM

I am very much involved in this "cult" and i do not recognize anything what truthseeker...and whats in a name...refers too.

I never have payed any money to anybody nor am i in any way pressured to do so. On the contrary..i have asked some if they needed financial support and it was kindly refused.

I never go to any biblestudy except the sunday morning biblestudy now and then. I have been around for some years now and not ever is it mentioned to me as being a problem.

As far as i know, never is anybody "kicked out". If there are differences in view then Scripture teach that there is safety in a multitude of counselors and that is how things go amongst us.

There are people among us who know more then others and they are respected for that. This goes in a "natural" way .. no force, nobody is assigned a position...it works out how it is led...nothing more and nothing less.

There is no perfection in this flesh ... it is a process of dying and growing for all, but not for all at this point in time...even this lifetime. To me personally it doesnt matter how we are called. I do not know any person involved who is looking for personal gain or stature...i see open minded people who are very considered towards everybody, involved or not...but we do take a stand on what Scripture says and we, Lord willing, act upon it.

Im not here to argue and i am fine if others have a different opinion...i can only say what i personally experience and that is very far from what truthseeker is saying here.

Sincere questions will be answered as long as it wont start to be a drag or disrespectfull.

kind regards
Robin

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: Truth_Seeker_78 ()
Date: January 09, 2013 02:23AM

In reply to the two "brothers" who have posted above (BRIAN032352 and RobinKorevaar) - IWWB does unfortunately fulfil the mandate for a cult group. Allow me to address the comments of RobinKorevaar first:

He/She says: "I never have paid any money to anybody nor am I in any way pressured to do so..."
The teaching from Vinson and IWWB is clear. Mike Vinson says you are to bestow "double honour" on both him and his elder-ship, physically and spiritually. Here is a YouTube video where Vinson explicitly states this: [youtu.be]

Additionally, the teaching from Vinson and his elders is clear with regards to money. Members are told to "keep the coffers full" and told that the best gift for Mike Vinson is: "you give 'em money."
Again, here is audio from a bible study that explicitly states this: [youtu.be]

Mike Vinson, head of IWWB is referred to as an "angel" and one elder said that "Christ came to me inside of Mike" and additionally, stated that the IWWB members have "hired" Mike Vinson and that wages are therefore due. YouTube link: [youtu.be]

Now, is any rational person going to argue after listening to this audio that: "I never have paid any money to anybody nor am I in any way pressured to do so?" It seems the only person making such a claim is an indoctrinated IWWB member who doesn't want the name of the group bought into disrepute.

Moving on - RobinKorevaar states: "As far as I know, never is anybody "kicked out". If there are differences in view then Scripture teach that there is safety in a multitude of counsellors and that is how things go amongst us."

That's a lie, pure and simple. Vinson states online that he won't tolerate opposing arguments and further, admits that HIS OWN SON said to him: "Dad, it looks like you're just looking for a reason to kick people out." Why would his own son say this to him? Vinson then states that his own son is "not part of the body any-more." When Vinson or IWWB refer to "the body" they maintain the view that they alone are the true "body of Christ." So contrary to what RobinKorevaar says above, Vinson believes he has the right to decide who is and who is not part of the body of Christ. Here is YouTube video explicitly showing this to be true: [youtu.be]

Lastly, RobinKorevaar says: "There is no perfection in this flesh..."
Again, this is not what Vinson has stated. I will let Vinson's own words witness against this rebuttal. Here are two YouTube clips where Vinson explicitly states that he has "dominion" over sin.
Clip 1 [youtu.be]
Clip 2 [youtu.be]

Vinson uses the word "dominion" in both instances. Dominion is defined as "supreme authority" and "absolute ownership." "Dominus" (the words from which our English "dominion" is derived) in Latin means "lord or master." So in truth, Vinson is stating he is "lord and master" and has absolute ownership" over sinning. Sin, as you might know means "to miss the mark."

How RobinKorevaar can say that there is no such teaching on this is beyond me.
I hope this reply clear the air for those lurking or reading on. I do not make these claims of IWWB without a basis for them. I have the audio straight from Vinson himself about the matters.

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: Truth_Seeker_78 ()
Date: January 09, 2013 02:46AM

As an update to my previous post, here are some words penned by Vinson which demonstrate the cult leanings of the groups teaching:

Quote
Mike Vinson
We, the elect, don’t make friends with those of the world or church because we know that people who do are the enemy of God…

Quote
Mike Vinson
As a matter of fact, we, the elect, consider no one our friend unless they first keep Christ’s commandments. This is why we are ‘separate’ and are to be ‘hated by all men’. We are even comfortable being hated by those who are closest to us…

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Mike Vinson
The church, in God’s eyes, is merely co-mingled with the rest of the world in its love for the world and sin...

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Mike Vinson
Orthodox Christianity is contradiction. Every single doctrine they have is a contradiction of the word of God.

I don't honestly know how anybody can state that "I do not recognize anything that TruthSeeker refers to..."

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: RobinKorevaar ()
Date: January 09, 2013 11:49AM

What you obviously do not understand....truthseeker, is that things are said out loud in order to study them to seek what God in His word is saying and how we are supposed to act on it. That allways involves a process...sometimes painfull ones...it doesnt fall out of the sky like...boem...there it is.

Has there been talk about money...Yes. After prayer and study, did we find that a material money system had to be applied...No.

The only thing you do "truth" seeker ... is that you hear something...you have no clue what is going on...and you just post whatever you want.

The next point you dont understand is that there is not going to be endless debate and discussion over doctrine. There most certainly is extended debate, prayer and searching for the mind of Christ by everybody involved, but when consensus is found within the multitude of counselors then that is the path we are going to follow.

What then happens sometimes is that people do not see or understand the chosen path directly....some accept that and give it time to come to understanding..and often do...there is non stopping patience with brothers and sisters who are of that mind. Then there are some who want to push their own views as being truth.

Pro 11:14 Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Mike Vinson is not "a multitude of counsellors" on his own....nor is Mitchell Kuhn...nor is anybody else. Are they the people who come foreward...sure they are...do they decide by them selves what truth is ? The moment that will happen is the moment i am out of there.

About your quotes...truthseeker... why is that cult-like ? Friendship is something intimate...it involves being able to speak about stuff wich is very personal. Two oponent views can hardly become such kind of friends. Why dont you blame a veganist not being able to have this kind of friendship with a farmer who breeds pigs for McDonalds ? Or a orthodox left wing politician with an orthodox right wing politician....a creationist with an evolutionist.

I picked one of your youtube 30 second quotes....it was the first about dominion over sin. That quote starts with the following words: The day comes ..... You surely are a "truth" seeker .. arent you.

I have seen more of these quotes...a couple of seconds out of an hour of study, making things sound completely different then what is ment, especially for those who allready have their minds set up.

I dont know who you are "truth" seeker...you cant post using your own name so you obviously have something to hide...sitting anonymous behind your computer talking about things you do not understand yet.

These things can go on and on...i dont have time for that, sorry. I have stated this before and will do it ones more...i am very much and gladly involved with this "cult" as you call it and i do not recognize the spirit wich "truth" seeker is advocating. As soon as it becomes that spirit...i will leave.

kind regards
Robin

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: rrmoderator ()
Date: January 09, 2013 04:03PM

RobinKorevaar:

How is the group governed? Does it have a constitution, bylaws and regular elections?

Is there budget that discloses in detail how the group finances are handled?

Does anyone receive a salary or compensation? How is that decided upon and disclosed to contributors?

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: RobinKorevaar ()
Date: January 09, 2013 04:39PM

rrmoderator:

How is the group governed? Does it have a constitution, bylaws and regular elections?
The group is governed by the multitude of counsellors. This means that when there is an issue, many are involved in looking what is the mind of Christ on the matter. There is no constitution, bylaws (whatever that is) or elections...why would there be elections if there are no leaders ?

Is there budget that discloses in detail how the group finances are handled?
There are no organised finances. The only thing i know of is that some are financially supported by some others on a totall voluntary basis...i have no clue who is doing it and who is recieving it...i do know that it happens.

Does anyone receive a salary or compensation? How is that decided upon and disclosed to contributors?
Nobody recieve a salary or compensation.

If there is anything more i can help you with, then please let me know.

kind regards
Robin Korevaar

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Re: Mike Vinson and IWWB - cult alert
Posted by: rrmoderator ()
Date: January 09, 2013 04:50PM

RobinKorevaar:

You admit, "here is no constitution, bylaws (whatever that is) or elections."

What you have described is a group without any meaningful accountability.

You say, "some are financially supported by some others", but you admit "There are no organised finances". This means there is no meaningful financial transparency through formal accounting and no one really knows how the money is handled except for a select few.

Based upon your answers it seems to me that there are no meaningful safeguards in place.

Thanks for the answers.

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