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Encouragement and Warning
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: April 22, 2014 11:08PM

Corboy's Mission Statement

All material I write is to assist readers to preserve and extend their human rights and to stay at liberty or to become emancipated from abuses of power.

Anyone who uses this material to toy with and dominate others, who abuses this information--

You will become a prisoner of these techniques.

And to all you who hope to get rich or are already financially wealthy as a result of abusing these techniques --

If you are rendered helpless by illness, accident, or old age, watch out.

You will find that your your catheter, your pee bag, your Depend diapers, your food and your water will be in control of someone else.

And you will find yourself hoping that that someone else has kind eyes, a kind heart and smile that is human and warm, uncomplicated by ideology.

Someone who has been taught human integrity *in the conventional sense*.

Here is how to use Google to analyze "be in integrity" and ID the grammatical confusion.

It helped that earlier members of the board taught us about the use of nominalization as an element of trance induction.

One way to ID something as a thing versus a concept or quality is, ask if you can put X into a dumpster or wheelbarrow.

If so, it is a physical entity.

But..there is no such thing as a wheelbarrow or dumpster filled with integrity. We do not write or speak of hauling a load of integrity to the town dump.

Propositions such as 'in' or 'on' work only in relation to *objects* -- physical entities. You can put something in the refrigerator. You put something on the floor or on a table. You stand on a chair.

But you cant put something in or into integrity.

You cannot walk into integrity as you would walk into a room.

You cannot reserve a campsite in integrity.

Again, integrity is a concept, not an object/physical entity.

*****A concept cannot be the object of a proposition****

1) look up the words 'in' and 'integrity' That is how I learned that integrity is a concept or quality, not a place.

2) Identify whether they are nouns, verbs, propositions. Most dictionaries give abbreviations.

3) One can put the word (such as "in") in the Google slot and put the word

So if one learns the rules of grammar, which code the logic by which our minds operate, you can, if creative and kind, violate those rules in ways that lead to poetry.

Or do it in other ways that disrupt thought.

Here is an example of a street trick that uses violation not of grammar but of conventional useage to create confusion.

"You dropped your pocket."

In this case, a pocket could be said to be physical; it is a feature of clothing or purses or backpacks.

But a pocket is part of ones clothing or one's purse or backpack.

One of the subtle rules of English is that we never speak of dropping our pockets. We can speak of things that fall out of our pockets. Or speak of dropping our pants or dropping our purse or our backpack.

But not, dropping one's pocket.

That violation of common usage is a confusion inducer. Some idiots ran that by me one day.

Because of my long experience on this board I stared at them and asked them to repeat what they said. And asked them to repeat it again.

I then told them it is not kind to toy with other human beings or use them as objects.

Another feature of Large Group Awareness Trainings is that they violate rules of basic logic.

Violations of the rules of grammar often signal a violation of logic.

Here are some citations.

These citations may help. The one entitled Modern Pied Pipers looks good.


Six Danger Signs of Harmful LGATs | Large Group ...

Nov 10, 2006 - ... attempts to invalidate Aristotelian logic in toto, so that “A” can also be “not-A.” This, if carried to the “logical” conclusion, makes nonsense out of language, ... 2006 Landmark Education Labor Violations Investigation Texas

The Siren Call of Modern Pied Pipers

... "...the Forum's espousal of the supremacy of man violate[d] their belief in the ..... Eastern/New Age teaching generally attempts to invalidate Aristotelian logic in ...

Is Byron Katie Working? - Liminal Nation

28 posts - ?8 authors
Which is why she does LGAT with folks who are mostly open to what she has to ... Eastern/New Age teaching generally attempts to invalidate Aristotelian logic in ...

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Re: How To Undo The Psychological Damage? (Landmark) (Please Help)
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: April 23, 2014 01:45AM

This phrase, 'be in integrity' has spread far and wide.


Even if we stay out of LGATs, we can easily encounter people write and speak these thought stopping phrases in venues not identifiable as LGATs.

These items have spread far and wide in New Age/Human Potential parlance.

It is important to know to trust that 'jarring' feeling one gets when one encounters these phrases.

And to cultivate an index of suspicion when we encounter these verbal tricks.

Grammatical violation is painful to the ear.

One may wince or feel annoyed. But --and this is important to keep in mind --ordinary lapses in grammar do not affect one's concentration and mental state.

But these artfully constructed thought stopper phrases are different.

One's mind feels..stopped or stunned. Like a dropped connection on one's phone.

Learn to use that feeling as a signal to step back from the situation and quickly as one can, pull one's attention together and study the speaker.

Ask that person to repeat that phrase.

Keep asking or demanding that the speaker repeat the phrase.

A) You can memorize it, write it down and then get home or online and look it up.

See if it is tied to Werner Erhard.

Next, study the grammar and ID whether grammatical and logical violations are there.

If someone has good will, he or she should not mind repeating the phrase.

But if someone is trying to run a game on you, making them repeat a thought stopper phrase breaks their momentum, throws them off the game. And will signal that you are not an easy mark.

More grammar.

In grammar a proposition (such as 'in') requires an object -- container, refrigerator, basket, room, one's pocket.

(Throw (verb) the ball (object) in (proposition) the basket (object of the proposition)

Because integrity is an abstract concept it is not a 'thing' so it cannot be
an object of a proposition.

So, we cannot be grammatically correct and say "Throw integrity in the basket".

And in addition to being a grammatical violation "in integrity" is jarring to the ear, because the sound 'in' is repeated twice, rather like a stutter, as well as being a violation of grammatical usage.

Now, lets look at the word 'be'.

It has a wide range of uses in the English language. If "Be" is the first word of a sentence, the reader or listener cannot know what it means until the rest of the sentence is comprehended.

"Be" is an attention getter when it is is the opening word.

If uttered with an urgent or commanding tone, the impact is heightened. If a speaker adds a gesture, the impact is further enhanced.

And...that is just one word.

Now, follow that with a grammatical violation that disrupts logical flow -- that is powerful little phrase.

Again, Corboy offers these thoughts to readers for purposes of education, emancipation and so that they can be better equipped to defend the inherant dignity of the ordinary untransformed human person --themselves and others.

Anyone using this crap to get an undue advantage over other people --

May you in helplessness find yourself at the mercy of people no better than yourself.

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Re: How To Undo The Psychological Damage? (Landmark) (Please Help)
Posted by: healed ()
Date: May 11, 2014 04:33AM

Hello mood:crisis

I read your post with interest...especially the part about the fear that you have been feeling since being involved with landmark. I had the same experience during the 2 years I was involved, and have thought a lot about why this is the case.

I don't think it's the fear exercise that provokes the intense sense of fear afterwards, but the exercises that involve staring at people for a long period of time.

Prolonged staring is usually associated with aggression, hostility and threats. Think about it, if somebody in a public space stared at you in the way that landmark asks people to stare at each other in the courses, it would be very frightening. We have biological responses to prolonged staring, which provoke the fight or flight response in our bodies.

Eye contact is very powerful and carries strong non-verbal communications.

There is a reason why they say that the eyes are the window to the soul. If someone stares at you for a long time, you can leave feeling naked/exposed in a way that is threatening to you both psychologically and physically.

I believe that landmark sets up many situations which create scenarios which a person, without knowing it, finds very threatening. Although they give the scenarios nice names, they are essentially frightening situations to be put in. Your conscious mind may be reassured by the names that landmark gives, but your senses respond to the underlying threat.

I believe this is what creates the deep sense of fear.

Hope this helps.

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Re: How To Undo The Psychological Damage? (Landmark) (Please Help)
Posted by: mood: crisis ()
Date: May 14, 2014 04:00AM


I believe that landmark sets up many situations which create scenarios which a person, without knowing it, finds very threatening. Although they give the scenarios nice names, they are essentially frightening situations to be put in. Your conscious mind may be reassured by the names that landmark gives, but your senses respond to the underlying threat.

Hi Healed,

That is all helpful, and in fact I hadn't considered the factor of the staring exercise. I am very much still trying to sort myself out, so I thank you most sincerely.

The fear exercise was for me, I believe, a turning point in the weekend, although I've only been able to see just how upon later reflection. But there are so many factors that I am sure have contributed to the total effect they were able to make on my mind, to their own selfish ends.

What you say about the prolonged staring makes sense, and I think the reason I hadn't considered it is because it was one of the more pleasant experiences for me at the time, in comparison to some of the other exercises. And I've heard many people say similar things, that it was their favorite part of the weekend (I think that one's in the Advanced Course though? .. admittedly those two weekends though separated by months in my own life are still a bit of a blur in total), which would seem to uniquely position it to go more unnoticed for its contribution to ill effects.

Something else that especially affected me which is also related to "fight or flight" is the sheer volume of people in the room while yet behaving in a non-private manner about very private things, which I believe is wholly unnatural and an abbreviator to the natural instinct to protect oneself. For me, all these things did indeed abbreviate those instincts (to some extent) while I was there, but they have also, unfortunately, thus far left me with a PTSD experience whereby I am continuously afraid of perceived aggression and invasion of privacy since, regardless of the level of conscious awareness I may have at a given time, of reasons I don't need to be fearful at all.

I think it's everything that they barrage people with though, everything that they do in tandem, with the tandemness of it being the problem. Their expertise at continuously overloading the mind with multiple processing problems and conflicts at once, all while doing things to abbreviate healthy reflexes AND while in a bizarrely contrived social setting, is just more than the mind can handle. And while the mind is trying to handle what it can't, it's easily receiving the messages they are really there to deliver.

I only wish my ability to understand it all now was equal to an ability to heal from it, which as yet I am unfortunately still very much struggling with.

"the terror of nothingness, the horror vacui, is a dark night of the soul that must be avoided at all costs."

Something I read recently in delving into post-structuralist theory (from Saints and Postmodernism: Revisioning Moral Philosophy by Edith Wyschogrod). Which I don't at all recommend be done by anyone hoping to recover from the scars of Landmark, as its theorems bear frightening accuracy in their confirmation of the true depth of the spirit and hence of spiritual injury that can occur. Landmark's maxim that everything is meaningless and nothingness might be harmless enough as a mere line in a book or comment in a conversation, but as a drilled reality it's extremely dangerous. I know this simply because of its effect on me. It's the strangest experience to be the vessel for thoughts that haven't originated in oneself; it's an experience which is in itself alienating, and for me has created a self-fulfilling prophecy, re-fueling itself unfettered by interruption.

I was actually always fairly fearless, before I went to Landmark. Having been through some unusually traumatic experiences extremely early on in my life, I believe I had somewhat organically learned to do without fear. By opening up something I had put away a very long time ago, it would seem they have left me with an unfortunate lack of recourse, as there is little I can to do assuage fears I put away long before I had even language in which to frame them.

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Re: How To Undo The Psychological Damage? (Landmark) (Please Help)
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: May 14, 2014 10:28PM

The LGAT set up is a double whammy

* Affects your mind

* Affects your **body**

And this impact on body often goes unnoticed, because one is
seduced into making sense of the mental riddles.

* Staring exercise -- arousal of fight/flight response

* Chairs set together -- disrupts normal boundaries.

* Homework assignments that reportedly cut into time needed for sleep,
resulting in sleep deprivation

There are claims that est and its current version, Landmark, are influenced by Zen.

I beg to differ.

Let us look at the context in which a zen retreat takes place.

We have uniformity in some things. No perfume, and we are requested to wear dark
clothing, with no text on it.

Zen retreats are not times of sensory bombardment. Quite the contrary. Most of the time, we stare at a blank wall and count our breaths. We do this to create a condition in which our own inner processes become more accessible. No one else's material is forced into us.

Zafu cushions at our Zen Center are set 24 inches apart. )I once went to the zendo and measured the distances between cushions with a ruler) Compare this with reports of how closely chairs are set together at Landmark and other LGATs.

And during intensive Zen retreats (at least at our center),

1) You have your assigned space in the hall and keep it throughout the retreat, though in some cases, you may have a different space for meal times.

*You can adjust your cushion if you need to do so.

2) You have your own eating utensils (known as an oryoki set) which you keep near your cushion. You use that same set during the entire retreat. have something personal, your own, that you keep under your own control. No one is ever supposed to touch your utensils or your personal space during the

3) During work practice period during retreats, participants are assigned tasks. So we clean and maintain the same space we practice in. That gives us ownership of the practice space. A team of people do not clean up after us.

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Re: How To Undo The Psychological Damage? (Landmark) (Please Help)
Posted by: healed ()
Date: May 15, 2014 01:16AM

I agree with Corboy...

@Mood Crisis - If you were to write a list of all that goes on within Landmark, I think you'd be able to see the psychological damage right there...I think/hope you'd also see that your reaction to it is totally normal and appropriate, but that it may just take some time to adjust to reality again.

Things that go on there that are wholly abnormal/inappropriate
1) sensory deprivation - no lights in the room, low temperature, lack of sleep etc affects the body and mind. lose sense of time and bearings. can start to feel like you are jet-lagged. Can change internal body clock.

2) sitting very close to others - invasion of boundaries/privacy, discomfort, enhances the sense that you are all a group rather than individuals, makes group bonding much easier than it would otherwise.

3) being talked at by one person for hours at a time - totally unnatural, shuts down your mind, feeling of being bombarded. You can end up internalizing their voice too.

4) not knowing what's going to happen during the course - so constantly being led and being in the control of the 'leader', often caught off-guard/surprised, but without knowing exactly where it's all going to lead

5) extreme catharsis - people relieving terrible personal, vulnerable moments. While at the time this can seem ok, afterwards often leaves a strange feeling

6) implanted/false memories - they tell you that certain things happened to you at certain ages don't even have time to fact check this, so brain shuts down. You also start to feel sad if you believe what they say about your life

7) Their mishmash of philosophies taken from lots of different places, taken out of context and which together make little, if any, sense. This causes confusion

8) Their insistence that life is empty and meaningless etc etc - definitely can cause extreme reactions.

9) Their total abuse of the English language/grammar - language and thought are closely interlinked. By misusing language in the way landmark does, this scrambles your brain

10) covert use of NLP and hypnosis - again, subliminal messages are picked up by your body but may take a while for your mind to wrap itself around this

11) information overload - your mind doesn't even have the opportunity to process all of this new and convoluted information, becomes exhausted and critical thinking capacities are reduced/shut off totally.

and so on and so forth...

What has helped me with my recovery is a lot of research/reading - understanding where landmark got it methods from, the philosophies (e.g. lots of heidegger influences in landmark; absurdism; existentialism;nihilism; existential pessism - things that I had previously never even heard of!! etc). Understanding its affiliation with scientology, getting to the roots of who exactly werner erhard is and his background.

Also strangely, listening to news/information that runs counter to my usual way of thinking actually has made my brain have to work hard to process it and this seems to have helped get past landmark's stuff. I've just made sure to jump start my brain in any way possible. Have also found that listening to relaxing piano music - or any music without words - has made a difference. Plus talking to people as much as possible so I can hear my own voice and my own thoughts again.

Keep on ... you will get better.

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