'Thatcher would love you, Stoic!!....'

Maybe, but I had no love for the iron lady. Bit of a lefty then, apolitical now, having suffered the Bliar.

We are still an insular nation EU or no. There can't be many Brits who would identify as EEC European, although we are signed up.

I doubt that the Apostle has the same power to pull in pidgin Frenglish, somewhat handicapped I think.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2011 03:21AM by Stoic.

Quote
Apollo
Apparently German ''cult busters'' have described the JCs as one of the most dangerous cults in the world today.

Which ones? What is the name of the organization or individual that made such a ridiculous claim? The source of that quote was from Dave himself, and is by its very nature spurious.

Apollo, you should know better than to take Dave's word for anything.

"One of the most dangerous cults in the world today"? That's a load of bull. I'd argue that the CO$ and the Moon organization are much, much more pernicious than piddling Dave and Cherry McKay.

The McKays are amateurs, make no mistake about it. Dangerous and evil people nonetheless, but in the world of cult leaders David McKay is a clown. He never was anywhere near Moon's caliber.



Hell, on March 23, 2004 Moon was crowned the "King of Peace" by two sitting Congressmen in a coronation ceremony held on Capitol Hill! This is the stuff of DM's narcissistic wet dreams!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2011 05:49AM by zeuszor.

I guess whichever cult you're in is the most dangerous to you in particular. Please lets not argue over which is the worst---they are all bad.

In my opinion, to call the JCs "one of the most dangerous cults in the world today" is simply absurd. They're a bad group to be sure, but they are not the CO$.

Jim Roberts, Feroze Golwalla, Ole Anthony, Miller Newton, David McKay.

All of these men are narcissistic, predatory individuals who lead small, obscure cult groups, and who have a predilection for recruiting young kids, the children of persons other than themselves.

Golwalla is presently under house arrest and Ole Anthony is old and decrepit, and neither of these men is presently actively recruiting anybody.

Miller Newton lives in Madiera Beach, Florida and is now called Father Cassian; he is a priest in the Antiochan Orthodox Church. Newton has a small band of followers out there at his "church."

Jim Roberts, as always, is in hiding somewhere, and his cult has dwindled down to approximately 40 members. At their peak, the Roberts group had around 140 or so members to their number.

David McKay is also in hiding, and the JCs by present estimates are fewer than 30 in number. Ostensibly, the JCs are no more now.

All of the above are basically the same type of psychopathic personalities, but what sets McKay apart and makes him especially loathsome (to me) is this sadistic mean streak and smarminess that he has about him. That, and his preference to try and recruit kids.

In my mind, there are basically, generally two kinds of cult leaders: those who believe in their own "shtick" and really think that they are doing the right thing, and those who know that they are full of it, but do not want anybody else to figure it out.

McKay is in the latter category, if you ask me. I do not believe that he actually gives a damn about what the Bible says on any given matter, only in the supremacy of his own opinions ans whims.

He is a cynical, sadistic, psychopathic bad man, a monster, and I do not have to empathize with him or any of the rest of the aforementioned demoniac personalities.

If anybody reading this can tell me of one good quality that DM does possesses, that he does not use to try and hurt others, then please tell me. Because I can think of none.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2011 07:16PM by zeuszor.

[www.youtube.com]

Jesus loves the little children,
All the little children of the world.
Red and yellow, black and white,
They are precious in his sight.
Jesus loves the little children of the world.

Everything is beautiful in it's own way.
Like the starry summer night, or a snow-covered winter's day.
And everybody's beautiful in their own way.
Under God's heaven, the world's gonna find the way.

There is none so blind as he who will not see.
We must not close our minds; we must let our thoughts be free.
For every hour that passes by, we know the world gets a little bit older.
It's time to realize that beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder.

And everything is beautiful in it's own way.
Like the starry summer night, or a snow-covered winter's day.
Oh, sing it children!
Everybody's beautiful in their own way.
Under God's heaven, the world's gonna find the way.

We shouldn't care about the length of his hair, or the color of his skin.
Don't worry about what shows from without, but the love that lives within.
And we're gonna get it all together now; everything gonna work out fine.
Just take a little time to look on the good side my friend,
And straighten it out in your mind.

And everything is beautiful in it's own way.
Like the starry summer night, or a snow-covered winter's day.
Ah, sing it children!
Everybody's beautiful in their own way,
Under God's heaven the world's gonna find a way.
One more time!
Everything is beautiful in it's own way.
Like the starry summer night, or a snow-covered winter's day...

Its a lovely song and sentiment Zeuszor, but it also has to be realised that no two people ever see the world in exactly the same way---and that is OK too.
That means that what you see is particular to you and your opinion is no better and no worse than anyone elses--it is just an opinion, not an order for the rest of us to follow blindly.

I think we all agree, on this thread that Wanker Extraordinaire Dave McKay is a vicious, nasty religious conman, so I really don't get why you are looking for an argument here.

You are arguing with yourself, and that seems a bit pointless on this thread where we are all analysing the Apostle Dave McKay.

I would like to revisit the email sent by Nomen, passed on by Sisi, as it is an interesting perspective on the current strategy of the JC's in going ostensibly underground, like Jim Roberts.

If you are going to have a personally inspired strop at the mention of Sisi's name, please do it elsewhere, we don't need it on this public thread.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2011 08:36PM by Stoic.

Nobody's looking for an argument, and nobody's having a fit. You just don't realize the history here.

The bottom line is that that woman lied to me and tricked me, and then turned around and bad-mouthed me up and down the block. She tricked me, and then sold me out. Yeah, she's a real sweetheart.

I don't want to see her brought back around any more than I want to see Denise brought back around.

Quote
Stoic
That means that what you see is particular to you and your opinion is no better and no worse than anyone elses--it is just an opinion, not an order for the rest of us to follow blindly.

Tell that to Dave's kids.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2011 08:59PM by zeuszor.

Nomen said:

[forum.culteducation.com]


The solution to ending their own negative image generation is to get Dave to stop posting on their forum which can only be done by eliminating the forum. I don't believe this is a group-think decision, I believe it's Dave's own acknowledgment, which I see he mentioned some time ago that he is losing control of their forum. He knows that he could not stand firm in not responding to negative posts on his own forum, so the only solution is to eradicate his circus forum altogether.

Perhaps this was the bone of contention with the graduates, they were trying to get Dave McKay to shut up as they could recognise, particularly after his close association with the crazy texas rose, that he was making a bad situation far worse for them with his inability to moderate his behaviour towards the new recruits they needed to aquire survive as a group.
Therein lies the problem, where does a personality cult go when the charismatic personality is going off the rails? The one thing that defines the group is seen through as the thing that is simultaneously destroying the group.

My guess would be that the graduates first attempted to persuade McKay to take a back seat, become a figurehead guru, a constitutional monarch in other words but have since realised that McKay without a mouthpiece is never going to happen. He will not release his deathgrip on power in order to power-share. They gave him the site because he was not going to relinquish it.


The solution to stopping the external negative image is to try and convince the RR forum and the xJC forum that the JCs no longer exist, thus eliminating the need for negative press in those two venues.

This is so obvious that it requires no comment.



'If you compare the high tech recruitment methods (internet videos, DVD, forum, etc.) where he has a 99.9% failure rate because of the negative image those potential recruits see on the internet to a new low-tech (based solely on individual encounters, responses from his literature via snail-mail and email) he can increase his recruitment.

After all, a 20% success rate for individual encounters (say maybe a few hundred) with those who express interest via private mail and messaging would be much more successful than a .01% success rate for thousands encountered who have access to his forum, RR, xJCs, etc.

It's all a matter of reducing the risk of a potential convert finding out the truth about the JCs.'

Someone has done a cost/benefit analysis on their results and decided to revert to old style on the street recruitment. That means that the young graduates are doing the recruiting because the old farts like McKay have lost any pulling power they once might have had. (apologies to the old farts everywhere, of which I am one)
The graduates don't need internet access to recruit, they are young and will go where other young people gather in 'alternative' venues and attract like minded souls.
I don't think the Gianstefanis took refuge with the Catholic Workers, they just saw a pool of vulnerable prospective recruits amongst the idealists congregating there. As Dave and Cherry previously did with the Quakers and Catholics.


'So if he takes away his members ability to use money, they won't have easy internet access and access to his detractors and to read what Dave is getting up to which usually results in a negative reflection on the JC cult which, I am sure that many of the members discuss among themselves. If they won't have passports, they won't have the ability to return to their love ones. I don't for one minute believe that Dave himself will EVER not have a passport or internet access, but I believe that now he exclusively will be the person that potential recruits communicate with via email.'

No money, (practice for the apocalyse) and no passports will make the graduates, who have been a bit less than obsequious to Apostle since he took up with the texas rose, utterly dependent on him and on his good will. He will be back in control, what he always works for. They will be stranded and waiting for him to make an occasional visit, if and when he feels like it, like a kept lover when the passion has cooled.

Re: cult leaders: "those who believe in their own "shtick" and really think that they are doing the right thing, and those who know that they are full of it, but do not want anybody else to figure it out." Hey, Zeuszor, do you really think that they believe they are doing the right thing - is it self-deception?