Quote
rrmoderator
Just seems foolish nothing sinister.

Perhaps on the surface. But not when one looks deeper...

[www.nhne.com]

"While many of the central elements of Twyman's story may have come from and/or been strongly influenced by ENDEAVOR, the name of the Emissaries themselves may have been lifted from another group. Twyman mentions this other group, "Emissaries of Divine Light," in his book, but acts as if he has just been introduced to them. What he fails to mention, and what former associates of his have told us, is that Twyman also spent some time with them, apparently while writing his book. If this is true, there is very little about Twyman's book that is original: It draws its philosophy from A Course in Miracles, it mission, enlightened-group metaphor, and evangelical approaches from ENDEAVOR, and its name from the Emissaries of Divine Light."

And who are the Emissaries of Divine Light? This is from a testimonial by two former female members of the cult.

[www.factnet.org]

Excerpts:
…..Nancy: There was a changeover in leadership in December, 1987. Leader Martin Exeter (an Englishman formerly known as Martin Cecil) died, and his son, Michael, took over. Michael Exeter was installed as the third bishop of the Church of the Emissaries of Divine Light. By inheritance in British lineage, Exeter and his wife, Nancy, became Lord and Lady Exeter. This position gave Exeter a seat in Parliament in the House of Lords. Prior to inheriting this title, his last name was Burghley, and prior to any of these titles the family name was Cecil (pronounced "sissal").
….Classes for training and indoctrination are held at regional centers. Besides Sunrise Ranch and 100 Mile House, the regional centers are Glen Ivy in Corona, California (which runs a locally famous spa),
…Sexual abuses and cover-up's were made public during the first "open" council (described earlier). Exeter and his wife denied knowing about the abuses, though I personally knew two people who had informed them in writing about particular abuses. Women have told me they were seduced, coerced, threatened, and even stalked by men in leadership positions. They have told me about sexual abuse of children. I have heard that in central and eastern regions of the U.S., teenagers were forced to lose their virginity to their group leaders, with the explanation that this guaranteed a spiritually sound beginning to their sex life. I don't know if this was done in all regions and in Canada. In classes people were taught that women were "more fallen" than men, and the only way they could regain spiritual purity was to "share their man." In this way, "triangles" (one man and two women or more in the case of the Exeters) were encouraged at middle and upper management levels. According to doctrine, not only did it "handle and protect" the man's spiritual expression, but it spiritually purified the women. All top hierarchical relationships were threesomes, with the third partner sometimes changing periodically. The third woman usually played the role of the secretary.
I was told by a woman that she, and others, acted as "spiritual prostitutes" for men who "needed to work out sexual problems." She said she chose to do so, but since one was always under the obligation to "agree" with one's group leader, choices were not actually possible. [see doctrine of "upward response" under One Law, below]
Besides the view of women as "more fallen," there were a number of Emissary tenets which made abuse easy for cult leaders to do, and difficult for others to stop. Most of these are included in the Specific Doctrine section below.
Classes also implanted beliefs that made abuse easy. For example, a videotape of Martin Exeter in one of the advanced classes advocated masturbation "if it served the Lord." Exeter said the way to make it do that was to imagine he (Exeter) was your partner. This set you up for sexual coercion from cult leaders.

And more from another report...

[www.sunriseranch.org]

( continued testimony excerpted from two links above, not sunrise ranch page)

…The rest of us did all the work required to provide a home for 125 people: cooking, cleaning, reception, office, accounting, gardening (vegetables and herbs), landscaping, construction, repair, machinery (everything from furnaces to industrial kitchen equipment to cars and tractors), day care, management. 100 Mile also did transcriptions of weekly services and published other materials. Most people began their assigned work at 9:00 and worked until noon, when we all had lunch together. Some went back to work at 12:30 cleaning up after lunch; others began again at 1:00. The more physically strenuous jobs ended at 4:00; lighter jobs went on until 5:00, and day care until parents got home. Nearly all these jobs went on 6 days a week. On Sundays, "work pattern" was "voluntary": you were supposed to sign up to work three Sundays out of four. Many Sunday shifts were short. In addition, there were large organic gardens. In harvest season we were often asked to pitch in for early morning, evening or Sunday harvests, and throughout the day for canning, shelling, snapping, etc. of produce. [See below for other required duties.]
Dinner was communal except for Tuesday nights, when it was officially sanctioned for families to pick up their food and eat at home together, and Friday nights when everyone picked up their food to take home.
There were horses and cows, pigs, chickens and goats, and at certain times we were surrounded with chicks, kids, foals, piglets and calves, in a gorgeous rural setting. There was a grassy play space in the center of the community, often filled with volleyball games, a trampoline, hockey goalposts or other games, adults and children. There were swings and climbing things, forest trails, a marshy bird sanctuary, and cross-country skiing right out our back doors. There was a swimming pool, sauna, and a very modern performance hall with video and sound equipment and a state-of-the-art organ synthesizer.
Sometimes I would walk through the community and it was such an idyllic scene children laughing, people playing volleyball together, a work party, or just people going about their business there was such an appearance of joy, safety and sense of family, that I felt I had finally found Utopia. The land and lifestyle seemed heartbreakingly beautiful and I was filled with Thanksgiving that I lived there. I had always yearned for a community like this.
When I knew the program was rotten at the core, when I knew I was leaving, these scenes of such beauty and apparent love were among the most difficult things to give up.
Nancy: I have to admit there are elements of this kind of lifestyle I miss. To be so consumed with purpose felt good! Knowing your neighbors, sharing a common goal, performing simple tasks side by side, having daily schedules planned for you. The ambiguities, isolation, and independence of modern adult life weren't there. Enforced dependence didn't seem bad.
Barbara: I loved not having to do everything myself someone else took care of the cars, equipment, snow plowing, shopping, cooking, and much more.
We were all considered "church volunteers," receiving a place to live (ranging from a bedroom with shared kitchen and bathroom facilities for most single people, to sumptuous homes for those high in the hierarchy), board, and a monthly stipend of $250 Canadian dollars. Out of this stipend had to come everything else you needed. You could petition the Finance Committee for money for things, such as a trip, buying clothes, having dental work done, and so on. If you got it or not, or how much you got, was supposedly democratic, but people in power positions got more.
Nancy: During my time at Lake Rest and Clear Water, the monthly stipend was $35 to $50. Sometimes there was no stipend. We were even encouraged to make a donation to Sunrise Ranch out of that money. No medical or dental care was provided, even for children, unless life was threatened, which on at least two occasions while I was there, it was. And during that time a million dollar jet was purchased for Martin Exeter.
….Barbara: I was told it was vital to confide everything about my life, including my finances and sexual life. At first it was spelled out completely, to whom I was to tell what. Later the instructions were revised and one could communicate to anyone "upwards." After that I discovered that reports were written about us locally and sent to regional coordinators, who then reported to Exeter. Class faculties also wrote reports about each student. I don't know if these practices continue.

Dahn Hak, Neale Walsch, and James Tywman.

[www.rumormillnews.com]

On March 3, 2003, James Twyman, Neale Donald Walsch and others will join Dr. Ilchi Lee, the creator of Dahn Hak, to dedicate the University for Peace in Seoul, South Korea. (The University of Peace is an affiliate of the United Nations.) On that same day, at exactly 3:33 PM wherever you are, millions of people around the world will join together in praying the "Declaration of Humanity" written by Dr. Lee. The prayer will be recited every hour as we move from one time zone to another, blanketing the whole world in Peace.

Only a few weeks ago, James Twyman led a peace mission to Israel and millions joined him in Praying Peace for the Middle East. Scientists were on hand to measure the impact of the vigil, and their studies show that violent incidents in Israel decreased 50% or more the next day. We will employ the same technology again, and we KNOW that the results will be the same for Korea. Peace Prevails in Korea and all the world because we have the power to make it so.

(For the 100,000 people who participated in the Spoonbenders Course, simply follow the instructions we used for the Great Experiment before praying the Declaration of Humanity.)

Quote

"Do you have any concrete evidence to show that the indigo movement is similar to Hitler, the Third Reich, or is attempting to create a "master race"?"

There is no nefarious ruler or group behind the Indigo Child movement; it's not a unified movement, so there is no "Hitler." There might end up being some individual "Hitlers" luring parents, or teenagers and young adults into cult-like and/or money-sucking situations, attracted by the idea that they, or their kids, are saviors in need of special training or guidance.

I read a post from someone talking about a woman she encountered on an Indigo list who had lured her into a controlling situation - for the Indigo cause, and trying to get her to send her money. I read a post by a distraught mother who said her ADHD child was lured away by a family who convinced the girl she was Indigo and had to stop taking her ADHD medication. I can imagine some vulnerable kids/teens/adults/parents falling for the false sense of royalty and superiority afforded by the Indigo movement. Many of the kids/teens identifying with this movement are not particularly bright, but rather gullible and credulous, and they love the idea that they are really smarter than everyone else, superior to all the authorities around them.

I think that some of the descriptions of Indigo children floating around are uncomfortably similar to Hitler's ideas of a master race: the idea that some children are born superior to others, that they have different and better DNA, they are a master "race"; some have said that Indigo children are recognizable by their blue eyes. Some Indigo Child pushers say these children have super-immunity to disease and paranormal powers. Some descriptions make Indigo children sound psychopathic (no guilt, no conscience) and their violent behavior justified as part of their mission to destroy faulty systems.

([weblogs.freespeech.org])

I don't see any self-esteem benefits to a child/teen/adult, whether gifted or displaying AD/HD, autism, or a conduct disorder, in believing that they are misunderstood saviors with supernatural powers on a divine mission to bring a new world order even if through disruptive or violent behavior. That's not confidence; that's delusional.

Neale Donald Walsch is a close affiliate of Ilchi Seung Heun Lee; Walsch has published some of Lee's books (Hampton House), and they work together on projects and endorse each other's activites. James Twyman and Walsch are also closely affiliated, making the Indigo movie together and endorsing each other. Twyman has used Ilchi Lee's services to "train" children in "Brain Respiration" to suddenly become psychic, spoonbenders. Ilchi Lee was in Twyman's latest Indigo documentary.

Hi Everyone,

I just stumbled across this forum and found this interesting discussion on indigos. I'm the first to say that none of us can truly *know* anything until the day we "expire", or maybe we don't know it then, maybe we cease to exist and there is nothing. I don't claim to know. I think we all come up with our own truth...

But that said, I do believe I'm very likely this thing called "indigo". When I first heard about it, I didn't think "Wow, maybe I'm one!" I thought about people I'd known and not until much later did it occur to me to that it applied to me more than anyone else I knew. This didn't come from a place of ego.

I've done a great deal of soul-searching and self-analysis in my 39 years and I've found time and time again that it's really easy to generalize. *My* truth is that I can usually find wisdom nearly anywhere. I find the real danger is swallowing any belief system whole. I really resonate with the indigo information but I also can completely understand why it might appear to be an invention of indulging parents and indulged children. It's unfortunate that whenever any kind of new concept emerges in human evolution, there is always the group who holds it up like badge of honor, infuses the ideas with all kinds of judgement and distorts it with ego. And that understandably alienates those who don't resonate with it, creating all sorts of ugly us/them stuff. Things like this will always be a magnet for narcissists -- that's just par for the course. I'll say it...the Jenny McCarthy site makes me want to throw up too.

For the record, I wasn't indulged as a child. I was allowed to question, but I was disciplined, I was occasionally spanked. I had chores. I went to church most Sundays. I was never homeschooled. My father was a teacher and later a professor of education and a big defender of public education.

I was well-socialized and always got along well with other children. I was always well-liked. But I always felt different and my parents saw it in me also, as did friends of my parents. I was very comfortable with adults. I was uniquely sensitive, emotionally and physically, and I still am. When my dad was helping my sister with her math problem in the other room and I wasn't even really listening I would shout out the answer, thinking I was just being funny, and it would be right. I had perfect pitch. I was extremely conscientious. I would have to go home if the teacher was publicly humiliating someone *else* in my class. I prefered to read books about spirituality and was very interested in political systems and other adult topics early in elementary school. I was hyper at times but didn't have attention problems. Yes, my father would have to take my mom to the local cafe and draw her pie charts about the developmental needs of children to keep her from strangling me at times because I had so much energy, but I wasn't badly behaved, just always in motion, endlessly curious and always asking questions.

As I grew older I seemed to just know certain things. I would dream about world events before they happened. I knew my car had been stolen when I was in college and away on break, three states away, and the phone would ring and it was the police saying they found it in an intersection. Then I started noticing I knew what people looked like before I met them, if I had just heard of them by name or talked on the phone. I knew what strangers were feeling, what their fears were, what they needed, so I started feeling overwhelmed in crowds.

I felt 9/11 coming for a few years before it happened. I thought I was seeing my own death....on an aircraft, slamming into something. I'd made peace with the idea that that that's how I was going to exit. But the week before 9/11 I could hardly get in a moving vehicle. The day before I sat at my mailbox, one foot in the car, one out, feeling like I had a 50/50 chance of getting home from the post office alive. I felt the intense slamming sensation so vividly that I could hardly think of anything else. I stayed up all night the night before and remember sitting at my computer and looking out at the darkness and at one point said *out loud* "What is going on...." After 9/11 I never had the sensation again.

As I get older I do seem to be experiencing what many describe as the crystaline characteristics. I have come to love silence. I don't have a cell phone and am very sensitive to the sounds of ringing phones and I don't even own an alarm clock. I've completely lost the desire to eat anything unhealthy. (I had food allergies from the age of 5, and went into anaphylactic shock several times at about that age as a result of food reactions. Every parakeet we got died during that time also and we'd just moved into a new house so -- canary in the cave -- I think I was as sensitive as the parakeet to the off-gassing and that's what was causing my immune problems when everyone else in the family was ok.) I can't tolerate scented products at all now, they smell *so* strong to me I can't even walk down the laundry aisle at the store. I don't use dryer sheets or wear perfume and can't stand in line near someone who does.

I don't think indigos are special. I think they are simply more awake to human potential, to a potential everyone has and that, *I* think, is why they are here. I didn't even know I could do half of the stuff I can, until I decided, just for fun, to try. Think you can't do remote viewing? Try it!

We *are* system busters. I was the child who stood up to teachers, not a lot, but on a few choice occasions in face of what I saw, and any sane adult would see, as injustice, and each time I got an apology. I wasn't a rebel. I was tactful and direct. I called them on their crap and they said "You're right."

I can pick out young indigos very easily and they seem to know me. After a few decades of feeling different I feel more at home in this world because they are here now too. They approach me fearlessly in supermarkets and parks, and we have a conversation, like we've known each other forever, and they walk off. These things didn't happen to me until recently, the last several years. Before I even heard about indigos I was wondering what was going on because this was happening a lot. And as strange as it was it also felt very normal so I was really baffled.

No, there is no proof. But if you look at the evolution of man (and woman) ;) you see that the only constant is change. New ways perceiving, new ways of thinking, one generation after the next, one century after the next. How many pioneers were scoffed at....It's a given. And kudos to the scoffers as they keep the equalibrium -- even when they scoff at truth. The cynics keep the naricissist and the delusional in check. And sometimes the cynics are right. I also believe that in many ways right now, mankind is devolving, which is perhaps why they are here. God or no God, indigos and no indigos, wsee in nature that it has a way of balancing itself out, so are these energies the balance for other energies? Perhaps.

Now...as for the Azuritites and Keylonic Science..... I was led to these folks by a guy I met in another online forum. I resonated with much of the information there -- much of their message but I didn't not resonate with Anna/Ashayana or the other "speakers" at ALL and truly believe that KS is a cult. Maybe Ashayana has some abilities, insight etc...but all it took was one look at her photo and I knew she was bad news. I noticed early on that expressing that you've had a similar experience as Ash gets you ignored and expressing any kind of doubt tags you as having been influenced by "lower frequency energies" and consequently "compromising the frequency of the list", which means your post is removed and your posts suddenly start showing up delayed as they await "approval" by the moderator who is also one of the "speakers". You don't have to be member of Mensa to be creeped out by the photos of everyone wearing white at gatherings either. "Word on the street" is that Anna/Ash first declared she'd been told by the Guardians she was meant to be with Phil, then evidently they changed their minds as she left him and married hubby #3? I think? And that she absconded with the money from the Sarasota, FL headquarters of KS and fled to England. She also I hear shows up at gatherings only late on the last night, and just for a few hours. Not exactly a hands-on "speaker". Evidently you have to arrange travel to the meetings through their travel service which allows them to pocket the difference on discounted fares.

Ash teaches that lower frequency energies work by keeping you "horizontal" giving you busy work -- making money, repairing the house after bad weather etc..., so you don't have time and energy to focus on anything else. Ironically, (!), Keylonic Science with all it's technical language, and techniques is one of the most time consuming belief systems I've ever found. I takes a committment of many hours each day. Memorizing songs in an ancient language, meditation techniques that are lengthy and very specific...it's incredibly stressful -- add to that the stress that if you don't activate the DNA you'll be lost to the dark side forever...and Ash's comments often sound very childish. At other times her words sound like those of a bully, suggesting that you're chosing "cluelessness" if you don't embrace KS and do the work and accept the truths she presents. But like any cult they build on some really wonderful fundamental ideas. I do like the basic premise that everything we see in others is a reflection of what is within us. The emphasis on personal responsibility and the importance of unlearning victimhood is wonderful. But...as a whole...no thanks.

I guess I just wanted to say, please don't throw the baby out with the bathwater where indigos are concerned. Let the flags go up, but don't dismiss that there may be something shifting in terms of human evolution. We can give our children choices without overindulging. I was a self-policing kid. I was harder on myself than anyone else could have been on me. Rigid restrictive parenting would have killed me. That part of me who knew who I was and what I could do would have been smothered and I think I would have killed myself before I'd made it out of high school. It was hard enough to feel at home here, the way I am, as it was.

Also, for the record, I am a well-adjusted adult. I don't feel special or entitled. I am able to cope with this world, have my own business...and I believe the kids who are being raised to believe they are somehow more special than non-indigo children, if they *are* indigo will be just fine. They'll understand they aren't, and have great compassion for all people -- it's the parents who are in for a crushing blow. Their kids will see them for who they are, will love them all the same, but they *will* call their parents on their "stuff" and they won't be influenced by, or adopt the insecurities and ego issues of, their parents. That's how these kids are different, the show up knowing who they are and what they believe and they won't compromise that for anything. Any parent who wants to get an ego-boost by association is going to be in for a rude awakening.

Also, regarding drug use etc...by older indigos, in their earlier years -- it's very common. They often feel very alone and self-medicate. That and illness send emerging indigos down to their "bottom". The older indigos didn't show up hardwired like the younger generations and they often really struggle for awhile before they are willing and able to recognize and accept who and how they are. I like to think of it as "some assembly required" for the older indigos.

Well, I wanted to share my story. I dislike labels as much as the rest of you. Those who hold them up proudly will learn the lesson. I didn't see the movie because I really believe that kind of thing comes from ego as well. I actually rented it but couldn't watch it. The blurb on the back just felt...icky.

Glad to have found this forum...I look forward to digging around. :)

E.

Quote
barabara

Yes, it is possible to test for high intelligence and other traits.

Indigo proponents don't generally claim a high IQ for the children. This is because it could be measured.

Of course, if an Indigo child's IQ were measured, their fans would say their particular hyperspiritual brand of intelligence cannot be measured using current mainstream methods (very convenient.)
Love
Kath

It appears based upon their subjective accounts that the "Indigo" thing is a belief system and not anything objective or factual.

The danger I feel is in people pidgeoholing themselves, 'I am an indigo.' Then either before of after that they take on the whole package- energies, highly sensitive person etc.

They could get so much more from some decent counselling or psychotherapy without having to buy into a whole belief system or lifestyle.

Each to his own though I suppose!
Love
Kath

I always disagreed with the assumption that "different" meant "pathological".

Some kids, (and adults), are more highly active than others.
Some like to stay up late at night, and some are more sensitive.
Maybe they drive their parents crazy, but are themselves emotionally healthy.
Indigos or not, does that mean they're sick, and in need of therapy?
I think not always.

Hi again,

A few more thoughts I wanted to share as I've been thinking about this.

First, please keep in mind that the people who go public and create websites are mostly the people who are approaching the indigo thing from a place of ego. Note how many of them are created by people who are gettiing some kind of ego fix by association with (in most cases) their indigo children. I really don't even like the word indigo at this point because I feel these individuals have so distorted it.

I understand you're upset about these flag-waving "indigo" websites. You don't hear from the people who understand this for what it is, because they don't need you to know about it. It's like when I travel. I have learned to [i:8086f4afa2]get out[/i:8086f4afa2] of the city I fly into ASAP. Cities are cities everywhere. You don't get a true feel for a people until you get out of the polluted city and into the rural areas. It's the same with this and anything else really. Likewise, with every new idea there are going to be the chattering welcome wagon, people who are deeply invested in that thing they're representing for whatever reason. The people who would truly make good politicians don't want to *be* politicians and it's the same with this. The flag bearers have an agenda. And if we judge a group based on the scouts who march out full of pride, and [i:8086f4afa2]full of themselves[/i:8086f4afa2], we are going to miss some of the gems.

We have all experienced finding something that resonates deeply within us and taking our passion and excitement for it over the top. Those who aren't invested in ego are probably guilty of that -- like new arrivals to a place who in their passion for it open up a tourist center.

Any true indigo will be the first to tell you that they aren't superheros. They are people with unique strengths. We're the person you'd turn to if you wanted an honest answer. There may be a better choice in terms of a person to seek out if you're looking for cut-and-dried commiseration, or someone to make you laugh until you cry. And there is a place for that. Many times I would have liked to be that person but I am who I am. We are hard-wired to challenge, to be unflinchingly honest and courageous. There [i:8086f4afa2]are[/i:8086f4afa2] things, [i:8086f4afa2]many things[/i:8086f4afa2] we don't do well. [b:8086f4afa2]We aren't special, we are specialized[/b:8086f4afa2], just as most -- all? -- people are specialized...just as some people are good with numbers and rules and laws, can teach us how to organize our lives, others are nurturers...

The things people with [b:8086f4afa2]my[/b:8086f4afa2] strengths (I'm going to phrase it that way from now on, rather than using *that* term) understand is that when building your personal belief system, you don't have to accept or reject everything you find as a package deal, nor do you need to reject it in its entirety. It's more complex than that. There is, as I said before, wisdom to be found everywhere, under some of the most outwardly offensive rocks there are gems. I was sick for a few years with mercury poisoning and doctors were no help. I needed to do some detox and it turned out the Scientologists were the only people who had a protocol for it. I had to go to one of their headquarters to buy the book, and I did it myself at the local YMCA and it was a wonderful thing. I did taste medications I hadn't taken for years coming out of my body. I felt *much* better. Does this mean I endorse Scientology? No. I think they are one of the most harmful cults in the country today. I love their emphasis on toxins, as I've been there and I know what it does to a person, I love their emphasis on exploring natural remedies first -- do they take it too far? Yes. Do they likely use their purification as a means manipulation, giving them a natural high and causing them to associate that with the material they're given to read while they sweat? Yes. Is the auditing, the fiction they adopt to explain the history of the earty, crrrrrrrrrrazy? Is their group a magnet for, and a validator of, people with personality disorders? Yes, yes, yes. Do I want them to continue to thrive because I agree with some of their ideas? No.

Fortunately the nature of...nature...is that things that are distorted eventually destroy themselves. It doesn't mean that some of their raw materials shouldn't be salvaged.

Although it really can annoy me on a human level that people distort it to feed their egos, everyone is learning and their perceptions and reactions are part of that growth, so for the most part, I see it as "all good". Their choices, and the black-and-white-cynic's equal and opposite reaction [i:8086f4afa2]to them [/i:8086f4afa2]create balance. What I think humanity is in the process of learning is that what's going on outside of our Self has absolutely nothing to do with the individual "Me." And the choice to perceive that it does causes us to get very upset about and fearful of the choices other people make. It's the difference between choosing a partner, being at one end and the other of a see-saw (creating balance) or being an individual, unaffected by the choices of others and standing at that point right in the middle. I think humanity is moving toward the middle. Right now we are, for the most part, so preoccupied with the external and so identify with that us/them dynamic (deeply investing in the idea that we don't have free will and others are responsible for what happens to us) that we really believe that if we just step out of the game and write our own scripts and trust everyone else to write theirs, the world as we know it will end. In a sense, that's exactly what happens, which is why we stick with what we know. Abusers continue to compulsively take power away from others, love others too little, and the abused continue to compulsively surrender their power, love themselves too little. When we are at either end, we actually need the people at the other extreme in order to maintain stasis.

It's scary to move from a pattern of compensation to one of standing alone, but I think that's the lesson "people with my strengths" are able to offer the world. [i:8086f4afa2]It's when you are able to stand in the center of the see-saw that you are able to take what serves you, what resonates with you, from whatever crosses your path, rather than judging entire systems to be good or bad and either adopting or rejecting them in full, outright. [/i:8086f4afa2] That's my belief and I think that's the gift I, and "other people with my strengths, have to offer.

Do we have different genetics? Who cares. We are how we are. And anyone who wants to map it out and count DNA and measure IQ's in hopes of measuring worth has, at least momentarily, lost the plot. My dad was the person who decided whether IQ tests would be administered in our school system and he wouldn't allow them, and I admire him greatly for that. He didn't want kids comparing their IQs and applying that number to their self-worth.

Anyone really committted to personal growth won't judge any book by its cover. I do what I can to live my principles. I don't support Scientology front groups (Earthlink for example) and I don't go to or rent films featuring Scientologists but I accept that although my choices can affect change, ultimately I'm only responsible for myself. I can finally feel compassion for everyone regardless of the choices they make, and no longer feel the fear that anyone's choices can affect me in any fundamental way unless I allow it.

So when I see people focusing in on the nutjobs rather than the message, and saying things to the effect of "They think they're so special." I can only think that that individual zeroes in on [i:8086f4afa2]that[/i:8086f4afa2] and is annoyed by it, because they don't see that they are special too. Once you understand your own worth and find that center, you can appreciate it in others without feeling resentful and you can hear the message and ignore what amounts to just "other people's stuff" getting in the way. Life gets so much easier after that.

:) E.

Hi Kath!

I guess I have a hard time understanding why anyone would view the indigo thing as a belief system. To me, as I said in my previous post, I see indigos as being specialized in the same way everyone is specialized in something. I'm not able say that someone whose strength is record-keeping and organization is how they are as a result of a belief system. It's just how they are.

I think perhaps the idea that "indigos are here to save the world" might be what you're referring to in terms of the belief system. I've never met another indigo who believes personally that they're here to save the world. Those who seek publicity might, but they are the minority. Most of us are just happy to know that we're not alone.

When you find yourself doing things naturally (taking on authority) that makes other peoples' mouth drop in horror, you don't feel like something special. You feel very alone. You are compelled to be who you are and believe in yourself, but the social norms are powerful and even we have days when we would just like to sit down with someone who thinks and perceives things as we do. I am so happy for the younger generations that they have each other, and happy for myself for the same reason. When you are parents with kids, or single moms with kids, you have a "tribe". When you are forty and single and have no desire to marry or have kids and you speak your mind and stand up for others and what you believe in without blinking, and you would take a bullet on principle, you don't have a tribe. To see these courageous kids showing up I feel like less of a "freak of nature" on those bad days.

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The danger I feel is in people pidgeoholing themselves, 'I am an indigo.' Then either before of after that they take on the whole package- energies, highly sensitive person etc

And that's up to that person to decide if they want to take that on, or even care if there are some who will attach judgement to that. If I'm around someone who I know gets it who I've discussed it with before, I'll use the word, but generally I find there is very little point in talking about it at all. "Energies, highly sensitive" -- the whole list....it does apply to me. I slid down the wall to the floor when I read that list for the first time. It blew my mind. I can only say it must be how adopted children feel when they meet their birth mother for the first time. I felt understood for the first time in my life.

In some ways I believe I have something valuable to offer the world. I'm also very bad with organization, with record-keeping, I'm almost incapable of multi-tasking. I do a lot of things badly, and I'm working on those things. I own it all. But that doesn't mean I'm ashamed to use the term indigo, unless I'm talking to someone who I know has attached that which they've read that bothers them to the term. And if someone [i:3a051ae2de]does[/i:3a051ae2de] that, I know that doesn't have anything to do with me. But I don't have any more of a desire to introduce myself to someone as an indigo as someone would to be to introduce themselves as someone who'd really great at bookkeeping.

:) E.