There is older info in this article from Mother Jones on Werner Erhard, where they try to look at how the money was moved around.
There is an actual little chart somewhere that someone made up too...

These days this is now all down to a science. They hire an expert, and pay the expert a lot of money to run the money through the system templates, using many different companies, some in different countries, and even non-profit entities, and family members, asset protection trusts, and who knows what.
A family name that keeps coming up for James Ray is his brother...

Jon C Ray, J&J INVESTMENTS UNLIMITED, LLC [forum.culteducation.com]

Search Google for:

"Jon C. Ray"
"Jon Ray"

It looks like James RAy brother Jon Ray is into real esate investing.

World Wealth Society | Member Directory [worldwealthsociety.com]
JCR Investments / Jon Ray Home Remodeling
Real Estate Investments/Home Remodeling
Contact: Cynthia Ray
Contact: Jon Ray
www.jonray-homes.com


Jon Ray facebook [www.facebook.com]











_________QUOTE__________________
[www.culteducation.com]
Where Erhard Launders the Money

Trying to trace the flow of money through Werner Erhard's est operation is a bit like watching the flight of a golf ball on television. The commentator excitedly shouts "There it goes!" but all you can see is an endless fairway and trees waving in the wind.

In Erhard's case, the grass and trees that have swallowed up the golf ball are provided chiefly by Harry Margolis, a skillful California lawyer who has improbably combined a leftist past, an enthusiasm for est and an expertise in the arcane and lucrative field of offshore tax shelters.

After examining many documents and interviewing many sources, Mother Jones has pieced together the following picture of the complex financial shell Margolis has built for est:

Erhard Seminars Training, Inc. (EST – the use of the lower case came later) was born late in 1971, when Margolis changed the name of Saratoga Restaurant Equipment, a corporation in his office, to EST.

As EST was being formed, Erhard sold, for a promise of $1 million, what he called his "body of knowledge" to Presentaciones Musicales, S.A. (PMSA), a Panamanian corporation, whose nature, musical or otherwise, remains hidden behind the Panamanian secrecy-in-business laws designed to attract U.S. investors. EST then turned around and paid PMSA $1.2 million for the license to that body of knowledge for ten years.

What's known of PMSA's recent history leads to Margolis. Everyone Mother Jones could find who was associated with recent PMSA activities was a Margolis employee.

Another oddity: EST originally had no money to pay PMSA for the license on the body of knowledge. To get the money, EST borrowed $1 million from a Nevada corporation named International Aesthetics Limited (IAL), and sold IAL $200,000 worth of EST stock.

What kind of a company would loan $1 million and invest $200,000 in EST, a then brand-new firm with no success record, no money, no assets and no collateral except an intention to buy a license to use Erhard's knowledge? Again, the answer leads back to Harry Margolis. All IAL officers and directors worked out of Margolis' office

This complicated series of paper shuffles created important tax benefits for Erhard. In selling the body of knowledge to PMSA as a capital asset, Erhard could claim that PMSA's million dollar promise was "capital gain," rather than ordinary income. Under U.S. tax laws of the time, only half of the $1 million would be as taxable gain. And by receiving a promise to be paid over ten years instead of $1 million cash, Erhard could have the money trickle in slowly enough to avoid placing himself in higher tax brackets.

Did that $1 million really exist somewhere, or did Margolis construct an empty prefabricated tax shelter for a million dollars Erhard hoped to collect in future years from people who took his training?
...
Now, our invisible golf ball suddenly bounces off in a different direction. Perhaps Margolis felt shaky about his prospects of winning a case involving a body of knowledge no one could see, touch, patent or copyright. Or, perhaps, EST income had just outgrown the million-dollar shelter. Whatever the reason, Margolis has created a brand-new set of corporations to house Erhard's empire. Four months after the IRS began asking for back taxes, public documents recorded the creation of "est, an Educational Corporation" – a for-profit California business, owned by Werner Erhard Charitable Settlement – a tax-exempt trust on the Isle of Jersey. Any est profits flow to Jersey, after the government diverts 30 percent to the U.S. treasury.

But 30 percent s a big dip. So est the second, like EST the first, shows a paltry profit, when it shows one at all. How can est avoid showing a profit when we know 161,395 people have taken Werner Erhard's training, now selling at $300 a shot? A good question. The answer s that before reporting any income, est pays for the use of Erhard's "knowledge." That knowledge has now found its way from Panama to its current owner, Welbehagen, B.V., a Dutch corporation. Est pays royalties to Welbehagen for using the body of knowledge, while Welbehagen pays only 7 percent in Dutch taxes. Then, all Welbehagen's after-tax profits go to the Werner Erhard Foundation for est, which s headquartered in Switzerland.

Just how much may be piling up in Switzerland is hard to say, since Swiss tax returns are private. Available documents show that through April 30, 1973, EST, in its first corporate incarnation, paid out nearly $300,000 in "interest" and "amortization." How much of that – or whether all of that – went to Welbehagen, the Swiss foundation or Erhard, no one knows.

During the first six months of est's reborn corporate existence, revenues through February of 1976 totaled almost $6 million. Nearly one-fourth was reported to have been paid out in "interest" and "amortization."

Income and expense figures since March of 1976 are unavailable.

What of Erhard's first million? PMSA no longer owes it, since Erhard cancelled the contract without payment in 1975. Last year, at Margolis' trial, Erhard couldn't remember whether he was still owed the million dollars.
____________________________________

I had a good read of that Mother Jones article which certainly seems to illustrate what I understand of the complexity of the way shell companies are set up to launder and hide assets. I expect that Death Ray has a similar if less complex set-up in place.

Incidentally, the Hunger Project is still operating with some very prestigious names attached. Some years ago I was invited to use a Hunger Project screen as a homepage and to click on a button to provide a meal for a hungry person each day. I couldn't figure out where the money came from to pay for the meal so concluded it was some kind of scam and dumped it. It was some time later that I heard of the Erhardt connection and that this was the same Hunger Project recruiting front still operating in the internet age.

It is a worry that such established figures are connected to and endorsing Werners private retirement fund.

It is very likely that James Ray financial system is more sophisticated that Werner Erhards in that article, as that was from years ago. They have really refined these techniques, and all it takes is a meeting with experts in the field, which are referred by others.
For example, James Ray could have simply hired the same financial experts that Tony Robbins or others use. And again, those are the legal methods of asset protection.
Perhaps money got funnelled into the real estate investment company of his brother?
Who knows, only experts can figure that out.



One interesting follow up point.
There is a picture on the Droid site, at a James Ray seminar. Modern Magick [saltydroid.info]
Some have commented that is looks like the set is bigger than the audience, and that the room is not full.

Sorry to be contrary, but that is not correct, and is a mistake.
That is deliberate and very very carefully designed and planned. There are no empty seats, that could be a "sold out" seminar.
These are not the giant LGAT's, but the smaller ones, even the biggest LGAT seminar Gurus also have more exclusive smaller LGAT seminars with a few hundred people, sometimes even less, as it creates more intimacy and power, for one-to-one upselling. Those seminars are CRAWLING with sales people, there could be more than 20 salespeople there.
There are 7 rows of people, with more than 25 across. So that is over 200 people.
That is an ideal turnout for that kind of seminar.
If the ticket was a mere $1000, that is 200K, plus much more in upselling.

Modern Magick is listed at $5,695 a person. With 200 people that is 1.2 million dollars on tickets. The "staff" is not paid, that all goes to James Ray's companies. They also upsell the hell out of people, and they spend thousands more.
So its a bad bad mistake to think that seminar is undersold, it is not. Its sold-out. They keep the numbers in a couple of hundred people on purpose, so they can be more personal with people, and move them to the next level of seminars, coaching, and money extraction.

Note that the majority of the audience are women. Also note the rapt attention James Ray is able to create, with the intent focus of EVERYONE in that audience except one person.
Many of those people are in deep trance states right in that photo. [saltydroid.info] Notice how James Ray is relaxed, leaning forward..he is doing trance induction and group conversational hypnosis and persuasion at that moment.

The images and the set-up are PRECISE. There are large screens on both sides just out of the image, which are designed for powerful persuasion purposes, of course. The same way they have huge images in Times Square, for persuasion power.
That is not expensive, its just a projection sheet and some very bright lights. The entire set-up is paid for by a couple tickets!

There is a rope barrier at the front of the stage that seperates James Ray from the audience, which is deliberate to keep people away from him, to make him seem more elevated and VIP.

James Ray is playing to the sun image with the caption, "The Dreamer and The Dream" which is related to a powerful hypnotic technique he does in his seminars.
[James Ray Modern Magick hand-staring fractionation technique] [forum.culteducation.com]

Also notice his last name is RAY and he uses the image of the sun all the time, as in a Ray of light.
But he also plays to the "dark side", with the image of the moon and Modern Magick. This is the beginning of where many of Death Ray's senior followers get lured to the dark side, he is pitching it already at that seminar.
Its not about Black Magick, its about creating deep trance-states in people. You go into the mythological "content" mumbo-jumbo just to create TRANCE, which makes people highly suggestible. Its very unfortunate that most people don't know that. Its a basic technique.

For those who have studied these methods for quite some time, that setup at the photo above is extremely professional and powerful.
James Ray contructed a very focussed and powerful group hypnosis and persuasion "chamber" right in the hotel ballroom. The seating is contained DELIBERATELY, notice every chair is touching the other chair. There are no empty seats, people are DELIBERATELY crammed together like sardines, like they were in the death lodge.
You can't sit at the back of the room, and put your feet up, or go get a coffee. You are locked into that group seating structure, and can't get out of your row without disrupting everyone, so people don't leave. Sound familiar?
If you tried to go to the bathroom or use the phone, you would be met at the back of the room by someone like Megan and given the 3rd degree about what you were doing. These people understand all of these techniques, which have been around for decades.

Its a very bad mistake to underestimate these seminar Gurus like James Arthur Ray. James Ray didn't think ANY of that up at all.
The guy COPIED (in NLP, modeled) the top LGAT seminar people in the world who have refined these LGAT hypnosis techniques to the highest levels.

Obviously he would also COPY their financial systems behind the seminars too.

In NLP they have what is called modeling, which just means COPYING.
James Ray copied the most powerful LGAT techniques on earth, which were developed by others, but can be copied. He also would have copied their financials, as can be seen in what has happened.

The people walking into that Modern Magick deep influence hypnosis chamber don't stand a chance with that set-up. They are trapped, as they don't know what is happening to them. For someone with training in this area, you would NEVER get into that sardine can set-up, being bombarded with visual and audio for days at a time, with sleep and food deprivation, room temperature, conversational hypnosis and the other 100 techniques, done in precise order.

At best, you would sit at the back, out of the group, making notes, taking breaks on your own schedule. But they WILL NOT ALLOW that in these highly organized LGATs. They force you to comply and sit where they force you to sit, and do what they tell you to do, or they will KICK YOU OUT, and make an example of you in front of the group.
They don't care, you ain't gonna get a refund, no matter what they say about refunds. Try to get a refund for an LGAT seminar these days, its almost impossible they have so many tricks in the contracts.

James Ray precisely copied and refined the most effective and powerful LGAT seminar techniques in the industry from others who had designed and tested them for decades.
Of course he also copied and modeled their financial protection techniques, to make certain the millions were instantly drained and protected, simply by hiring the same experts used by others.

Slightly off-topic, but related.

I read somewhere (blogcomment on Droid, I think) that Tony Robbins lost $400 million dollars in 2 years. I have not been able to verify this. Can someone point me to some evidence?

The person who wrote the comment seemed to have a good understanding of LGATs; good enough to know the difference between "lost" and "caused to disappear".

I want to repost this link as there are two more interview transcripts posted, one from the guy who burned his hand, Lou Caci and one from a Native American water-pourer for the expert view:

tommcfeeley.com

An Arizona Star article on the lesser crimes:

arizona star

I'm posting things here that are available elsewhere just to keep the main points of the story together in this thread.

Yes, those comments about how Tony Robbins runs his business in the Droid comments by "I've seen Robbins' books" [saltydroid.info] are very accurate.
Obviously written by someone who had a peek behind the curtain, which is very rare.
The comments above that again miss the point that they deliberately keep their businesses at break even or in the hole without assets. That is intentional, all the assets get drained to other businesses and entities, estates, trusts, private islands, or whatever.


But Robbins was part of a Dot-Con company that went public, and it ballooned up, and then crashed and went bankrupt. Can't think of the name of that stupid company at the moment, but when it went under it has almost ZERO sales and was some type of scamola.
ah yes, the company was Dreamlife.com [www.nytimes.com]

Knowing how these guys operate, you can be certain that ZERO of their money went into the company using OPM, so the "400 million" would be on paper, and would have to be verified. Also rest assured that plenty was drained out of the company on "executive salaries" for the bigshots before it crashed, and its the investors that got burned.

Always remember, these guys make up Stories for a living, so basically every word they say publically has to be cross-checked against the facts, as its all a form of propaganda.
He uses it as a Story to brag about his riches, and to spin-doctor the past. Many people lost a lot of money on that scamola, and perhaps by saying he lost more than others he hopes to use "contrast" on them.
A lot of people got burned on that one, just add them to the long list.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/23/2010 05:58AM by The Anticult.

Hate to be psychic, but here it is in the NYT, this is how these guys play ball.
No money down, OPM, balloon it up, cash-out, rape and pillage, take the money and run.
Rinse and repeat.
After you have seen this 100x it becomes a little predictable as a business model.

[www.nytimes.com]
"Dreamlife began its life as a publicly traded company last year through a complex and unusual deal. In what is known as a reverse merger, Mr. Robbins struck an agreement in April to turn a little-known developer of high-technology cancer treatments called GHS into his Internet venture. In exchange for his participation, Mr. Robbins and other investors received 30 million new shares in GHS, which at the time had just seven million shares. With 23 million shares himself, Mr. Robbins took control of the company. GSH then spun off its old assets into a new company called U.S. NeuroSurgical, and changed its name to Dreamlife in November. The transaction had the effect of putting Dreamlife shares in public hands while bypassing the traditional scrutiny of a stock offering in filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission.
At the same time, Dreamlife worked with Allen & Company, a boutique investment bank known for its media company clients, to sell $15 million of stock to a small group of wealthy investors at a 40 percent discount to the price then being paid by the public. The shares, which were issued as preferred but converted to common stock in September, were sold at the equivalent of $9 a common share, when the public price was $16.625."
...
Even by the standards of Internet companies, Dreamlife is unusual. The company has no sales, much less profits. In the three months ended Sept. 30, Dreamlife lost $3.2 million on revenue of $155,000, all from interest on its bank accounts. "



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/23/2010 06:09AM by The Anticult.

The endless string of very badly told and revolting lies and spin-doctoring told by Josh continues in the article below.
Notice how after appearing on Oprah, the James Ray seminar went from a dozen people, to 60 participants. That is 50 more people x $10,000 each = an additional $500,000 from one single event, thanks to Oprah promoting James Ray and The Secret.

They deliberately sent people out in the desert to dehydrate them to very dangerous and lethal levels, then to rapidly overhydrate them to make them sick, then to overheat them again. It was all done deliberately to attempt to manufacture a traumatic near-death experience, with risks of DEATH for some of them. Read James Ray own disclaimer where that is admitted in the death clause. [forum.culteducation.com]

The accomplisses and liars trying to cover up for James Ray also need to be held responsible.
The amount of lies coming from the Megan-Josh axis is beyond revolting and is pathological. For their own reasons, they chose to cross over to the "dark side" of the black arts of group persuasion and exploitation.

James Ray Death Lodge interview: Josh Fredrickson part 3 [www.examiner.com]

Quote
The Anticult
Hate to be psychic, but here it is in the NYT, this is how these guys play ball.
No money down, OPM, balloon it up, cash-out, rape and pillage, take the money and run.
Rinse and repeat.
After you have seen this 100x it becomes a little predictable as a business model.

Ah, yes...the old "business model" that helped with the Dot.Bomb crash. I believe it is refered to as "Churn and Burn" (talk up an investment on multiple sites, get excitment going, then sell your entire portfolio and let the suckers get burned)